2021 Supra Prices Revealed!

[thedude]

Of course the Supra isn't their bread and butter. I'm not sure about that. We were told the 2.0 was added to increase sales. All I'm saying is base on the internet's reaction I don't think the 2.0 is going to be hit.

Well, and Toyota basically gets the 2.0 “for free”. The dev work is minimal and all the production for the Z4 was going to happen with the 2.0 anyway. It’s gravy for them.

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[vb22]

Well, and Toyota basically gets the 2.0 “for free”. The dev work is minimal and all the production for the Z4 was going to happen with the 2.0 anyway. It’s gravy for them.

I don't think we can make such a statement without knowing the actual R&D cost associated with the 2.0, not to mention the certification cost Toyota had folk over to uncle Sam to make sure it met all legal US requirements.

I guess the same could be same about the 2.0 Lexus GS that was mention earlier on this thread. Same off of the shelf 8AR-FTS that is used in at least 7 other Toyota/Lexus models. It's intend was to boost GS sales. Guess what? No one bought it and Lexus' North American division dropped it after only a year or so of going on sale. Case in point, slow selling models and trim level get the axe. Now, will the 2.0 Supra be a success in the US? We'll have to wait for sale numbers to know.

 

[thedude]

I don't think we can make such a statement without knowing the actual R&D cost associated with the 2.0, not to mention the certification cost Toyota had folk over to uncle Sam to make sure it met all legal US requirements.

I guess the same could be same about the 2.0 Lexus GS that was mention earlier on this thread. Same off of the shelf 8AR-FTS that is used in at least 7 other Toyota/Lexus models. It's intend was to boost GS sales. Guess what? No one bought it and Lexus' North American division dropped it after only a year or so of going on sale. Case in point, slow selling models and trim level get the axe. Now, will the 2.0 Supra be a success in the US? We'll have to wait for sale numbers to know.

Given the platform in 2.0 form exists and was always going to be built anyway by BMW/Steyr I stand by my statement. Nothing is free (notice I used quotation marks) but damn near close. I think they’ll derive disproportionate benefit from minimal input with this 2.0 Supra regardless of the sales volumes. Like I said, gravy.

 

[vb22]

Given the platform in 2.0 form exists and was always going to be built anyway by BMW/Steyr I stand by my statement. Nothing is free (notice I used quotation marks) but damn near close. I think they’ll derive disproportionate benefit from minimal input with this 2.0 Supra regardless of the sales volumes. Like I said, gravy.

Going by that we should have seen a manual in the 2.0 because it already exist in base EU Z4. There won't be any benefits if no one buys one and dealers have to sell at a lost in order to just get them off the lot AKA GS 2.0 turbo. Hence why car companies give the axe to poor selling models and trims. You don't keep products that don't sell in stock, that's basic business 101. Like I told Dannyvandelft, let's wait for sale numbers so we can revisit this topic a years time. Otherwise we'll just keep making statements that goes along the lines "I think this and that" without any supporting facts.

 

[Dannyvandelft]

Going by that we should have seen a manual in the 2.0 because it already exist in base EU Z4. There won't be any benefits if no one buys one and dealers have to sell at a lost in order to just get them off the lot AKA GS 2.0 turbo. Hence why car companies give the axe to poor selling models and trims. You don't keep products that don't sell in stock, that's basic business 101. Like I told Dannyvandelft, let's wait for sale numbers so we can revisit this topic a years time. Otherwise we'll just keep making statements that goes along the lines "I think this and that" without any supporting facts.

Europe also has a much higher rate of manual drivers (at least when I still lived there) so the chance of selling one there would be higher. Unless Toyota directly comes out and says "this is why" it's all speculation anyway.

 

[thedude]

Going by that we should have seen a manual in the 2.0 because it already exist in base EU Z4. There won't be any benefits if no one buys one and dealers have to sell at a lost in order to just get them off the lot AKA GS 2.0 turbo. Hence why car companies give the axe to poor selling models and trims. You don't keep products that don't sell in stock, that's basic business 101. Like I told Dannyvandelft, let's wait for sale numbers so we can revisit this topic a years time. Otherwise we'll just keep making statements that goes along the lines "I think this and that" without any supporting facts.

Right, it would be “free”, but Toyota obviously chose not to cannibalize the 86 in the Americas.

I think sales volumes of the Supra are low period, and they obviously want to try to bolster them.

 

[vb22]

Europe also has a much higher rate of manual drivers (at least when I still lived there) so the chance of selling one there would be higher. Unless Toyota directly comes out and says "this is why" it's all speculation anyway.

