Loss of power, BM3

*I have posted this under the track thread as well, but I thought this may be another spot to get some advice. Apologies for spamming the forum.


It was a gorgeous 90 degree day at CTMP just outside Toronto yesterday, and being at the track is always a blast. That said, I’ve had trouble the last two times I’ve been. I’m losing power in dramatic fashion, and sometimes in as little as two laps. According to the car’s own horsepower meter I’m making somewhere near 450hp (on a BM3 tune, stage 2, 93 oct, catted DP) when everything is working just fine, but at some point during every session the car suddenly shuts off the power and I’m stuck with 260hp.

Sadly, I just don’t know what the issue is. There is no warning, no error message, no dash lights. The coolant temperature had never been an issue, but I swapped the remote radiators between track days for larger Koyo rads with the futile hope that would help, which it didn’t. The oil temperature was also well within reasonable tolerances. At my first track day of the year I didn’t have the tune and I also had no issues at all, so I see the writing on the wall here, but the truth is that I don’t want to give up the extra power if I don’t have to.

I’d be happy to hear any advice from someone more knowledgeable than me or somebody who has experienced a similar issue.

I would run a datalog when it happens then look at that first. Sounds like protection setting or limp mode kicking in.

tjyyzacc said:

*I have posted this under the track thread as well, but I thought this may be another spot to get some advice. Apologies for spamming the forum.


It was a gorgeous 90 degree day at CTMP just outside Toronto yesterday, and being at the track is always a blast. That said, I’ve had trouble the last two times I’ve been. I’m losing power in dramatic fashion, and sometimes in as little as two laps. According to the car’s own horsepower meter I’m making somewhere near 450hp (on a BM3 tune, stage 2, 93 oct, catted DP) when everything is working just fine, but at some point during every session the car suddenly shuts off the power and I’m stuck with 260hp.

Sadly, I just don’t know what the issue is. There is no warning, no error message, no dash lights. The coolant temperature had never been an issue, but I swapped the remote radiators between track days for larger Koyo rads with the futile hope that would help, which it didn’t. The oil temperature was also well within reasonable tolerances. At my first track day of the year I didn’t have the tune and I also had no issues at all, so I see the writing on the wall here, but the truth is that I don’t want to give up the extra power if I don’t have to.

I’d be happy to hear any advice from someone more knowledgeable than me or somebody who has experienced a similar issue.

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Hi,

The car will automatically reduce power output when it gets hot. If you're tracking the car it doesn't take long for this to happen unless some things are tweaked in the tune.

Of course without seeing a datalog I would only be guessing.

If you can't datalog, the next thing I would try and putting some higher octane in the car and see if the problem goes away.

John

65C IAT and car will automatically cut on power big time

Feels like hitting a wall. Negatives of added boost on stock cooling

I know heat seems like the obvious culprit, but the temps never really got that high. I’ve got a heat exchanger in the mail and I have a guy who is willing to fabricate an intercooler, however it’s getting hard to convince my wife that I need to drop off the car every week for an oil change. We never had this conversation.

I did talk to my tuner and he swears he is running the same tune as I am with no heat issues or power loss at the same track. I may just load a 91 OCT tune and still use 94 OCT and just see what happens. It just sucks that if it doesn’t work I am burning through another track day without a solution. Fingers crossed.

tjyyzacc said:

I know heat seems like the obvious culprit, but the temps never really got that high. I’ve got a heat exchanger in the mail and I have a guy who is willing to fabricate an intercooler, however it’s getting hard to convince my wife that I need to drop off the car every week for an oil change. We never had this conversation.

I did talk to my tuner and he swears he is running the same tune as I am with no heat issues or power loss at the same track. I may just load a 91 OCT tune and still use 94 OCT and just see what happens. It just sucks that if it doesn’t work I am burning through another track day without a solution. Fingers crossed.

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How much are your IAT's reading at the track?

Take logs, post logs, and if a limp mode happens read codes before shutting the car off. These things are imperative to diagnose things if issues arise. The car will reduce power for many things, so without the above, its just a guessing game.

tjyyzacc said:

I know heat seems like the obvious culprit, but the temps never really got that high. I’ve got a heat exchanger in the mail and I have a guy who is willing to fabricate an intercooler, however it’s getting hard to convince my wife that I need to drop off the car every week for an oil change. We never had this conversation.

I did talk to my tuner and he swears he is running the same tune as I am with no heat issues or power loss at the same track. I may just load a 91 OCT tune and still use 94 OCT and just see what happens. It just sucks that if it doesn’t work I am burning through another track day without a solution. Fingers crossed.

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off topic, im sorry. But how do you like your Guilia Q?

A lot of folks go with the tactict of run the most boost possible. And the turbo turns into a hot air dryer. For track setups I prefer to run a bit less boost so that it sustains temperatures for longer.

No one can help without a log. There are a few conditions that happen when conditions happen that will put the car into slightly reduced or signfiicantly loss of power. Making power on the dnyo isnt the same as consistent power lap after lap. These cars are complex. You should log your sessions and see what your tuner see's in the files.

For reference I don't have any upgraded cooling with my Pure turbo and as I dont overspin it like I did my stock turob my car keeps the temperatures down at a much higher power level. You can add all you want to the cooling system but if your blowing 150-200C per-intercooler charge temps its only going to handle it for so long before it heat soaks. There is a reason the car is rated for 335HP.

a90moe said:

How much are your IAT's reading at the track?

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I’m honestly not sure. I haven’t had the chance to log anything at the track and I obviously can’t reproduce these issues at home. I’m going again in a couple of weeks and will get it done at that point. There’s lots of good advice here that I’m grateful for and appreciate, but I clearly just need to get the info to start. I was hoping someone had been subjected to the same issue and had a magic bullet kind of answer for me, but realistically I knew it wasn’t that simple. I’ll log the next day I’m there, and assuming I have the issue again, I’ll hopefully have data for at least a couple of different tunes.

As far as the Giulia Quad goes, I no longer have it and just forgot to delete it from my profile. It was a tremendous car when it was working well, but in around a dozen track days I left in limp mode for every single one of them. Over the two plus years I had it I finally figured out some work-arounds to reset the computer, but it was a bit of a headache. I was willing to put up with it because it was such a blast to drive, but I was excited to make the move to something more reliable and here I am complaining about the new toy, lol. I stuck my favorite shot of the Alfa below and it’s replacement. RIP

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tjyyzacc said:

I’m honestly not sure. I haven’t had the chance to log anything at the track and I obviously can’t reproduce these issues at home. I’m going again in a couple of weeks and will get it done at that point. There’s lots of good advice here that I’m grateful for and appreciate, but I clearly just need to get the info to start. I was hoping someone had been subjected to the same issue and had a magic bullet kind of answer for me, but realistically I knew it wasn’t that simple. I’ll log the next day I’m there, and assuming I have the issue again, I’ll hopefully have data for at least a couple of different tunes.

As far as the Giulia Quad goes, I no longer have it and just forgot to delete it from my profile. It was a tremendous car when it was working well, but in around a dozen track days I left in limp mode for every single one of them. Over the two plus years I had it I finally figured out some work-arounds to reset the computer, but it was a bit of a headache. I was willing to put up with it because it was such a blast to drive, but I was excited to make the move to something more reliable and here I am complaining about the new toy, lol. I stuck my favorite shot of the Alfa below and it’s replacement. RIP

View attachment 28731

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To be completely honest, if you want something for the track a custom tune is the way to go.. Car will actually be begging for one

Ecutek and someone knowledgeable who must know the car does track duties

Also, do heat exchanger upgrade Less heat soak after WOT pulls