Toyota "Preparing" Hotter Supra GRMN, Says Chief Engineer

KahnBB6 · Feb 27, 2020

An ad for used New Beetles?

JasonO · Feb 27, 2020

KahnBB6 said:
An ad for used New Beetles?

Well it will be new to someone.

I’m reading someone say something about the NSX or GRMN, etc and then the ad looks like it is part of their post and my brain just kinda sits there thinking something is wrong as that isn’t an NSX and they must be :crazy:

. Then it clicks that it is an ad.

Jabba · Feb 28, 2020

JasonO said:
This ad keeps popping up is and seriously throwing me off when we are talking about sports cars. Every time I see it, I think someone lost their mind.

The google algorithm knows you've been shopping for a used Beetle. You don't got to lie bro lol.

JasonO · Feb 28, 2020

Jabba said:
The google algorithm knows you've been shopping for a used Beetle. You don't got to lie bro lol.

I’m just looking for a nice platform to drop a 2JZ into.

:hide:

DesmoSD · Feb 28, 2020

A70TTR said:
I sometimes wonder if folks have anything close to an understanding of relative cost...

An RC-F Track Edition, a car that adds a few CF panels, carbon ceramic brakes, wheels, and a wing, is $97k msrp ($30k over the standard RC-F and also more money than the LC500). The 86 GRMN with a similar approach was $57k, exactly $30k over the standard 86. Starting to see a pattern here?

If you think that the GRMN Supra (which is easily beyond the two cars above), provided it makes it to production, is going to be cheaper than $85-90k, you're probably gonna have a bad time. That said, the car will be an absolute killer on track, especially for the money.

Don't like that? Neither did anyone when I told them the Supras msrp would be $55k nearly three years ago. No one is forcing you to like or buy it lol

+1 Racing is a rich man's sport but on that level, the RC-F TE was a bust. That car wasn't fooling anyone. At that price, might as well get a Cayman GT4

Novice_Mentality said:
People with no understanding of the R&D that goes into building a brand new sports car from the chassis up: "I want a Porsche killer, with a manual, want it to look stunning and have the latest technology, but want to pay Camry money".....

Yup!

Just as the BMW execs said to Tada and Akio, 'if you want to beat Porsche, why don't you just buy one' or when they pointed them to where the Porsche headquarters was. :rofl:

TBH, unless it's LeMans or WRC, Toyota is barely scratching the surface when it comes beating Porsche with their production sports cars.

A70TTR · Feb 28, 2020

It's a very high wall to climb, whether against Porsche or otherwise.

My opinion is that the RC-F Track Edition and 86 GRMN were expensive for what you were getting. The Supra however should be much better, and IMO it's all thanks to having a stronger contender to begin with.

DesmoSD · Feb 28, 2020

A70TTR said:
It's a very high wall to climb, whether against Porsche or otherwise.

My opinion is that the RC-F Track Edition and 86 GRMN were expensive for what you were getting. The Supra however should be much better, and IMO it's all thanks to having a stronger contender to begin with.

Toyota get's an A for effort for trying to climb that wall, even though they've gotten help from BMW. A bunch of aero and CF bits can only do so much. Then they tag on a hefty price increase. Who is Toyota trying to fool. Even the name GRMN... they haven't mastered shit at the Nurburgring since, what 2014.

Nürburgring Nordschleife lap times

Rank Vehicle Driver Time PS / KG
1. Modified Porsche 911 GT2 RS (991) Lars Kern 6:40.33 - / -
2. Lamborghini Aventador SVJ Marco Mapelli 6:44.97 770 / 1677
3. Radical SR8LM Michael Vergers 6:48.00 455 / 650
4. Huracán Performante Marco Mapelli 6:52.01 640 / 1556
5. Radical SR8 Michael Vergers 6:55.00 363 / 650
6. Porsche 911 GT3 RS Kevin Estre 6:56.40 520 / 1445
7. Porsche 918 Spyder Marc Lieb 6:57.00 887 / 1665
8. Modified Subaru WRX STI unknown 6:57.50 - / -
9. Aventador LP750-4 SV unknown 6:59.73 750 / 1683
10. Ferrari 488 Pista Christian Gebhardt 7:00.03 720 / 1474

JasonO · Feb 28, 2020

DesmoSD said:
Toyota get's an A for effort for trying to climb that wall, even though they've gotten help from BMW. A bunch of aero and CF bits can only do so much. Then they tag on a hefty price increase. Who is Toyota trying to fool. Even the name GRMN... they haven't mastered shit at the Nurburgring since, what 2014.