Good point, Europe does have a very high number of manual drivers. Maybe that's why the Supra is doing poorly over there. So Tada said the 2.0 Supra was aimed towards 86 buyers that want to upgrade. If so, I believe the rate of manual 86 sold in the U.S. has been anywhere from 40-50%. That's a pretty large segments imo.

 

[vb22]

Right, it would be “free”, but Toyota obviously chose not to cannibalize the 86 in the Americas.

I think sales volumes of the Supra are low period, and they obviously want to try to bolster them.

Idk about that. There is huge price gap between the 86 and 2.0 Supra. Toyota said the 2.0 Supra was to bridge the gap between the two. So offering a manual on the 2.0 makes prefect sense from that point of view.

You don't say. My prime example was the 2.0 GS. Lexus hope it would boost sales, but it didn't and got canned. So exactly what are we disagreeing about?

 

[thedude]

Idk about that. There is huge price gap between the 86 and 2.0 Supra. Toyota said the 2.0 Supra was to bridge the gap between the two.

You don't say. My prime example was the 2.0 GS. Lexus hope it would boost sales, but it didn't and got canned. So exactly what are we disagreeing about?

Despite the price gap I still think there is benefit to keeping the manual as a draw for the 86. Otherwise they’d have a lot more buyers fleeing from the 86.

I’m not sure we are disagreeing that much - I think we just have different expectations. I’m also not convinced that the GS segment was a good place to stick a small engine. Most “executive saloon” buyers want at least a v6 - the German automakers can get away with turbo 4 cylinders in the midsize segment because people want the status. For some, they just want to get into a high profile car at a lower price. That obviously didn’t hold true for the Lexus buyer.

 

[Suggs.OR]

Im still relatively new to this level of performance vehicle, but right now doesnt having a manual in this vehicle almost make it worse performance wise since the computers and everything to run the car is so much better now? I understand a lot of people have a preference to drive manual (I drive a manual right now and prefer it) over an automatic and is more about the driving experience.

This is an honest question that I am asking because i dont know. Do you think the 2021s would be able to do the 3.9 0-60 time with a manual?

 

[thedude]

Im still relatively new to this level of performance vehicle, but right now doesnt having a manual in this vehicle almost make it worse performance wise since the computers and everything to run the car is so much better now? I understand a lot of people have a preference to drive manual (I drive a manual right now and prefer it) over an automatic and is more about the driving experience.

This is an honest question that I am asking because i dont know. Do you think the 2021s would be able to do the 3.9 0-60 time with a manual?

You’re not wrong. Many of the BMW performance models quote slightly slower acceleration times for manual transmissions.

 

[vb22]

Despite the price gap I still think there is benefit to keeping the manual as a draw for the 86. Otherwise they’d have a lot more buyers fleeing from the 86.

I’m not sure we are disagreeing that much - I think we just have different expectations. I’m also not convinced that the GS segment was a good place to stick a small engine. Most “executive saloon” buyers want at least a v6 - the German automakers can get away with turbo 4 cylinders in the midsize segment because people want the status. For some, they just want to get into a car at a lower price. That obviously didn’t hold true for the Lexus buyer.

That's just an odd way of seeing things imo. That's like saying past Supras should have been auto only because both the MR2 and Celica had manuals.

The same thing can be said about the Supra no? The 2.0: Porsche Cayman, MB SLC , Audi TT, Jaguar F-type etc can get away with it because of the badge. Because its wearing a Toyota badge it has to offer more, but for less. Hence why we have such a big price gap between the 3.0 Supra and Z4 M40i. Like I said before, time will tell and I'll be more then happy to revisit this topic with you guys once we start seeing sales figures. If the 2.0 meets or exceeds Toyota's expectation I'll be the first one to admit I was wrong.

 

[johnny_10196]

Europe also has a much higher rate of manual drivers (at least when I still lived there) so the chance of selling one there would be higher. Unless Toyota directly comes out and says "this is why" it's all speculation anyway.

Just speculation on my part, but imagine what people would say if the after thought 2.0 that was only made half way into R&D were to receive a manual, but the flagship 3.0 that was developed since the beginning was stuck as an auto only.

 

[Dannyvandelft]

Just speculation on my part, but imagine what people would say if the after thought 2.0 that was only made half way into R&D were to receive a manual, but the flagship 3.0 that was developed since the beginning was stuck as an auto only.

Would make sense to me. The Supra 3.0 is a performance car. No point to put a lower performance transmission in there. In the 2.0 it wouldn't matter because it's slower anyway.

 

[johnny_10196]

Would make sense to me. The Supra 3.0 is a performance car. No point to put a lower performance transmission in there. In the 2.0 it wouldn't matter because it's slower anyway.

Another reason why I wish Toyota had just taken the extra time needed to spin off the 2.0 as its own model, a Celica replacement.

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