bootmod3 custom E30/E50 Multimap?

[suptj]

I was wondering if any you guys are running a bm3 E30/E50 multimaps and how did you go about it? Did you guys get 3-4 separate custom map tunes from a tuner? I find it weird how bm3 offers 91, 93, E30, and E50 maps but they're all separate.
I have the intentions to run my flex fuel but want a 91 / 93 / E30 / E50 flex fuel map
I don't understand as to why other vehicle models have their own E30/E50 multimap blend but we don't.

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[jRuN]

I'm running their 'Stage 2 Multimap' tune.. which comes with 4 switchable map slots.

ACN 91
91
93
Stock Power

The difference being that as a part of these 4 tunes.. they are all "flex" enabled... so i am actually running the 93 tune slot but with an E50 blend of fuel.. since my base fuel i'm blending it with is 93. I have their flex fuel kit as well so it really doesn't matter what blend i get all the way from 93 up to E50. If you are going to run the flex fuel kit this is the map you would want.. then you just pic what your base fuel is you are mixing out of the 4 slots.. this is my understanding. I believe the E30 and E50 maps are for those without the flex fuel kit that are using a ethanol content gauge and making sure they hit their target blends there.

Just dyno'd this configuration on tuesday and put down 490hp/530tq. AA catted dp, HKS intake (blend was actually at E47 when i was at the dyno)

Again.. this is just my current understanding of the situation.. maybe someone wiser will clarify more.

 

[suptj]

I'm running their 'Stage 2 Multimap' tune.. which comes with 4 switchable map slots.

ACN 91
91
93
Stock Power

The difference being that as a part of these 4 tunes.. they are all "flex" enabled... so i am actually running the 93 tune slot but with an E50 blend of fuel.. since my base fuel i'm blending it with is 93. I have their flex fuel kit as well so it really doesn't matter what blend i get all the way from 93 up to E50. If you are going to run the flex fuel kit this is the map you would want.. then you just pic what your base fuel is you are mixing out of the 4 slots.. this is my understanding. I believe the E30 and E50 maps are for those without the flex fuel kit that are using a ethanol content gauge and making sure they hit their target blends there.

Just dyno'd this configuration on tuesday and put down 490hp/530tq. AA catted dp, HKS intake (blend was actually at E47 when i was at the dyno)

Again.. this is just my current understanding of the situation.. maybe someone wiser will clarify more.

Thats the thing.. you could be pushing a little bit more power. You are running a E50 blend but on a 93 map so the numbers/timing between that and a E50 map is way different. You're essentially gatekeeping your power by running a cracked out "93+" map.

BM3 has a flex fuel sensor which reads ethanol content. Theres a specific feature you need to turn on and reflash the car but yeah it exists within their software. I have no idea why their stage2 multimaps is outfitted the way it is. BM3 knows majority of flex fuel users run higher blends because they offer a 93 / E30 / E50 flexfuel multimap for other vehicles.

This map would be the best for both of us as it offers a wide range. The flexfuel's job is to switch to a designated map determined on your current ethanol content.
Map 1) ACN91
Map 2) 93
Map 3) E30
Map 4) E50

 

[jRuN]

Well...hmmm.. so you're saying I would be better off just running their E50 tune? I was under the impression using their flex fuel kit and running the flex enabled multi map that it would be able to recognize I had E50 in the tank and adjust accordingly and basically be running an E50 tune?

 

[razorlab]

Well...hmmm.. so you're saying I would be better off just running their E50 tune? I was under the impression using their flex fuel kit and running the flex enabled multi map that it would be able to recognize I had E50 in the tank and adjust accordingly and basically be running an E50 tune?

It does. @suptj is confused.

Multimap is ACN91, 91, 93 and stock. You can switch between all those from the steering wheel.

All four of those map slots have flex fuel enabled. If you run flexfuel it flexes to whatever Ethanol you have in there, if you have a flex fuel sensor installed. Timing, torque targets, boost, fueling all scale accordingly. You could even run the stock map slot and it would interpolate to higher timing, torque targets, boost and fueling as you put more ethanol in. Flex fuel does not "Switch" to other map slots, it interpolates between whatever map slot you have selected and the full ethanol map slot.

It uses these gradients, or whatever custom gradients you make. You can make it non linear if your tuner wishes.

They also offer individual E30 and E50 maps for people without flex fuel sensors installed.

 

[suptj]

It does. @suptj is confused.

Multimap is ACN91, 91, 93 and stock. You can switch between all those from the steering wheel.

