Guesses on CHP? Is Toyota Sandbagging? (Is the Supra faster than they say?)

[A70TTR]

I'd guess it dynos anywhere between 310-330whp, so 360-380hp at the crank.

But that's based off previous experiences friends have had with BMW.

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[MA617M]

What changed with TU, again? I had the PDFs, but haven't looked at them recently.

https://www.supramkv.com/threads/have-a-look-at-the-prototype-supras-engine.1357/page-48#post-31998

Keeping in mind that the BMW press release states it has the water-cooled exhaust manifold.

 

[Death666wish_]

Meh, we were told to wait, that we will be surprised, we will like what we see, we will be satisfied, Toyota is hiding something, Tada has something under his sleeve, we heard about the iron block, we whispered about the ex-Yamaha engineers working on the head. The day came, we have an off the shelf B58, nothing special, nothing secret, no surprises, no nothing. I'm not surprised and pleased, I am disappointed.

So am I saying the car is bad? No, it's great, because by following this car I know that the engine is good, I know it's strong, if I or anyone I know was looking at a BMW and it has a B58 I'll be confident in saying "that's a good engine". It will be moded and it will compete and it will do well. But, it is not what we were told to wait for, it is not what we expected, there are no surprises. Performing well and putting down good hp numbers is not a surprise, we've seen the engine making 650whp already, where's the surprise there?

I'll just wait for the German, if I like it's looks better than the GR, and if I can afford it by then, problem solved, if I can't afford it or I prefer the looks of the GR well I guess that's too bad for me I guess, or maybe I'll get a mark 4 and swap a B58 in it to start an Internet war

Either way, the car will do great both in America and Australia because it's priced right, in Europe I'm not to sure, I don't know about pricing in Japan but they'll probably buy it at any price.

I think I may be rambling, it's 6:40 in the morning and I'm still up, so off to bed. But, one last thing, manual Toyota, manual.

 

[SupraFiend]

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/detroit-motor-show/its-finally-here-meet-brand-new-toyota-supra

Also whats up with the Euro car and all of the claimed 0-60 numbers? Our 3400lb porker apparently does 4.1 0-60 with 335hp. The Euro version, which is likely lighter then ours, has 340hp (wasn't it supposed to be less with filters and such?) and does 4.3s? Sigh, I guess we will just have to wait for real cars to get delivered to magazines so they can do some actual verified sprints and sniff out the BS.

 

[bogglo]

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/detroit-motor-show/its-finally-here-meet-brand-new-toyota-supra

Also whats up with the Euro car and all of the claimed 0-60 numbers? Our 3400lb porker apparently does 4.1 0-60 with 335hp. The Euro version, which is likely lighter then ours, has 340hp (wasn't it supposed to be less with filters and such?) and does 4.3s? Sigh, I guess we will just have to wait for real cars to get delivered to magazines so they can do some actual verified sprints and sniff out the BS.

That's why I am not getting involve with all this argument. Also why i said both Toyota and BMW has not come clean. BMW the Z4 does 0-60 in 3.9 secs(which Z4 exactly the EUROPE or the US).

 

[BRX]

Are we sure BMW underrates their engines or they simply dyno them in a "worst case scenario" such as high elevation? So no matter where it is in the world (or maybe Germany with it's highest elevation at over 9000ft) it would still make at least 335CHP.

 

[A70TTR]

Either way, it's not the same chp most others use, Toyota included.

 

[Blissya]

Official figures in Europe are done to 100kph or 62mph. On paper, the Supra and Z4 here have same power, but Supra is faster in manufacturers figures. It is also more expensive!

 

[mas921]

way too much speculation in this thread

 

[93Siro]

Are we sure BMW underrates their engines or they simply dyno them in a "worst case scenario" such as high elevation? So no matter where it is in the world (or maybe Germany with it's highest elevation at over 9000ft) it would still make at least 335CHP.

it's a combination of both IMO. The drivetrain losses are much less than what it used to be. And who knows what is going on with the new electronics. One thing we learned from VW scandal is cars "KNOW" that they are dynos and behave differently. The acceleration numbers though suggest higher horsepower than what is being advertised.

 

[Death666wish_]

I was wondering why you wanted us to guess about the California highway patrol.

 

[justbake]

I don't think they are sandbagging but I do think they are using a number other than what is rated at the crankshaft (like BMW).

335hp puts it just enough above the V6 Lexus vehicles without undermining them

365 lb⋅ft puts it just below V8 Lexus vehicles to not interfere.

The RC-F would have been a hard sell if made 150 more hp while also being slower 0-60 if they didn't update the gearing during the facelift.

 

[SupraFiend]

it's a combination of both IMO. The drivetrain losses are much less than what it used to be. And who knows what is going on with the new electronics. One thing we learned from VW scandal is cars "KNOW" that they are dynos and behave differently. The acceleration numbers though suggest higher horsepower than what is being advertised.

Well the ones that cheat do anyways.

Also the 5hp difference between the 340hp version of this motor in other cars could just be due to the exhaust design on the new Supra.

 

[Death666wish_]

Well the ones that cheat do anyways.

Also the 5hp difference between the 340hp version of this motor in other cars could just be due to the exhaust design on the new Supra.

@Guff said the exhaust is great and all you need is a downpipe.

 

[SupraFiend]

A quick visual look over doesn't tell you how well it flows. I'm guessing the inside of that rear mounted 2 in 2 out muffler is a bit of a mess. Not a huge fan of divided exhaust paths on inline motors either. Also looked like all the piping was aluminized mild steel in the under car pics we saw from the show. The mk4's catback was all stainless at least.

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