šŸ‘£ Official: Toyota Announces Manual Transmission Supra!

Only interested if it comes in manual?


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KahnBB6

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Adding the option of a manual transmission to the Supra(vs. ZF8HP AT) would make it ... well, slower, but also more engaging for the purists. :drive:
I'm totally okay with that. It's still not going to be slow, just not quite as fast as it is with the ZF auto. Although modifying it to put out another 100 horsepower or much more would cure that issue quickly.
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I'm totally okay with that. It's still not going to be slow, just not quite as fast as it is with the ZF auto. Although modifying it to put out another 100 horsepower or much more would cure that issue quickly.
I agree! Itā€™s not always about the power. The feel and the connection between the car and the driver is the most important aspect of a true driverā€™s car; and that is what a manual transmission car exactly provides.
 
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I really do hope they add a manual option/version for the Supra. Does it need it? Impossible to tell until I drive one, and that assessment would be mostly subjective. For instance: I wouldn't want my Miata without a manual, but mostly don't miss it in my VW GTI with DSG.
 

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I really do hope they add a manual option/version for the Supra. Does it need it? Impossible to tell until I drive one, and that assessment would be mostly subjective. For instance: I wouldn't want my Miata without a manual, but mostly don't miss it in my VW GTI with DSG.
Really depends on the driver, as well as market feedback. Best is give it more options. Aside from the ZF8HP AT(which has already proven itself as a good transmission), offer a manual, and DSG. Say, a customer wants the Supra in manual badly. But since it is currently available with an automatic only, it would shy away that potential customer. Unless the customer will sacrifice the driving experience and get the automatic instead.
 
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KahnBB6

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Manual transmissions only have so many years left in them as interfaces that even *can* be offered regardless of customer take rates. So to not offer one for this sportscar would be a truly bad missed opportunity that can never be revisited eventually.

Aston Martin is holding out, BMW's M2 and M3/4 are holding out as is Honda (one assumes), Mazda (for the Miata at least) and Porsche for select Cayman and 911 models. Maybe the big three muscle cars will also. But eventually it will not be possible to offer one as we are accustomed to them in pure gas cars or even in mild hybrid gas-electric performance cars (Honda's CR-Z was hybrid but could be had in a 6-speed manual).

Technically it is possible to offer a manual transmission vehicle once we're eventually into a full electric era... but at that point it will be paying for extra complexity and less efficiency just to continue offering the super niche yet desirable among enthusiasts option that would, at that point, also operate in a slightly different way than manual combustion vehicles do. Also you wouldn't need more than 2... *maybe* 3 gears maximum and they would all be VERY long gears. Right now the same is accomplished in EV's with single speed reduction gear drivelines. It's never going to be the same sensation as driving a manual gas NA or gas-turbo driver's car.

But right now that isn't the case. We're not in that era just yet. We've still got a good handful of more years before that point of no return threshold is crossed from a purely technical perspective. At least as long as the MKV Supra generation is around.

The MKV deserves a good manual gearbox while such an option is still possible to offer within the scope of current regulations. It also finally deserved an automatic as good as the ZF8.
 
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Captain_Kirk

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not surprising, probably due to how Toyota & Subaru determined production ratios from the factory since they know the folks who buy Subies are on average more likely to be bigger enthusiasts than a Toyota fanboy and throw in the fact that historically they build & sell more 86 than BRZ and there you go.. (not to mention special edition BRZ tS which is MT only). Either way, everyone is cherry picking what they want to report. The only meaningful stats would be worldwide sales of the 86 & BRZ broken down by AT vs MT per year.. Percentage isn't a great story considering cars like the CTR, S2K, Veloster N, etc are all stick.
 

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Stressing out the Supraā€™s need for a manual

I 100% agree with him about how fun the 86 is. I've had seat time in a 6-speed M/T version and a 6-speed auto version. Hands down the 6MT was my choice. I love the way it drives and it IS fun to drive at the power level it's at and with its 2700lb (thereabouts) curb weight.

