Race Tracking Your Supra - Information exchange

[NINaudio]

I’m a track noob too. I’m happy with my tire choice.

I got the Continental Extreme Contact Sport 02.

is an upgrade from the Super Sport

has very similar tread quality as the PS4S

is way way more affordable than the Michelins and have rebates.

so far I have done a couple of track weekends on them and they are grippy enough to learn but also let you know when you are losing traction in the corners.

Those ECS 02 are what I'm looking at once the stocks are done this year.

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[AJRMKV]

my re71rs make plenty of squealing noises when pushed to the limit. So did my rt660s. I honestly think it’s better to say it’s easier to lose a car on street tires than good 200tw tires.

Most beginner crashes i've seen were a result of cold tires early on. A conti 02 or PS4S heat up quickly and are a great street tire. In the 200s the RE71RS heat up quickly too.

My AD09s are pucks until they're hot and I see alot of newbs jumping on the new Hoosiers which take even longer to heat up, bad decision imo.

 

[Gabe]

Most beginner crashes i've seen were a result of cold tires early on. A conti 02 or PS4S heat up quickly and are a great street tire. In the 200s the RE71RS heat up quickly too.

My AD09s are pucks until they're hot and I see alot of newbs jumping on the new Hoosiers which take even longer to heat up, bad decision imo.

That’s what I’ve been told. Besides, for beginners, like me, the expectation is not really to save hundredths of seconds, but to learn the line, braking and throttle points and to read the car. So even (in my case), if I had slicks, I would not be looking to get the best out of them.

also, here in FL rain can come without warning and I will be in a wall if the track is wet and I don’t know how to deal with it in a softer tire.

maybe. I am new to this.

and for the newbies out there, even going slow in the car is very exciting. I’m not bored at all. You can get overwhelmed with the amount of tasks to do even when going relatively slow. I know I will get faster and will take a more aggressive driving when my comfort increases.

I’m old enough to know that patience pays the best dividends when learning something .

 

[tomfree]

I know I will get faster and will take a more aggressive driving when my comfort increases.

Zeroing in on this line for an "Instructor teaching moment." As you progress through the groups, you should always be putting yourself in a place at least a little outside your comfort zone, as that's where the real learning happens.

Doing things better, memorizing lines, etc...whatever you are working on, part of that process should be making you at least a little uncomfortable. When you get comfortable with what you're working on...find something new to stretch that comfort zone. If you are robotically turning laps "inside your comfort zone", you aren't learning vey much.

When you "know the line" - change your line to make yourself adjust. Enter a turn full track right instead of full track left and put the rest of the turn together to end up at a good, safe place on track at the end of the turn to allow you go set up for the "correct" line for the next element.

Do not confuse this with a code brown moment where you're way over the line and things get bent and unshiny...

 

[F348]

Zeroing in on this line for an "Instructor teaching moment." As you progress through the groups, you should always be putting yourself in a place at least a little outside your comfort zone, as that's where the real learning happens.

Doing things better, memorizing lines, etc...whatever you are working on, part of that process should be making you at least a little uncomfortable. When you get comfortable with what you're working on...find something new to stretch that comfort zone. If you are robotically turning laps "inside your comfort zone", you aren't learning vey much.

When you "know the line" - change your line to make yourself adjust. Enter a turn full track right instead of full track left and put the rest of the turn together to end up at a good, safe place on track at the end of the turn to allow you go set up for the "correct" line for the next element.

Do not confuse this with a code brown moment where you're way over the line and things get bent and unshiny...

This is very good advice.

I would agree that before you leave the solo group, you want to be comfortable with offline turn-ins. Practice braking on the inside as if you were making a pass in the braking zone when there is no one behind you. It is the best time to practice that skill prior to moving up and having to do it side by side. Many drivers move up without that skill and then don't feel comfortable trying it side by side for the first time; and instead just wait to pass on straights, like in the novice group.

 

[Rob_SER]

that also comes with confidence that the people around you are thrust worthy and know what they are doing, that's not only a case of confidence in your own abilities

 

[F348]

that also comes with confidence that the people around you are thrust worthy and know what they are doing, that's not only a case of confidence in your own abilities

True, that is where the group you run with and their systems for moving up groups is important. I am also assuming passing with a point by as we are discussing moving up from solo to intermediate.

 

[tomfree]

We have folks with a variety of "racing" backgrounds and experience on the thread. I put big air quotes around racing because that's what normies call everything we do.

I started in the late 90s with auto-x, did my first HPDE in '02, competed in my first actual race (24 hrs of LeMons) in '08, and then did my first OneLap in '22 (time trial format). I used to instruct for HPDE for a couple of years, but I don't anymore. I'm not a "fast guy", but having driven a bunch of cars on a bunch of tracks, with some real W2W racing thrown in, I know a little.