All four of those map slots have flex fuel enabled. If you run flexfuel it flexes to whatever Ethanol you have in there, if you have a flex fuel sensor installed. Timing, torque targets, boost, fueling all scale accordingly. You could even run the stock map slot and it would interpolate to higher timing, torque targets, boost and fueling as you put more ethanol in. Flex fuel does not "Switch" to other map slots, it interpolates between whatever map slot you have selected and the full ethanol map slot.

It uses these gradients, or whatever custom gradients you make. You can make it non linear if your tuner wishes.

They also offer individual E30 and E50 maps for people without flex fuel sensors installed.

With that being said I would like to see the comparison in data from a user running BM3's flex fuel multimap 93 @ E30 content vs another user on an separate E30 OTS tune.
If possible, can you guys post your e30-e50 datalog runs?
Im definitely in a conflict and maybe I misinterpreted everything. I just want a better understanding on it. Because the guys on bimmerforums state otherwise when it comes to their selections of maps. All in all, I would like to see the backing data.

 

[suptj]

This is an interesting read. Madtoy explains as to the point Im trying to make.

https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1987575

I will personally be testing this theory as I haven’t installed my flex fuel kit yet. I have data on my e30 map pulls and will be comparing to a 91+ at E30-47 after I install the kit.

 

[razorlab]

With that being said I would like to see the comparison in data from a user running BM3's flex fuel multimap 93 @ E30 content vs another user on an separate E30 OTS tune.
If possible, can you guys post your e30-e50 datalog runs?
Im definitely in a conflict and maybe I misinterpreted everything. I just want a better understanding on it. Because the guys on bimmerforums state otherwise when it comes to their selections of maps. All in all, I would like to see the backing data.

I see what you are asking. It all depends on where BM3 put 100% at in the gradient tables. If they put it at say E50, then If you have E50 in the car, any map slot would give you the exact same results. In the same scenario, if you run the stock map slot and run e25, then it would give different results than if you have the 93 map slot selected and e25 in the tank.

Same can be said if you are using stg1 or stg2 multi maps.

Maybe @jRuN can log the flex interpolation factor log item at E47 and see what it says.

My custom tune has e40 at 100% interpolation.

 

[razorlab]

I see what you are asking. It all depends on where BM3 put 100% at in the gradient tables. If they put it at say E50, then If you have E50 in the car, any map slot would give you the exact same results. In the same scenario, if you run the stock map slot and run e25, then it would give different results than if you have the 93 map slot selected and e25 in the tank.

Same can be said if you are using stg1 or stg2 multi maps.

Maybe @jRuN can log the flex interpolation factor log item at E47 and see what it says.

My custom tune has e40 at 100% interpolation.

So here is a visual example of what I was explaining above. I will be purposely ignoring all ignition/torque compensation tables and stock fueling limits for this example to make it more simple.

This first example has the torque and ignition interpolation tables set so that the flex fuel ignition and torque tables are being used 100% when the ECU detects E50.

So let's say the car is at 160 load at 6000rpm, on E50. It will be running 14* of timing. Exactly what is in the Flex Fuel ignition table.

Now let's say the car is at the same 160 load at 6000rpm, but there is E25 in the tank. That will make it run 50% between the Flex Fuel ignition table and the pump gas ignition table. It will be running approx. 12* of timing.

This second example has the torque and ignition interpolation tables set so that the flex fuel ignition and torque tables are being used 100% when the ECU detects E80.

The ECU will have to detect E80 to run 100% of the Flex Fuel ignition table. If the car has E25 in the tank, it will be at 30% between the Flex Fuel ignition table and the pump gas ignition table, around 11* of timing or so.

If you do the same for the torque tables (which boost comes out of), then you can see the differences there as well.

My point is, it's really how the interpolation tables are setup and also how different the Flex Fuel ignition and torque tables are from the pump gas tables. YMMV.

 

[OldHead-MKV-Owner]

This is an interesting read. Madtoy explains as to the point Im trying to make.

https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1987575

I will personally be testing this theory as I haven’t installed my flex fuel kit yet. I have data on my e30 map pulls and will be comparing to a 91+ at E30-47 after I install the kit.

Did you ever do your pulls and collect the data? I just moved to BM3 customRom but haven't installed my CANBUS enabled flex flue kit (bm3) yet. The kit arrives tomorrow. For now I've been running the stage 2 93/E30/E50 maps. Plan to switch over to multimap once I have the kit installed.

Just ordered a DAW 6-port Flow Max (the new one) and when that comes in, will install with my EOS mani and then get a proper tune. The OTS stage 2 93 and E50 map work great. On the E30 OTS map I get some weird throttle oscillations/hesitation around 2,900rpm... regardless of gear.