Is it actually better than a Supra MKV? Hmm... with 500ft-lbs of torque and 380ish hp at the crank... it's quite a different car altogether and its chassis and driveline can handle so much more than the 86 chassis and driveline can.

However at the end of the day I'd still buy a manual 86 over an auto Supra MKV if there is no manual option in the Supra. Going forward there will be no shortage of non-manual performance cars but I'd absolutely pass over any automatic model in favor of evaluating what manual model options are currently available.

Which is currently a shame because as fun as a super lightweight manual RWD coupe can be it's an entirely different ball game when you have a superior chassis and far more powerful and massively torquey engine hooked up to a manual transmission. The smiles never end.

I'd enjoy my 3600lb turbo 2JZ coupe much less if it had an automatic. Big power is still power but I understand the EE guy's feeling that the low powered scrappy manual Toyota is more fun to him than the wholly superior powerful automatic sportscar Toyota. To each their own but I'm personally of the same mind on this.

My take is that the 86 is a great and fun car that nonetheless clearly isn't *better* than the Supra but rather that it's offering the right kind of transmission that the Supra currently doesn't and for which there is no substitute no matter how good the ZF8 is (and that IS probably the best conventional automatic made today) :)
 

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So the Supra is worse because it doesn't have a stick? Give me the Supra any day. Thank you and bye bye.
Not that itā€™s worse because it currently doesnā€™t have a manual. Itā€™s just that...the fun never ends when Toyota offers the manual in the Supra. Just give it as an option. Thereā€™s no doubt that the 8-speed automatic is a fantastic transmission; but at the end of the day, thereā€™s nothing that can replace the fun and joy of driving a sports car with manual transmission, especially on winding roads. Driving the automatic Supra definitely will be fun; but itā€™s way too comfortable. Those who love to drive, especially purists, love to work their way out. The more challenging the drive, the more engaging and rewarding the experience will be; and only a manual transmission equipped car can provide this level of fun.
 

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Not that itā€™s worse because it currently doesnā€™t have a manual. Itā€™s just that...the fun never ends when Toyota offers the manual in the Supra. Just give it as an option. Thereā€™s no doubt that the 8-speed automatic is a fantastic transmission; but at the end of the day, thereā€™s nothing that can replace the fun and joy of driving a sports car with manual transmission, especially on winding roads. Driving the automatic Supra definitely will be fun; but itā€™s way too comfortable. Those who love to drive, especially purists, love to work their way out. The more challenging the drive, the more engaging and rewarding the experience will be; and only a manual transmission equipped car can provide this level of fun.
^^ I couldn't have said it better. Everything above.
 

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https://paultan.org/2019/05/24/try-...t-if-manual-still-wanted-we-could-do-it-tada/

Try the A90 Toyota Supraā€™s auto with an open mind; but if manual still wanted, we could do it ā€“ Tada

The A90 Toyota Supra chief engineer, Tetsuya Tada, claims that he has been asked this question 100 million times across the world. Now, he may be exaggerating (just slightly, just rounding it up), but we can so imagine this. Tada san is surely bored of ā€œthe manual questionā€ by now but heā€™s professional, and he repeats it again here.

At the European launch of the new Supra, Tada told DriveTribe that he hasnā€™t ruled out a manual gearbox for the reborn sports car, and that a stick shift has been tested. Assistant CE Masayuki Kai has gone on record before to say that a ā€œthe hardware is readyā€ for the A90.

ā€œIā€™ve been asked this 100 million times across the world. There is a website that polls what you want in new Supra, and manual transmission is always high on the list. I get a notification when people vote for it!ā€ Tada said. ā€œWeā€™ve considered it and things have been tested,ā€ he added.

Weā€™re sure that the good man behind the Supra and 86 knows the joys of rowing your own gears in a sports car, but heā€™s urging fans to try out the ZF eight-speed automatic in the A90 before dismissing it. ā€œPeople should give the automatic gearbox a try. But come to it with an open mind. If having driven it people still want a manual, then of course as with normal sports cars thereā€™ll be yearly updates ā€“ and we could introduce it,ā€ he said.

