👣 Official: Toyota Announces Manual Transmission Supra!

Only interested if it comes in manual?


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AsupramkvC

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I think manual is a must for the new Supra. It will be the last breed of a manual Supra. After 2020, most cars will already be automatic and focus will be towards electrification. There’s no better time to experience a thrilling manual transmission sports car. Now is the time.
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I think manual is a must for the new Supra. It will be the last breed of a manual Supra. After 2020, most cars will already be automatic and focus will be towards electrification. There’s no better time to experience a thrilling manual transmission sports car. Now is the time.
Toyota's feelings on "if there is enough buyer demand for a manual Supra" aside.... THIS ^^

It should be offered because it is already within the window of years remaining that *allow* it to be offered at all.

With this iconic car of theirs which has fans worldwide a 3.0L turbo manual variant *should* be offered. While it still can be. And those 2.0L turbo variants should have a manual as well because... c'mon... well over 3,000lbs and only 197hp or 252hp and just the choice of an automatic??

The option should be offered NOW while it still can be across the range. We have a chorus of Supra fans worldwide asking for a manual Supra 3.0L. It's not as if this is a case of a total of twenty Camry fans worldwide clamoring for a manual Camry.
 
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Turbro

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I'd be in line today if there were a manual. Otherwise there are better options for me. I'm not near a racetrack, I want something fun to drive on the back roads on my way to work.
So much this. I have a race track an hour away but I drive mountain back roads more with the car clubs. More of an enthusiast than a track time racer.

Timing wise it would work so well for me to be able to pick up a manual. If developed in 2 or so years. I’ll have 3 other cars paid off in the next 12-18 months. Leaving me open to grab a manual Supra if they announce it for 2021 to put in the garage with my 94 TT 6 speed.
 

AsupramkvC

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Toyota's feelings on "if there is enough buyer demand for a manual Supra" aside.... THIS ^^

It should be offered because it is already within the window of years remaining that *allow* it to be offered at all.

With this iconic car of theirs which has fans worldwide a 3.0L turbo manual variant *should* be offered. While it still can be. And those 2.0L turbo variants should have a manual as well because... c'mon... well over 3,000lbs and only 197hp or 252hp and just the choice of an automatic??

The option should be offered NOW while it still can be across the range. We have a chorus of Supra fans worldwide asking for a manual Supra 3.0L. It's not as if this is a case of a total of twenty Camry fans worldwide clamoring for a manual Camry.
As of this time, Toyota just kind of gives us excuses or reasons to believe....if there’s enough demand. Do they really care about the demand? Are they doing something about the demand? Are they building it? Seems like they’re not in the mood now to talk about the 3.0-liter I6 manual Supra. They’re currently focused on the Supra with ZF8 HP auto. I also understand that it’s also a challenge for Toyota to team up with BMW on this project. Unlike the 86/BRZ project, Toyota did everything they wanted. Both manufacturers are Japanese, and Toyota owns a portion of Subaru. With BMW, it’s a totally different story. I know Toyota cares about enthusiasts. They want to make things happen as soon as possible; but they also want to make sure that if they do, it will pass their standards, so as not to have lots of problems or recalls in the long run. The Supra/Z4 is not really about money making; but about saving sports cars as well as exhibiting their passion and determination in building better driver’s car, in which a manual is what true enthusiasts have come to expect. With the possibility of a manual(for which reviewers have also mentioned that the Supra needs it for the feel of the driver and establish connection with the car), Toyota will, for sure earn more respect and loyalty for listening to their fanbase. Not only that, but Toyota will also be able to cement the Supra’s legacy as a legendary driver’s car.

*By being able to offer a manual Supra in 3.0-liter I6(hope BMW Z4 won’t follow suit if Toyota does), this will be Toyota’s chance to differentiate the Supra even more from the Z4. If Toyota comes up with a 2.0-liter I4 manual, people will say it’s a BMW; since BMW started offering it. Toyota just copied the same formula. They have to offer something distinctively Toyota and Supra only; which is a 3.0-liter I6 manual. That’s the time people will stop saying that the Supra is a BMW. Toyota just needs to deliver; that’s it.
 
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s219

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I have owned three BMW's with the ZF 8-speed automatic and consider it to be among the best automatics in the industry, but I really prefer manual transmissions in sports cars because it's a lot more interesting and fun to drive the car. You can have fun at low speeds and at part throttle in ways that aren't possible with an automatic.

