KahnBB6
Well-Known Member
^^ Is that not also because the STI 6-speed manual gearbox is heavier due to it being more stout? Also I believe that in the last few model years even standard WRX's now receive a variation of that same 6-speed gearbox. I may be mistaken but they seem to have left the remnants of the old split-case 80's 5-speed design in the past now. As a result overall weight of the standard new and new-ish WRX's has gone up a bit but reliability and durability of their non-STI 6-speed manuals has also improved.
Refocusing to the main topic points: traditionally manuals have been lighter than automatics and DCTs alike but perhaps those designs have become progressively lighter by MY2019+. Still, I would not mind such a slight increase in weight for what would be a part of a "grand touring" trim level of the Supra MKV.
Since a 6MT hypothetical model would be aimed squrely at those who WANT that manual shifting experience rather than all-out bleeding edge track performance I would not see a slight weight increase like that as being worthy of concern.
IF indeed the ZF8 or a DCT is lighter than a Supra B58 with a 6-speed manual gearbox then those buyers who would want the least amount of shift time, fastest acceleration, best possible on-track advantage, etc. can all opt for the ZF8 3.0L Supra Base, Premium and later the GRMN and GT4.
But a hypothetical yearly limited production Supra 3.0 6MT would appeal to those who, above all, want to really feel engaged with the car over all other considerations. Same reason that certain Porsche 911 models, Cayman models and BMW M-cars still offer manual transmissions despite the fast shifting and more race-competitive automatics being available.
Different types of buyers of sports cars have different tastes of how they want to interact with and use their sports cars. So long as we are not fully into electrification with these sports cars YET all can and do coexist
I'll add... IF the only way that a manual A90 could exist is with the 255hp 2.0L 6MT (SZ-R 6MT spec?)... then I would strongly consider that specification instead.
However... since the Supra's B58 engine has already been proving itself to be so good right out of the box in STOCK tune I would still be *much* more inclined towards a hypothetical premium-priced Supra 3.0L 6-speed manual model.
Toyota using whatever existing R&D there is from the EU/Germany only Z4 2.0T 6-speed M/T model combined with a stout BMW M3/M4 or M2 manual gearbox would fit the bill, I think?
Supra 3.0L + 6-speed manual at a premium price = done deal!
Supra 2.0L 255hp engine + 6-speed manual at whatever price presumably not as high as a top range 3.0L MKV = strong consideration considering you get the same great chassis, suspension, M-diff, big 3.0L brakes, etc. and manual plus would be able to tune that engine a bit as well.
But what we all truly want ideally, I would think, is a 3.0L + 6 speed manual MKV.
Again... for MAXIMUM track performance potential there is always the ZF8 auto, GRMN and GT4. The GRMN and GT4 will both sell at their *own* premium price points over the standard MKV's just as would a hypothetical Supra 3.0L + 6MT targeting yet another type of specific buyer.
A manual Supra 3.0L is simply another variant that appeals to those of us who are 100% okay with the limitations of a manual vs auto/DCT and prefer the joy of that transmission interface.
At the end of the day everyone here is interested in the Supra itself, its chassis, engineering, character, etc. Some of us simply want different tunes and interface options than others do. And all of these potential premium priced variations have their appeals and advantages for different intended uses of this sports car
Refocusing to the main topic points: traditionally manuals have been lighter than automatics and DCTs alike but perhaps those designs have become progressively lighter by MY2019+. Still, I would not mind such a slight increase in weight for what would be a part of a "grand touring" trim level of the Supra MKV.
Since a 6MT hypothetical model would be aimed squrely at those who WANT that manual shifting experience rather than all-out bleeding edge track performance I would not see a slight weight increase like that as being worthy of concern.
IF indeed the ZF8 or a DCT is lighter than a Supra B58 with a 6-speed manual gearbox then those buyers who would want the least amount of shift time, fastest acceleration, best possible on-track advantage, etc. can all opt for the ZF8 3.0L Supra Base, Premium and later the GRMN and GT4.
But a hypothetical yearly limited production Supra 3.0 6MT would appeal to those who, above all, want to really feel engaged with the car over all other considerations. Same reason that certain Porsche 911 models, Cayman models and BMW M-cars still offer manual transmissions despite the fast shifting and more race-competitive automatics being available.
Different types of buyers of sports cars have different tastes of how they want to interact with and use their sports cars. So long as we are not fully into electrification with these sports cars YET all can and do coexist
I'll add... IF the only way that a manual A90 could exist is with the 255hp 2.0L 6MT (SZ-R 6MT spec?)... then I would strongly consider that specification instead.
However... since the Supra's B58 engine has already been proving itself to be so good right out of the box in STOCK tune I would still be *much* more inclined towards a hypothetical premium-priced Supra 3.0L 6-speed manual model.
Toyota using whatever existing R&D there is from the EU/Germany only Z4 2.0T 6-speed M/T model combined with a stout BMW M3/M4 or M2 manual gearbox would fit the bill, I think?
Supra 3.0L + 6-speed manual at a premium price = done deal!
Supra 2.0L 255hp engine + 6-speed manual at whatever price presumably not as high as a top range 3.0L MKV = strong consideration considering you get the same great chassis, suspension, M-diff, big 3.0L brakes, etc. and manual plus would be able to tune that engine a bit as well.
But what we all truly want ideally, I would think, is a 3.0L + 6 speed manual MKV.
Again... for MAXIMUM track performance potential there is always the ZF8 auto, GRMN and GT4. The GRMN and GT4 will both sell at their *own* premium price points over the standard MKV's just as would a hypothetical Supra 3.0L + 6MT targeting yet another type of specific buyer.
A manual Supra 3.0L is simply another variant that appeals to those of us who are 100% okay with the limitations of a manual vs auto/DCT and prefer the joy of that transmission interface.
At the end of the day everyone here is interested in the Supra itself, its chassis, engineering, character, etc. Some of us simply want different tunes and interface options than others do. And all of these potential premium priced variations have their appeals and advantages for different intended uses of this sports car
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