So, first try the auto Supra with an open mind (the ZF eight-speeder is great in BMWs, best in the premium class), but if youā€™re still not satisfied after that, join the manual chorus, and Toyota might just oblige.
 

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I'm pleased to hear Tetsuya Tada's newest comments on this topic. A tiny bit more has been revealed as to the intent with this car and there seems to be less reticence to introduce a series production manual.

It feels like pulling teeth :D

I've got a very open mind about the ZF8. I have no doubt that it really is as good as has been described by both Tada himself and numerous reviewers. But it's still not a manual transmission and there will still only be so many production years within which a manual transmission would be offered anyway.

Brand new manual performance cars will not be produced indefinitely. Automatic or any form of non-three-pedal-and-hand-operated-gear-lever car *will* be produced into the future as long as cars exist.

It should be introduced and for both the GR and GRMN of this series Supra, not just the top-spec car that will be even more marked up than the base Supra.
 

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Hereā€™s my take on manual vs. automatic transmission:

In an automatic transmission equipped car, most of the time, I feel very comfortable driving it. Yes, itā€™s fun cruising on a straight line, especially on highways. Cornering is also great. I could do a lot of stuff while driving the car like eating, drinking, using my smartphone to call, text, play games, etc. The transmission does its job so I have a lot of other things to do. I can also rest my left food all day, all night. Itā€™s definitely better to drive an automatic especially when youā€™re stuck in traffic. You feel a lot more relaxed because the transmission already does the job for you. If you want more driver engagement, then acrivate the paddle shifters / tiptronic feature for more fun, to have more conteol on the gearing; but still not as precise and accurate as a manual.

In a manual transmission equipped car, I am totally focused on the driving. I have to be careful with my gearing, feel the clutch so that I wonā€™t stall. Yes, itā€™s a challenge to drive a manual. You have to work your way out. Once youā€™ve learned the basics and have the right foundation of driving a manual, itā€™ll be fun! It took me a while to learn how to drive a manual; but not with automatic. Nowadays, a lot of people, perhaps the majority, donā€™t know how to drive the manual car; and they donā€™t plan to learn driving it. It would also be more safe and secure to drive a manual since a lot of carnappers donā€™t know how to drive stick shift. It would be a challenging task for them to steal your car. Not so easy on their part. You can drive an automatic car if you know how to drive a manual, but you canā€™t drive a manual if you only know how to drive an automatic. Itā€™s also cheaper to maintain manual transmission. Itā€™s simple, less technology, which also means less complexity. When I drive a manual, I can hardly do stuff what I can do when driving an automatic like eating, drinking, using my smartphone, etc. My hands and feet are all over the steering wheel, gear shifter, and pedals. I just enjoy every moment driving a manual car. Driving a manual, at the end of the day, is more tiring than driving an automatic, but truly more rewarding as well. Itā€™s like you have to put a lot of work and effort just to get from Point A to Point B; challenge accepted.
Nothing spells control better than a manual transmission. In fact, itā€™s one of the reasons why a lot of people refuse to shift to automatic. Itā€™s something every manual driver knowsā€“and feels. Thereā€™s something about driving it that makes you more in-tune with your vehicle. Doing upshifts and downshifts while driving on narrow and curvy roads can be exhilarating, especially if you pound on the accelerator.

Conclusion:
Driving a manual is like playing an instrument yourselfā€”it requires skill, countless practices, and focus to play it correctly. On the other hand, driving an automatic is like researching for something, like school stuff, on the internet. The level of effort on your part is minimal. The computer is already doing majority of the work for you. Compared to the old days when you wanted to do research, you didnā€™t have the technology to help you out. Your main source is to go to the library and find books, encyclopedia, and stuff manually until you find what youā€™re looking for. Step-by-step; just like driving a manual.

And while you and many other drivers have your own preferences, neither one is wrong or better than the otherā€“it all boils down to personal taste. The most important thing here is that it meets your needs(and wants too), because in the end, itā€™s really about experiencing your car at its best and most enjoyable on the road.
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