Why I'm NOT Hyped About The New Toyota Supra

MA617M

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I'd also argue that a lot of hate for the new A90 comes from people who have either

a) never owned a stock A80 TT and just youtube/meme'd them their whole life (news flash a stock turbo 2JZ isn't exciting and runs out of puff at 6300)

b) have never owned more than one generation of supra


The A90 is the next chapter in the whole supra story, not a direct modern day A80.

A supra is more than just one generation. It's a series. I'm keen to see what the A90 adds to the series.

Ps. Moto San hinted that on some tracks the A90 is keeping up with the R35. Interesting. (he responded to me on FB around the goodwood car)
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Jdmuscle

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I'd also argue that a lot of hate for the new A90 comes from people who have either

a) never owned a stock A80 TT and just youtube/meme'd them their whole life (news flash a stock turbo 2JZ isn't exciting and runs out of puff at 6300)

b) have never owned more than one generation of supra


The A90 is the next chapter in the whole supra story, not a direct modern day A80.

A supra is more than just one generation. It's a series. I'm keen to see what the A90 adds to the series.

Ps. Moto San hinted that on some tracks the A90 is keeping up with the R35. Interesting. (he responded to me on FB around the goodwood car)
Disagree. I’ve owned three Supras (2 x A80 and 1 x A70). This new car called anything but a Supra is better suited for what it is.

I sincerely don’t think this car can even hold a candle to R35’s performance. You’ll see how inaccurate that was once the car is released about it keeping up with a R35. Lol
 

Bimyota

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I sincerely don’t think this car can even hold a candle to R35’s performance. You’ll see how inaccurate that was once the car is released about it keeping up with a R35. Lol
Yeah, i'm with you. Did he mean the GT race car?? :rofl:

The GTR is legit on just about any circuit worth driving. That's a big claim.
 

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Yeah, i'm with you. Did he mean the GT race car?? :rofl:

The GTR is legit on just about any circuit worth driving. That's a big claim.
It’s probably a 4 second circuit where every car keeps up with every car. Lol. 300hp mutt keeping up with a real sports car without penny pinching.
 

Bimyota

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It’s probably a 4 second circuit where every car keeps up with every car. Lol. 300hp mutt keeping up with a real sports car without penny pinching.
So you've been to Gingerman Raceway? lol
 

MA617M

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Disagree. I’ve owned three Supras (2 x A80 and 1 x A70). This new car called anything but a Supra is better suited for what it is.

I sincerely don’t think this car can even hold a candle to R35’s performance. You’ll see how inaccurate that was once the car is released about it keeping up with a R35. Lol
I agree re: gtr. It's either a tiny track or the actual car is far different to what anyone expects. Who knows. We've got a gtr as our work car and it is a weapon...
 

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Aside from the physics between the GTR and a90

This a90 Supra isn't even in the competition or same group as the GTR right? It's competitor is the Z; 370Z

Right? Or am I still clinging on to the past? (ie: Supra & 300ZX Fairlady & RX-7)
 

Syed Shah

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People can love cars. People can also have their opinion, voice and concerns about anything they want. Because 'merica.

Do you know what Car reviews have? Criticism. They point out the pros and cons of the vehicle. They can insult or praise the car as they wish.

But because an individual used adjectives that concerned you about this car, you have become emotionally distraught.



I have brought up the issue about Price of A90.
I have brought up the issue about Competition of the A90.
I have brought up the issue about Power of the A90.
I have brought up the issue about Weight of the A90.

Did you know that 99% of forum members disagreed with me when I brought it up? Did you know that they used verbs/adjectives to my disliking? See, me bitching about it?

But, if you have been following the forums recently...did you also recognize that they are now bringing up issues on Price, Competition, Power and Weight of the A90?

So, there is a reasoning as to why there has been a high level of criticism/concerns.


You see... People change when they realize Toyota is half assing this project. Largest and most profitable manufacturer who cant even develop their own engine. Sure it cost 2-9 billion on R&D but you realize they bring in over $200 billion YEARLY. So, 1 billion into engine development is chump change. They outsource their work. Talk about making enthusiast happy. Talking about making everyone else happy. Now killed their business ties with BMW. Locked the Supra in for death as no major engine improvements will be made without the Z4 getting into it too.

There are a majority of people in here who say "I'm going to buy the supra because SUPRA!"

Get a load of yourself.
You say that like $2-9 billion isnt a lot of money to a company. The risk of introducing a new Supra is major itself. You can’t just decide to start gunning for the market leader (Porsche 718 Cayman) when you haven’t made an engine in the same calibre since 2002.. The Supra isn’t going to be sold to every Tom, Dick and Harry and we all know that. They will never recoup their initial investment into the the R&D funds of the inhouse Inline 6, so it makes no sense for them to even bother with it..
 

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A good 1/3 of this forum's problems could had been avoided if Toyota would had named this car differently (FT-??? :dunno:).

For me, driving experience is everything. I'm a fan of smaller sport coupes and so far, this car is checking off a good amount of wants on my list, but I agree with the manual arguments and pricing could be an issue.

The nay-sayers here are pretty funny to read. Not spoiling my fun and it's good to see where the car could be lacking potentially. I would had loved to see Toyota release this car to their 100k taste and not buy the car lol. I know I wouldn't.
 

justbake

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The nay-sayers here are pretty funny to read. Not spoiling my fun and it's good to see where the car could be lacking potentially. I would had loved to see Toyota release this car to their 100k taste and not buy the car lol. I know I wouldn't.
I agree with this 100%.