I am a bit baffled why Toyota didn't include a manual option at launch (I am also sad about it, since it crosses the Supra off my list for now). I see no technical reason preventing it, as BMW ships manual transmissions with several current models sporting the turbo inline six, including M-cars with more power and torque than the Supra. The closest example would be an M2 Competition or M4. So it's available in the parts bin that the Supra pulls from. I suspect this was either a product planning or marketing decision, or based on some considerations like cost or an agreement with BMW. It certainly was not a technical issue.

I can understand why BMW is not offering a manual in the Z4 in the USA, as it has a different audience and the take rate for manual transmission was very low in the previous generation Z4 here in the USA. Despite the new Z4 being a much more competent sports car than before, it's still more of a GT and appeals to a different type of crowd than the Supra.
 

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I would say get the Auto and don't wait if it's not a deal breaker. There is a very slim-to-non chance of us getting a manual on the big boy B58 engine. A few years down the road I can see a manual trans swap kit happening by the time MKV owners start to run out of warranty. I realize some can't do this due to regulations and/or capability (It won't be cheap either) but that's the best chance the MKV will have of getting a MT.
 
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Bryster

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I have owned three BMW's with the ZF 8-speed automatic and consider it to be among the best automatics in the industry, but I really prefer manual transmissions in sports cars because it's a lot more interesting and fun to drive the car. You can have fun at low speeds and at part throttle in ways that aren't possible with an automatic.

I am a bit baffled why Toyota didn't include a manual option at launch (I am also sad about it, since it crosses the Supra off my list for now). I see no technical reason preventing it, as BMW ships manual transmissions with several current models sporting the turbo inline six, including M-cars with more power and torque than the Supra. The closest example would be an M2 Competition or M4. So it's available in the parts bin that the Supra pulls from. I suspect this was either a product planning or marketing decision, or based on some considerations like cost or an agreement with BMW. It certainly was not a technical issue.

I can understand why BMW is not offering a manual in the Z4 in the USA, as it has a different audience and the take rate for manual transmission was very low in the previous generation Z4 here in the USA. Despite the new Z4 being a much more competent sports car than before, it's still more of a GT and appeals to a different type of crowd than the Supra.
Tada wasn't pleased with any of the BMW MTs
 

s219

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Tada wasn't pleased with any of the BMW MTs
Seems like a trivial reason to completely avoid manual altogether. BMW manuals are not best in class in terms of feel (ie, Honda S2000) but they are extremely reliable and you rarely hear a reviewer make any complaints. I can see how a Honda engineer might make this statement with a straight face, but Toyota doesn't have the same heritage with manual transmissions, and the Supra is already coming from a diverse collaboration. I absolutely think a 6MT from one of the M cars could only enhance the Supra.

The other Supra enhancement could be a DCT from the M parts bin. Those are best in class (supercar levels of good). As good as the ZF 8-speed is, choosing that over the DCT for a serious sports car also speaks to some non-technical decisions at play.
 

HRTROB

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Tada wasn't pleased with any of the BMW MTs
He also said the Supra’s center of gravity is lower than the 86.

I call BS
 

s219

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He also said the Supra’s center of gravity is lower than the 86.

I call BS
You know, a few other things he said seemed to get lost in translation or were too optimistically received (which is not out of the question with Youtubers in attendance -- most don't have engineering chops and I suspect many of them were starry-eyed at being invited to the event). He talked at length about the various fake vents being usable, and I even saw video of that. You'd come away with the impression that the fake covers are minor "plugs". However, other than the front radiator intakes, none of the existing fake vents would really be practical to use, at least not without extensive modification (as in, race cars or major modding that requires body work, custom fab, and repainting).

For example, the vents on the top of the hood are right over the top of the stamped hood framing on the inside of the hood. You would have to compromise the hood structure to open those up for airflow. Plus, there is a whole lot of important stuff under those vents right now, so you're not going to be running ducts or flowing air through them without removing parts from the engine bay. The vents on the door have no flow path to anything. The vents next to the headlights are in a similar situation. Saying these vents could be used is like saying I can put a vent anywhere on any car by cutting a hole and making custom structure and ducting to make it work, and also sacrificing whatever is currently under the sheetmetal in that location. In other words, the cosmetic fake vents on the Supra aren't really any help. They might be in places we'd want vents, but you could do that with a sticker.... So to me these are cosmetic for styling.