 

[suptj]

Did you ever do your pulls and collect the data? I just moved to BM3 customRom but haven't installed my CANBUS enabled flex flue kit (bm3) yet. The kit arrives tomorrow. For now I've been running the stage 2 93/E30/E50 maps. Plan to switch over to multimap once I have the kit installed.

Just ordered a DAW 6-port Flow Max (the new one) and when that comes in, will install with my EOS mani and then get a proper tune. The OTS stage 2 93 and E50 map work great. On the E30 OTS map I get some weird throttle oscillations/hesitation around 2,900rpm... regardless of gear.

Yeah we found more timing being on the flex multimap tune. Stage 2 E30 Map @E50 only hit 13.5 deg of timing, while multimap Map 2 reached to 16. @razorlab explained it spot on. The system will scale the tune to whatever ethanol content it’s reading. Congrats on the flow max & EOS mani! I plan on purchasing one in the future. If there’s any con about the supras it would be the significant creep in temps even being WOT for two gears.

As for the oscillations, do you have any logs I can take a look at?

Logs:
Stage 2 E30 Map @E50
https://bootmod3.net/log?id=64be0b91ae729b0b40010673

Stage 2 Multimap Map 2 @E50
https://bootmod3.net/log?id=64c9ea46ae729b9cf06b0af4

 

[OldHead-MKV-Owner]

Yeah we found more timing being on the flex multimap tune. Stage 2 E30 Map @E50 only hit 13.5 deg of timing, while multimap Map 2 reached to 16. @razorlab explained it spot on. The system will scale the tune to whatever ethanol content it’s reading. Congrats on the flow max & EOS mani! I plan on purchasing one in the future. If there’s any con about the supras it would be the significant creep in temps even being WOT for two gears.

As for the oscillations, do you have any logs I can take a look at?

Logs:
Stage 2 E30 Map @E50
https://bootmod3.net/log?id=64be0b91ae729b0b40010673

Stage 2 Multimap Map 2 @E50
https://bootmod3.net/log?id=64c9ea46ae729b9cf06b0af4

Oh shit, Sorry I didn't see this. I don't have any logs on the E30 blend. It was a crazy night. Got the DME installed, BM3 up and running, downloaded the Stage2 93 OTS map, and started driving. The damn exhaust sounded like a machine gun, in a very bad way. Turned burbles off and reflashed.
After that I went straight to the pump and put an E30 mix in there, downloaded the E30 OTS map and drove around a little. Since I had plenty of room left in the tank, put more E in and came to an E51 blend. Downloaded the E50 OTS map and ran that. It was much smoother than the E30 but more power. I haven't driven it much since. Only 2 bars have fallen off the fuel gauge. Once I run through the fuel, I'd like to say I'll try E30 again but my BM3 flex kit arrived and I'll been installing that tonight. After that I'll switch over to multimap which I've heard should be the smoothest OTS maps. I'll be running the 93 with flex enabled.
I will 100% get some logs with the current E50 map and when I switch over to multimap.

 

[suptj]

Oh shit, Sorry I didn't see this. I don't have any logs on the E30 blend. It was a crazy night. Got the DME installed, BM3 up and running, downloaded the Stage2 93 OTS map, and started driving. The damn exhaust sounded like a machine gun, in a very bad way. Turned burbles off and reflashed.
After that I went straight to the pump and put an E30 mix in there, downloaded the E30 OTS map and drove around a little. Since I had plenty of room left in the tank, put more E in and came to an E51 blend. Downloaded the E50 OTS map and ran that. It was much smoother than the E30 but more power. I haven't driven it much since. Only 2 bars have fallen off the fuel gauge. Once I run through the fuel, I'd like to say I'll try E30 again but my BM3 flex kit arrived and I'll been installing that tonight. After that I'll switch over to multimap which I've heard should be the smoothest OTS maps. I'll be running the 93 with flex enabled.
I will 100% get some logs with the current E50 map and when I switch over to multimap.

Yeah installing the flex was very exciting for me as well. I look forward to those logs!

 

[OldHead-MKV-Owner]

Kit installed. Tested out. Funny shit. I had the Fuel-it flex fuel kit already on the car. It's the exact same ethanol sensor. The exact part number. Anyway, made the install easier.
Flashed the stage2 multimap tune but it's raining and she hasn't seen the rain yet. Well, at least not from me. Bought with 2,800miles now has 6,800.

Was able to see the E content on the dashboard. Matched what the Fuel-it was saying, as it should.

I'll get some pulls tomorrow night or Sunday on the E50 map and the 93 multimap

 

[MSport]

Has anyone experienced bogging in 2nd gear( I’m in a MT) on e40? I’m actually at around 46 on the logger. As soon as I shifted to 3rd I was screaming but in 2nd felt like a dog. Possibly boost lag? Fuel pump struggling?

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