Petition Against The 'Supra' Badge

twntrbo03' said:

LOL I think you need to go get your eyes checked!

People want this car to be something it's not soooo bad that they are losing their vision. Denial is the fist step i suppose...

In all honesty I think this car will be great, but I am not sure the reliability is going to be there. If anything, just wait 3 or 4 years and you'll be able to pick one of these up for dirt cheap... just look at the current BMW market and how quickly they plunge in price. When it comes to the love/hate relationship with this car... I think most people have an issue with the overwhelming presence of BMW in a TOYOTA Supra. I mean, even down to the door chime is BMW. I'm a little bummed that there isn't more of a visual Toyota influence in this car and will just feel like sitting in another Beemer with a Toyota skin. Regardless, I'm excited there is another sports car coming from Toyota, but they should have called it something else

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I'm sure it won't feel like sitting in a bike

A11b0ost said:

Why would there be a official source degrading any information regarding a car that they are trying to sell?

The end result is a stock tune lower than the BMW Z4, and the reason is obvious. There is articles out there mentioning that Toyota had requested for a lower tune due to reliability issues but I am not about to waste my time to research for you.

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Lol you're a funny guy. First you discredit the possibility of a source regarding an intentional detuned engine. Then, in the next sentence you say, "There is articles out there mentioning that Toyota had requested for a lower tune due to reliability issues but I am not about to waste my time to research for you."

Ben Haushalter: So when we developed the car, we weren't necessarily putting both vehicles together, from a development standpoint. We developed the [Supra] from a holistic perspective, so that the engine is balanced to the chassis, and vice versa. We feel right now that the 335 [horsepower] and 365 pound-feet of torque is quite good for what the car is from a power-to-weight ratio, from 0-60 acceleration standpoint. It's very balanced. It's a sports car methodology that we share with 86. The engine and chassis are in harmony with each other, and that development methodology is shared by the same Chief Engineer [Tetsuya Tada] between both cars.

John Beltz Snyder: Was it purposefully detuned to fit better with the —

BH: To fit better. It's not purposefully detuned. 335 is kind of the sweet spot right now with how the car handles.

https://www.autoblog.com/2019/01/15/2020-toyota-supra-striking-a-balance-on-power-and-weight/

A11b0ost said:

There is articles out there mentioning that Toyota had requested for a lower tune due to reliability issues but I am not about to waste my time to research for you.

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Oh you mean exactly what Toyota did with the MKIV (and what just about every Japanese car maker does) before shipping them out of the factory??? You think cars like the MKIV, GTR, etc... are designed to perform at their peak off the assembly line?? Lol! They typically overbuild the drivetrains (especially turbo cars which are more detonation prone) and test them beyond their intended ratings. Then, they dial back the tune and can confidently sell a product to a consumer knowing that even in a case where the car overboosts at twice the power rating, runs too rich or too lean, etc... it won’t grenade. Yes....this was done on the B58 as well. Tada didn’t test the B58 to 700hp for shits and giggles, he could care less about Johnny Racer but more about reliability. For us though, we only see the ability to make more power; easier, cheaper, and SAFER!

A11b0ost said:

No.

I really can't find a written article supporting that the Supra being detuned "due to reliability issues", or anything written. Maybe it's in a video but their sources are probably not posted and I'm not about to watch of those again lol.

Where have you seen 700whp or 700hp test results?



There is a difference between "official source of a Toyota rep" and the basic credible source.

You wouldn't catch a Toyota rep disclosing exactly how much BMW the Supra really was and taint their loyal Toyota clients, but you have credible articles showing BMW stampings on just about anything all around the car.

But still can't find where I had informed myself of this so there's that.