I saw similar comments about the strut tower bracing, or rather, lack of. Tada said the Supra didn't need the bracing but they put the mounts there for future use by the aftermarket. The real reason the mounts are there is that they are shared hard points on the strut tower and radiator beam that are used by the Z4 (being a convertible, it's conceivable they are more critical to structural rigidity on the Z4, or perhaps BMW's suspension tuning benefits from them). So it seems misleading to suggest Toyota was thinking ahead by putting in the mounts. They'd be there anyway because the production Z4 uses them.
 

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I think people expecting a manual transmission are going to be very disappointed. There's simply no logic in it.

If testing of the manual went OK, why isnt it an option? where is it? why did they take it out?
Why wait years to put one in later while launching with an auto now?
Why not at the very least address the issue when its the most single talked about point in media?
Why give only very vague responses about "hearing the community", then not providing a response to "show me the manual!" cries ?

Best case scenario is - they cant make the manual it work by engineering or by cost, and its still being developed.

More likely, Logic says the Manual is not cost effective, is not on the shelf, and they aren't going to do it mainstream.
The whole project from day 1 has been about making the project financially successful and viable, as seen in the partnering and marketing.
A manual transmission logically upsets that cost effectiveness in both production and marketing.

Towards the end of the project life-cycle you might see a very small number of special editions with a manual when the sales drop off, but right now, for the foreseeable future, I just cant logically see how the MkV is going to get a Manual.
Might be true that logic is one of the key to business, but sometimes it's not really abt that. LFA's a proof that logic sometimes isn't really the only thing there is in existence. If Toyota builds manuals for A90, while I might be VERY surprised, but I would also agree to it. Times and again have they mentioned about dying age of internal combustion engines, analogs, "mechanicals", and purity. If Toyota takes this as an opportunity for that "go out with a bang", the automotive world would surely respect that, or at least notice that, causing a shift in brand image, market population/demography, which is the one of the main reasons why A90 exists in the first place.
 

KahnBB6

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Might be true that logic is one of the key to business, but sometimes it's not really abt that. LFA's a proof that logic sometimes isn't really the only thing there is in existence. If Toyota builds manuals for A90, while I might be VERY surprised, but I would also agree to it. Times and again have they mentioned about dying age of internal combustion engines, analogs, "mechanicals", and purity. If Toyota takes this as an opportunity for that "go out with a bang", the automotive world would surely respect that, or at least notice that, causing a shift in brand image, market population/demography, which is the one of the main reasons why A90 exists in the first place.
I couldn't have said it better myself. Toyota already has the super fast ZF8 automatic on sale now for those who want it. This is a completely illogical car which went through an (in traditional conventional terms) illogical development process in order to keep it affordable and focused as a whimsical and driver oriented mostly analog machine.

So it needs a good manual transmission on both the 3.0L and 2.0L engines to, as rtoadyt has put it "go out with a bang" before the introduction of an electrified Supra (which will happen eventually, no question).

But right now THIS version of the car exists and was fast tracked to market by 2020 for a lot of reasons which will eventually prevent it from existing in even its current form.

It needs the 6cyl manual option on the first Supra in almost twenty years exactly because it will be the last pure internal combustion Supra ever made.

To not follow through on that similar to Hyundai-Genesis selling an enthusiast trim manual G70 2.0T Brembo LSD car even though they know the take rate may be low would be utterly stupid for a car as popular and storied as a Supra.

The take rate may not set huge records any more but a manual transmission Supra 3.0L turbo is guaranteed to be a popular purchase as long as it CAN remain on sale. Because at a certain point it won't be possible to offer it any longer anyway.

The time is right now. We're waiting, Toyota.
 

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I saw similar comments about the strut tower bracing, or rather, lack of. Tada said the Supra didn't need the bracing but they put the mounts there for future use by the aftermarket. The real reason the mounts are there is that they are shared hard points on the strut tower and radiator beam that are used by the Z4 (being a convertible, it's conceivable they are more critical to structural rigidity on the Z4, or perhaps BMW's suspension tuning benefits from them). So it seems misleading to suggest Toyota was thinking ahead by putting in the mounts. They'd be there anyway because the production Z4 uses them.
I just realized that those were in the Z4. Tada was either very misleading in his comments or what he was saying was lost in translation or somewhere in between. I think he wanted to point out how the A90 is more rigged than the Z4 without saying anything bad about the Z4 itself so it came out as if they over engineered it for future upgrades rather than a comparison between the two cars.

Something along the lines of this:

"We removed the strut brace as it was too stiff [compared to the convertible Z4 which needs them] but it can be added later on for more rigidity with supporting upgrades."

Leaving out what's in between the brackets makes a big difference in how we perceive the car(s) was designed and engineered.
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