Everyone wants a GTR competitor from Toyota, their favorite automaker, so they can have a false sense of pride that their company has the better flagship car. This is all while there are very few who can actually afford the car and even less who take advantage of the performance. For whatever reason, some people think the mk4 is (subjectively) better than the R33/R34 that it justifies their purchase of an IS300/SC300 over the guys in 240s/G35s, and vise versa
 

Syed Shah

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A good 1/3 of this forum's problems could had been avoided if Toyota would had named this car differently (FT-??? :dunno:).

For me, driving experience is everything. I'm a fan of smaller sport coupes and so far, this car is checking off a good amount of wants on my list, but I agree with the manual arguments and pricing could be an issue.

The nay-sayers here are pretty funny to read. Not spoiling my fun and it's good to see where the car could be lacking potentially. I would had loved to see Toyota release this car to their 100k taste and not buy the car lol. I know I wouldn't.
I dont think so. If you call it the FT-?? then people who have been waiting for a new supra for all these years will be unhappy that they didnt get a supra..

Its a case of you cant impress everyone for toyota
 

Syed Shah

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Let me tell you something - Toyota is top Dog. In terms of price, power, research and development. They have the most equity of all car manufacturers.

How long has the supra been in development?
Lets say since 2014 when the Ft-1 came out, but sources say 2012. Since 2014, a company that brings in a revenue of $200 billion yearly, deems a corporate engine development is a risk? Since 2014, they have amassed over $800 billion globally. BILLION. They are pouring millions into R&D everyday! So, dont tell me $2-9 billion isnt a lot of money to a company because to toyota - its nothing. Remind you, this is over the course of many years. They have financial analyst, BANKS, hedge funds, and more that bring in money on top of +$200 Billion/yearly.

Open your eyes, man.



Nice jab at Toyota.

Until you realize the level of power Toyota has in this world market is when you realize Toyota is giving us the short end of the stick.


So, go ahead and stand along side with Goliath.
& you think because they have made 800 billion since then, its wise to splash billions knowingly that they will never recuprate this back? As a business decision, it’s not at all wise.

Yes they invest in R&D, but just a basic guess when looking at projects like the mirai can tell you they are preparing for life without combustion engines.. thats where the R&D money is most valuable for them.

Even if they created their own I6 as many of you are asking for, when its not achieiving the numbers you guys are hoping for, the critisim will still be there. Tada-san has been very clear in saying that the A90 is perfectly powered, so you wont be happy then either..

A business like Toyota only remains profitable when they look at what makes sense on a business level.. The business decision to partner with BMW (who create unrivalled straight 6 petrol engines and have the best ZF8 as well) is a job well done.

Now its down to you to get to grips with the facts and realise that the B58 (i think many forget its tuned by Toyota) will power the supra.

Its not a bad engine at all, its reputable and tuneable.
 

Syed Shah

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They have amassed more than $800 billion.

Mirai is a R&D project with expectations of spear heading further hydrogen powered vehicles. It is a stepping stone. A project that costed them millions when there are so few hydrogen stations in America. (like what, under 30 in California specifically?)
Mirai is a foundation for other vehicles to be built upon.

So, I guess toyota makes no sense to develop i6s.

What is surprising is that Mercedes is going back to i6s, Chevy going back to i6s, Ford is r&ding i6s. FCA is going back to i6s.
Even more surprising is Toyota is r&ding i6s in diesel form for their BOF.

You can create an inline six and it can have many applications in many other cars/vehicles. How? Bore it. Stroke it. Tune it.
Coporate engines are made with the fact to save the company money on developing further engine developments.
The JZ? It was a updated engine from previous blocks. LC used it. LX used it. Supra used it. SC used it.
What are you trying to say? Develop an engine for one car use? You think that makes sense?
Those V6 back in the day? 2.5V6, 3.5V6, 4.0V6. Same engine. Bored Differently. Some have longer strokes. Different tune.
Those V8?back in the day? 4.0 V8, 4.5V8, 4.7 V8, 4.8V8, 5.7V8. Same engine. Bored Differently. Some have longer strokes. Different tune.

Toyota isnt dumb.



It is also down to you to get a grip on the fact if someone said it is going to be under XXXXlbs are you going to believe it? That is hardly a fact. Has toyota published it? Therefore, it is a rumor.

Patience is a bitch.
Exactly, Mirai is a foundation for other vehicles to be built upon. When a company explores a new segment of the market with success (like Toyota and the Mirai) it put's them in a better position for the future and on investment terms, they will recoup back every penny of it when the world turns towards cars such as the Mirai. When the combustion engine is gone, Toyota will reap the benefits of this investment.. which was most probably in the billions and not in the millions imo.

Creating a new Inline 6 doesn't make much sense in comparison to using the B58 engine. The B58 is a solid engine and has a great tunability factor to it also. It's more than good enough for most competitors within it's class, for example when used in the M2, it was a very close competitior to the 718 Cayman.. is that not what Tada-San wanted? So it makes perfect sense.

Oh and Mercedes, Chevy and Ford are turning back to I6's which is great for them.. But you are forgetting that all of them have consisently had a sports car in their line up.. The Supra will be the flagship model for Toyota, and the risk of disappointing because the inline 6 is not as expected is FAR greater. They took minimal risk and built upon an already reputable platform that BMW is famed for.. the B58 (which many already consider the B58 the modern day 2JZ). I mean a lot of you guys are acting like Toyota has sourced an engine from Renault.. (Mercedes use a Renault 1.5 in the A180 ffs lol)

Oh and they aren't creating a new engine for 1 car.. I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion. They have just tuned a B58 and made good use of it.

I understand you are on the otherside of the spectrum, but get to grips man. It's not as bad as you are making yourself believe it is.. Oh and earlier you said I was taking a jab at Toyota.

Let's be honest, Toyota haven't created an engine on the same level as Porsche. If you think otherwise then boy do I have news for you.
 
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