I'm happy to share, and especially happy to tell someone some of the stuff I wish I'd been told.

 

[razorlab]

that also comes with confidence that the people around you are thrust worthy and know what they are doing, that's not only a case of confidence in your own abilities

100% agree and also to know what to do when the other guy ends up being a jackass. Like this guy that pointed me by then decided to try to run into my door.

 

[bushido]

Couple questions for the folks who've widened the front tires (specifically for the stock rims):

- How much did you widen the front tires by?

- Did you notice any loss in feel or responsiveness?

- Any benefits felt from widening the fronts?

I'm overdue to replace my OEM tires and have been thinking about widening front/rears but the more I think about it, since this car isn't AWD I don't know how much benefit widening the front tires would be compared to the rear and if I would just be sacrificing feel and response.

Currently looking to run 265/35/19 up front and 285/35/19 at the rear.

running the exact setup you mention-- about 3 track days and 2 autoX events on them. they perform great until the end of the sessions. PS4S get eaten quickly if you're driving hard-- i suspect at least -3° front camber is needed to help. for that reason i skip a session or/and don't run the last few minutes. takes me two laps or so to warm up at HMS

all the benefits, including looks! i ditched spacers

 

[tomfree]

100% agree and also to know what to do when the other guy ends up being a jackass. Like this guy that pointed me by then decided to try to run into my door.

I'm thankful for the opposite - someone who knew exactly what to do and saved my butt...I had a moment at NJMP where I was passing a guy I knew reasonably well on the inside of 1. I threw the car into the turn with a bunch of trail braking, and I simply didn't have enough front grip to turn in and pushed into his line...which he anticipated and had already given me a wide berth, avoiding contact and making for a bad race for both of us.

 

[tomfree]

running the exact setup you mention-- about 3 track days and 2 autoX events on them. they perform great until the end of the sessions. PS4S get eaten quickly if you're driving hard-- i suspect at least -3° front camber is needed to help. for that reason i skip a session or/and don't run the last few minutes

Another thought...I was in an intermediate group years ago and told my instructor I was bringing the car in early because the tires were greasy and the car was moving around a lot.

We chatted after the session and his input was: "When this happens again...stay out and make yourself adjust to the fact that the tires are greasy, or the brakes are hot. You won't run as fast of a lap time, but you'll learn a lot about driving near the limit because the limit of your car is now a lot lower."

If you're getting brain fade, tired, etc...bring the car in. If the car is broken/about to break, bring the car in.

If you're mentally ready and the car is healthy...but the car changes at the end of a session, challenge yourself to stay out and adapt.

 

[spaghettihoes]

If you're trying to increase your speed and find the limit most people tend to push out their braking zone but braking too late is when people tend to get into hot water. Too much trail braking and throttle application are the other cases where things can get ugly when people aren't comfortable with oversteer situations.

Instead focus on finding the mid corner speed that your tires begin hitting their limit or making some noise. If reached gradually on throttle (with early braking and a slower entry) you should be able to induce understeer and generally find what your mid corner speed limit is. From there work backwards to find what braking point and force is required to get you to around that mid corner speed so you can do so safely.

I also suggest to always have your Supra infotainment on the tire monitor, especially for early sessions or cold tires. If you're using TPMS it comes with a temp sensor so as your tires come up to temp (90-100 degrees on RT660s) you can begin to push them more until they hit their target temp (around 130-140 for RT660s).

 

[Gabe]

If you're trying to increase your speed and find the limit most people tend to push out their braking zone but braking too late is when people tend to get into hot water. Too much trail braking and throttle application are the other cases where things can get ugly when people aren't comfortable with oversteer situations.

Instead focus on finding the mid corner speed that your tires begin hitting their limit or making some noise. If reached gradually on throttle (with early braking and a slower entry) you should be able to induce understeer and generally find what your mid corner speed limit is. From there work backwards to find what braking point and force is required to get you to around that mid corner speed so you can do so safely.

I also suggest to always have your Supra infotainment on the tire monitor, especially for early sessions or cold tires. If you're using TPMS it comes with a temp sensor so as your tires come up to temp (90-100 degrees on RT660s) you can begin to push them more until they hit their target temp (around 130-140 for RT660s).

This is all great info. Any suggestions on tire pressures and temps for the PS4S or the Continentals?

 

[spaghettihoes]

I never tracked them unfortunately but people are saying online around 32-33 psi hot for either of them. I would start around there (likely around 27 or 28 cold) and try to see where your tires are wearing. If you're getting more wear on the outsides you're under and if it's in the middle you're overinflated although your alignment and particularly how much camber you're running is going to affect the wear as well as the shoulders are gonna take a beating with stock camber.

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