Blown Turbo?

[Kamry]

You only got one tune file? No log and revisions?

There was 5 revisions made to the initial e50 tune Visconti sent. My wording may have been a little confusing.

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[KurtP]

I really appreciate the detailed response. It really shined some light on what possibly happened here to a novice like myself.

I want to give Visconti another chance because I've already committed and shelled out money, but I will do my best to explain what's going on and hopefully they can make it right. If not, I'll have to bite the bullet and find a new tuner, Any recommendations?

I think I'll be adding a blow off valve also.

Thank you for this!!!

id recommend you run your stock tune when the new turbo goes in, and get the BOV installed, then go into revisions with him.

how you approach it with him is up to you, because tuners dont generally like hearing they blew up your car, but the facts are the facts. Its possible he did nothing wrong, and you just had a bad turbo, but my scenario above absolutely fits the facts at hand.

just tell him you had a turbo failure from a pressure spike on downshift; that you have a new turbo installed along with a BOV, and ask him how he wants to proceed with tuning. If you want more revisions calling him out might not be productive, because its not like he is going to pay for the turbo. ??‍

 

[Kamry]

new turbo is in....

and she runs!!!!!

took 5 hours total to get the old one out and the new one in. really not that bad!! big thank you to @Ghostop for the new stock turbo.

I attached some pictures of the old turbo off the car. that thing really got bent up.

Video of shaft play: https://youtube.com/shorts/Q3_mVuNNXwY?feature=share

 

[Kamry]

id recommend you run your stock tune when the new turbo goes in, and get the BOV installed, then go into revisions with him.

how you approach it with him is up to you, because tuners dont generally like hearing they blew up your car, but the facts are the facts. Its possible he did nothing wrong, and you just had a bad turbo, but my scenario above absolutely fits the facts at hand.

just tell him you had a turbo failure from a pressure spike on downshift; that you have a new turbo installed along with a BOV, and ask him how he wants to proceed with tuning. If you want more revisions calling him out might not be productive, because its not like he is going to pay for the turbo. ??‍

what do you think about the new findings?

 

[Loco38SUP]

new turbo is in....

and she runs!!!!!

took 5 hours total to get the old one out and the new one in. really not that bad!! big thank you to @Ghostop for the new stock turbo.

I attached some pictures of the old turbo off the car. that thing really got bent up.

Video of shaft play: https://youtube.com/shorts/Q3_mVuNNXwY?feature=share

That was some horrific play! Definitely do some data logging and monitor boost pressure to see if its spiking.

That turbo is now a good candidate for a Pure850 upgrade. ?

-RJM

 

[KurtP]

what do you think about the new findings?

seems right!

 

[Kamry]

That was some horrific play! Definitely do some data logging and monitor boost pressure to see if its spiking.

That turbo is now a good candidate for a Pure850 upgrade. ?

-RJM

I think that’s the plan with it! I gotta imagine Pure doesnt care about the damage here as they scrap the wheel and re-machine the housing but I gotta do more research

 

[Kamry]

seems right!

Would the damage shown on the compressor and the shaft play on the turbine validate your original speculation? do you think anything else come have came into play here?

 

[KurtP]

Would the damage shown on the compressor and the shaft play on the turbine validate your original speculation? do you think anything else come have came into play here?

i think so. Its generally either the bearing failing, the shaft bending, the shaft breaking or a combination.

so when that compressor gets forcibly stalled, there is still force against the turbine. The leverage of the larger blades on the compressor act like a leverage arm and the turbine in wallows the journal. But first, the compressor is stalled which pins the wheel, and the exhaust gas force torques the turbine into the housing then the cascade happens. Think about a top spinning, like the one from the movie Inception. The larger part is on the bottom (Compressor) smaller part is on the top (turbine). The stop starts spinning, everything is perfectly balances. As the bottom of the top loses energy, and it falls on its side (stalling) the top of the top keeps spinning in an ever widening arc. This is what happens to the turbine and journal when the compressor stalls and the exhaust keeps hitting the turbine. The force has to go somewhere, but the compressor’s mechanical advantage holds it in place. This is why it is critical on B58 tuning to either put on a BOV or make sure the tuner knows to get the WG fully open and the cams overlapped sufficiently, and the throttle plate progressively closed in such a fashion the pressure bleeds off.

at high enough load everything hits. I dont generally see turbos that fail because of overspeed alone have turbine hits, but that doesnt mean there isnt a scenario that exists where it could happen. If your failure had happened at wot and high rpm, id be more inclined to presume speed. But combining the physical “evidence” with the report of downshift, and the fact i know for a fact most tuners dont know how to properly tune the valvtronic boost bleed functions during load delay still has me with all of my chips on red.

does that make sense?

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