Why I'm NOT Hyped About The New Toyota Supra

A70TTR

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well, to be fair I think it was like two people referring to me negatively, but a decent amount of the others from there (same handles) seem just fine. plus, nearly all of the stuff that meant anything was prior to the NDA anyways.

but yeah, plenty of folks seem to appreciate the discussion, and hey at least it's engaging; you also cant please everyone.
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solidsamir

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well, to be fair I think it was like two people referring to me negatively, but a decent amount of the others from there (same handles) seem just fine. plus, nearly all of the stuff that meant anything was prior to the NDA anyways.

but yeah, plenty of folks seem to appreciate the discussion, and hey at least it's engaging; you also cant please everyone.
I enjoyed your comments through and through
 

Levi

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I wish the Supra would remain around 4.20m like the current Z4 at least. Previous was 4.00m. >4.20m is too long for a two seater. The GT86 at least is a 2+2. The MX-5 is nice, but not a coupe.
 

Timster1990

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Hell yeah lol. am not Guff but hell yeah. Why? because after buying a car other things come to play also...Insurance on Porsche vs Toyota. Maintenance on Porsche Vs Toyota. i feel like if the specs is right on this car i.e 3000lb with 340hp doing 0-60 in 3.8 seconds a lot of people would be snatching this baby up especially looking good like that.

plus why would you want to by a slightly used Porshe that cost the same with a brand new car with very close to similar performance lower insurance and maintenance fee?
Just out of curiosity have you ever owned a Porsche?
 

Blupra

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Hell yeah lol. am not Guff but hell yeah. Why? because after buying a car other things come to play also...Insurance on Porsche vs Toyota. Maintenance on Porsche Vs Toyota. i feel like if the specs is right on this car i.e 3000lb with 340hp doing 0-60 in 3.8 seconds a lot of people would be snatching this baby up especially looking good like that.

plus why would you want to by a slightly used Porshe that cost the same with a brand new car with very close to similar performance lower insurance and maintenance fee?
Quick comment about insurance on a Porsche 911... insurance on my 911 was cheaper than it would have been on any of the following cars: M4, M2, RCF, ISF, 370z, GT350, and S2000.

Call around, Porsche insurance might be cheaper than a lot of less expensive cars.
 

Blupra

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I also think this car can achieve the 3.8 second especially when i think of the 06 Lexus IS350 with 306hp at crank with just 274tq heavier than this MKV and also naturally aspirated with a regular auto transmission from 2006 and able to do 0-60 in mid to high 4s mark.
Agree... I’ve always imagined why that great engine (now 12+ years old) didn’t make it into the twins or another lighter vehicle.

I’ve been waiting a long time for Toyota/Lexus to update or replace that engine.
 

SupraGuy19

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I really need to see a Toyota engine with greater than 400 HP in this thing, at least at some point in the future. BMW is a great car company but it's like buying a BMW with a Toyota engine, a Dodge with a Chevy engine, or a Nissan with a Honda/Kia engine. These cross pairings really put a sour taste in my mouth.
 

Levi

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I really need to see a Toyota engine with greater than 400 HP in this thing, at least at some point in the future. BMW is a great car company but it's like buying a BMW with a Toyota engine, a Dodge with a Chevy engine, or a Nissan with a Honda/Kia engine. These cross pairings really put a sour taste in my mouth.
At least BMW fans will prove they are not car enthusiast but badge whores. The Supra will be a pure BMW with a Toyota badge.
 

DevonK

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At least BMW fans will prove they are not car enthusiast but badge whores. The Supra will be a pure BMW with a Toyota badge.
It better not have BMW-priced parts costs. Or BMW-engineered short life cycles for its components.
 

DevonK

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^ It's being done elsewhere. Fiat ships engines to Japan from Italy for the 124, Honda ships motors for the CTR to England from the US....

Anyways, Toyota can use BMW parts when doing repairs without charging BMW style markups for them (or BMW labour rates), which was my main point. (I agree that if the Supra turns out to be a reskinned BMW Z with a different suspension setup, hoping for better-than-BMW component reliability is nothing but wishful thinking.)

If the Supra costs less than the Z initially but then has the very high maintenance and repair costs of a BMW, TCO will be high. (It needs to be kept in mind that BMW gives new buyers 4 years of free maintenance, something Toyota doesn't do.)
 
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HKz

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^ It's being done elsewhere. Fiat ships engines to Japan from Italy for the 124, Honda ships motors for the CTR to England from the US....

Anyways, Toyota can use BMW parts when doing repairs without charging BMW style markups for them (or BMW labour rates), which was my main point. (I agree that if the Supra turns out to be a reskinned BMW Z with a different suspension setup, hoping for better-than-BMW component reliability is nothing but wishful thinking.)

If the Supra costs less than the Z initially but then has the very high maintenance and repair costs of a BMW, TCO will be high. (It needs to be kept in mind that BMW gives new buyers 4 years of free maintenance, something Toyota doesn't do.)
I agree that this can be and has been done, but what would they be shipping from Japan for this project? The door skins? All the main mechanical components are nearly a lock from BMW, no rumors or insiders have said otherwise.
 

Craigy

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Not to offend anybody here, but IMO the folks who are saying they'd be happy paying $55k for a ~335 horsepower Supra don't come across as real buyers.

Again, not to single anyone out, but the general theme I get from people (in this thread and others, on this forum and elsewhere) who like to talk about how horsepower isn't important, driver feel and all of that, power-to-weight etc., is of someone who is a sportscar enthusiast, may or may not be a sportscar owner, and doesn't actually plan to buy one of these new, but maybe wouldn't mind perhaps picking one up used for half price one day, possibly 5-10 years out. Or they're journalists who write about the car but again aren't going to buy one.

Sort of like how all the internet commenters and magazine writers say they want a stickshift, but buyers don't actually buy them.

The market demands that a sportscar be fast, and that means it have some horsepower. Only a few manufacturers can get away with underpowered but expensive sportscars, e.g. Lotus, Alfa 4c, etc., and they sell in very small numbers. The ones that sell in any substantial figure (Cayman, M2) have a more exciting badge attached, and again still don't sell a ton of units.

There will always be a handful to prove me wrong, but I just don't see how they will sell many cars at this price point. FT1 was simply incredible, a hugely exciting prospect, but this is just ho-hum.
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