Nürburgring Nordschleife lap times

Rank Vehicle Driver Time PS / KG
1. Modified Porsche 911 GT2 RS (991) Lars Kern 6:40.33 - / -
2. Lamborghini Aventador SVJ Marco Mapelli 6:44.97 770 / 1677
3. Radical SR8LM Michael Vergers 6:48.00 455 / 650
4. Huracán Performante Marco Mapelli 6:52.01 640 / 1556
5. Radical SR8 Michael Vergers 6:55.00 363 / 650
6. Porsche 911 GT3 RS Kevin Estre 6:56.40 520 / 1445
7. Porsche 918 Spyder Marc Lieb 6:57.00 887 / 1665
8. Modified Subaru WRX STI unknown 6:57.50 - / -
9. Aventador LP750-4 SV unknown 6:59.73 750 / 1683
10. Ferrari 488 Pista Christian Gebhardt 7:00.03 720 / 1474

Toyota is marketing like they are going for the jugular. If you look at reality, this is the same Toyota as before. All moves happen slowly and with little risk to bottom lines. First year they release the platform, second year they improve the platform, the third year will be the first truly Porsche competitive Supra with an S58 and further suspension tweaks. I don’t think it will be a world beater, but it will finally have enough performance to be an outside contender.

Turbro · Feb 28, 2020

A70TTR said:
Don't like that? Neither did anyone when I told them the Supras msrp would be $55k nearly three years ago. No one is forcing you to like or buy it lol

the funny thing is I was figuring Toyota would debut the Supra with more power around $70k-$80k due to inflation of the old model.

I’m hyped for a GRMN model. I just hope they can be purchased without greedy markups

A70TTR · Feb 28, 2020

JasonO said:
Toyota is marketing like they are going for the jugular. If you look at reality, this is the same Toyota as before. All moves happen slowly and with little risk to bottom lines. First year they release the platform, second year they improve the platform, the third year will be the first truly Porsche competitive Supra with an S58 and further suspension tweaks. I don’t think it will be a world beater, but it will finally have enough performance to be an outside contender.

Don't forget about the LC-F and GR hypercar either. Those are still coming and they're definitely something to write home about

DesmoSD · Feb 28, 2020

JasonO said:
Toyota is marketing like they are going for the jugular. If you look at reality, this is the same Toyota as before. All moves happen slowly and with little risk to bottom lines. First year they release the platform, second year they improve the platform, the third year will be the first truly Porsche competitive Supra with an S58 and further suspension tweaks. I don’t think it will be a world beater, but it will finally have enough performance to be an outside contender.

It's not like the Toyota as before. Toyota back in the days was heavily involved with all kinds of motorsports in the U.S when their headquarters was in Torrance, CA. Toyota is still playing it safe these days. Wishful thinking but I doubt the Supra will get an S58 engine. I'll believe it when it's announced by Toyota. Do you really think BMW's M division would let a direct competitor steal it's thunder.

A70TTR said:
Don't forget about the LC-F and GR hypercar either. Those are still coming and they're definitely something to write home about

Those, I'm excited about those too but hopefully Toyota times it correctly with the C8 Z06 release. Twin turbo V8 will be tested against the big boys. They better bring their A game or else it'll be a flop.

justbake · Feb 28, 2020

DesmoSD said:
Wishful thinking but I doubt the Supra will get an S58 engine. I'll believe it when it's announced by Toyota. Do you really think BMW's M division would let a direct competitor steal it's thunder.

If the rumors between BMW and Jaguar/Land Rover are true, Toyota may not be their only competitor with a BMW Sxx motor in their cars.

A70TTR · Feb 28, 2020

DesmoSD said:
Those, I'm excited about those too but hopefully Toyota times it correctly with the C8 Z06 release. Twin turbo V8 will be tested against the big boys. They better bring their A game or else it'll be a flop.

well, if you like things that hang out below 7:10 on the 'Ring then you might like what's coming. then again, pre-production is just that, so...

Jabba · Feb 28, 2020

DesmoSD said:
Wishful thinking but I doubt the Supra will get an S58 engine. I'll believe it when it's announced by Toyota. Do you really think BMW's M division would let a direct competitor steal it's thunder.

Yeah I'm still very skeptical about this too, but to justbake's credit, I do remember reading this article a whiles back. https://www.motor1.com/news/378408/land-rover-defender-svr-bmw-engine/

I'm not clear of the details between Toyota and BMW's partnership, but if it has some clause that Toyota could "order" BMW engines at an added cost.... I guess it's possible. A GRMN Supra with an S58 could give a Cayman GT4 a run for it's money IMO.

KahnBB6 · Feb 28, 2020

JasonO said:
I’m just looking for a nice platform to drop a 2JZ into.

I mean, if you happen to like a New Beetle chassis there's only one engine that's better for it than a 2JZ

Toyota "Preparing" Hotter Supra GRMN, Says Chief Engineer

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