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So first...you're "not wasting your time to do the research" for us: meaning you haven't done any research hence no claim cuz "you haven't wasted the time to do so"

Second...this car being tested to 700HP?!...
: if you were a member for greater than a week you would have known when this was discussed on this forum with someone who worked on the project...it was more than a week ago I can assure you but, like you..."we don't have the time to do the research for you"

Ask yourself! When the 2J first came out...did anyone from Toyota corporate say "HEY GUYS!!!...guess what?!...we tested this motor to 1000-HP"...????
Outside of Toyota...when the GTR came out, did anyone from Nissan say anything similar about the VQ38?!
Of course not! It was left to the aftermarket and it was quickly figured out! Quit whining about a car you've yet to drive and experience, do us a favor, and give your claims and accusations a rest!...or at least "waste some time and...do some research for us"...we'll listen!...just don't bring some nonsense from what youve seen on some fanboy blog and some article where you've read so far in between the lines, you could use the info to floss claims to hopefully validate an partially thought out argument!

This is the only thing I could find. Also, very tempting.
https://arsenalmotorsports.com/products/bmw-b58-s-1000.html

Goose said:

This is the only thing I could find. Also, very tempting.
https://arsenalmotorsports.com/products/bmw-b58-s-1000.html

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Now imagine what will happen once Japan gets its hands on the motor!

Well if the RC or LC or LS or RF or whatever is more a Supra than this one, then by all means, go buy one. why are you crying here? We all like the BMW Supra here, what's your issue? You want to force us to like what you like? Enjoy your fat Lexus, and when you get your 400hp car smoked by a 335hp BMW Supra go ahead and mod your car, then line up against a stock bottom end 650whp BMW Supra (since we've already seen that the engine is capable of that so far) and after he walks you, go ahead and ask for a rematch, up the boost, and then watch him leaving you in tyre smoke as your engine starts shitting pistons and you move slowly in a cloud of oil smoke. Enjoy your "Toyota" Supra tat needs a new engine now, which probably costs half the price of the BMW Supra.

A bit of off topic here, but, I just hate how Chevy and Honda made these two cars identical, it's like they have no imagination whatsoever:

A11b0ost said:

There is a difference between "official source of a Toyota rep" and the basic credible source....

But still can't find where I had informed myself of this so there's that.

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Well then the burden of proof rests on your shoulders. As much as I love to read different opinions as to where Toyota failed with this car, I like to see the info for the ones claiming basic credible source. Especially when it entails reliability concerns.

Death666wish_ said:

Well if the RC or LC or LS or RF or whatever is more a Supra than this one, then by all means, go buy one. why are you crying here? We all like the BMW Supra here, what's your issue? You want to force us to like what you like? Enjoy your fat Lexus, and when you get your 400hp car smoked by a 335hp BMW Supra go ahead and mod your car, then line up against a stock bottom end 650whp BMW Supra (since we've already seen that the engine is capable of that so far) and after he walks you, go ahead and ask for a rematch, up the boost, and then watch him leaving you in tyre smoke as your engine starts shitting pistons and you move slowly in a cloud of oil smoke. Enjoy your "Toyota" Supra tat needs a new engine now, which probably costs half the price of the BMW Supra.

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Agreed! I recently saw a Motor Trend head to head between the 86 and a Miata...both had similar track times! For shits and giggles, they brought in the mighty Hellcat! Ofc it's a beast on the drag strip, but it got wrecked by an 86 on the track by 10 seconds and change lol

Supra21 said:

Now imagine what will happen once Japan gets its hands on the motor!

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One of the guys at my shop says that this motor and trans are going to be very stout, and have the potential to be much higher than the stock specs. Take with a grain of salt, but we'll see once she comes out.

Death666wish_ said:

A bit of off topic here, but, I just hate how Chevy and Honda made these two cars identical, it's like they have no imagination whatsoever:

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NSX looks better in orange

A11b0ost said:

Would have been BMW's floor mounted style, instead of being mounted at the firewall (like a Toyota).

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There are many many reasons to not like the car, but this is actually just hunting for reasons to hate the car

justbake said:

There are many many reasons to not like the car, but this is actually just hunting for reasons to hate the car

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Lol what I've been trying to get at this whole time...ppl just need to relax haha
What's next?! Might as well complain as to whether the gas tank is on the driver or passenger side!

Supra21 said:

Lol what I've been trying to get at this whole time...ppl just need to relax haha
What's next?! Might as well complain as to whether the gas tank is on the driver or passenger side!

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Haha I can’t wait for the hater paradox of it being on opposite side of the other Supras but also on the opposite side as other BMW’s