News, Updates, and Discussions on next-gen A100 Supra

[KahnBB6]

Interesting. A Toyota-Mazda partnership for a RWD 2-door coupe and/or 4-door sport sedan is what had been hinted at before given Mazda's own development of straight-six engines (including a turbo variant).

Now this makes it even more interesting. Toyota has their own chassis/platform they've developed for the next Supra and next Lexus coupe... but how or if Mazda's RX-7/9 fits into using any of the Toyota developed hardware is my question.

That... and it still stand out to me that the G16E 3-cyl turbo engine, stout and tuneable as it is, could be doubled into a Toyota I-6 (or maybe it was derived from a quietly developed prototype I-6 as has been suggested).

...Either way we have two Japanese automakers who have their own plans to introduce RWD performance cars developed in-house in some way and both of them either already have an I-6 engine family or have all the means readily available to be able to create their own I-6 engine family should they decide to.

For Mazda I do wish they would released some form of their 16X rotary prototype or even a sophisticated "rev with acceleration" series hybrid rotary with very aggressive tuning/programming. But at the same time I also feel it would be a lost opportunity for Mazda to develop their I-6 turbo engine and not use it in a high performance coupe or sedan model of some kind. Both from Mazda at the same time would be good.

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[bushido]

Interesting. A Toyota-Mazda partnership for a RWD 2-door coupe and/or 4-door sport sedan is what had been hinted at before given Mazda's own development of straight-six engines (including a turbo variant).

Now this makes it even more interesting. Toyota has their own chassis/platform they've developed for the next Supra and next Lexus coupe... but how or if Mazda's RX-7/9 fits into using any of the Toyota developed hardware is my question.

That... and it still stand out to me that the G16E 3-cyl turbo engine, stout and tuneable as it is, could be doubled into a Toyota I-6 (or maybe it was derived from a quietly developed prototype I-6 as has been suggested).

...Either way we have two Japanese automakers who have their own plans to introduce RWD performance cars developed in-house in some way and both of them either already have an I-6 engine family or have all the means readily available to be able to create their own I-6 engine family should they decide to.

For Mazda I do wish they would released some form of their 16X rotary prototype or even a sophisticated "rev with acceleration" series hybrid rotary with very aggressive tuning/programming. But at the same time I also feel it would be a lost opportunity for Mazda to develop their I-6 turbo engine and not use it in a high performance coupe or sedan model of some kind. Both from Mazda at the same time would be good.

you keep mentioning development, so i assume you do not know.. mazda does have their own 3.3L inline-6. single turbo and hybrid assist. i believe in both their CX-90 and CX-70 (hopefully "for now")

 

[PerformanceSound]

3.3\2=1.65

Which came first, the chicken or the egg?

 

[supraboi]

 

[bushido]

3.3\2=1.65

Which came first, the chicken or the egg?

and i assume they intend to use the GR DAT instead of working with ZF again?

 

[KahnBB6]

you keep mentioning development, so i assume you do not know.. mazda does have their own 3.3L inline-6. single turbo and hybrid assist. i believe in both their CX-90 and CX-70 (hopefully "for now")

I have known about Mazda’s 3.3L inline-6 for some time now. Both its hybrid and single turbo variants. I’ve seen the SUVs powered by them all over the place.

When they first announced it one of my early thoughts was “so is Toyota going to partner with them and use this engine for a sports coupe, sport sedan or even the Supra?”

What I was talking about in my post is that IF Toyota does end up using the 3.3L Mazda I6 turbo engine for a joint venture performance model it will still need to be developed further and improved as a tougher high performance engine.

But also, Toyota’s G16E I-3 turbo is stout as hell and has been tuned up into the 600whp-700whp range.

There is always the possibility that they could combine two of those and thus have another I-6 engine based on Toyota design.

The two directions this could go as to an I-6 engine powered Toyota is what makes this news interesting.

 

[KahnBB6]

3.3\2=1.65

Which came first, the chicken or the egg?

This occurred to me but what a laugh if the very engine we have all been wishing Toyota would make WASN’T a mere Toyota prototype that was “divided from” in order to get the G16E…

…but instead was a series of Mazda I-6 engines which Toyota piggybacked their own R&D onto in order to divide from it and develop their G16E I-3.

Either way I’d believe that all through development, no matter which company first decided to start design on an inline-six, Toyota engineers have likely had a hand in it just the same as was the case with BMW B58 refinement.

 

[Zboy]

 

[puzzled]

Who are these cars for? Only a few of us can afford these useless sports cars in the upper middle class with situation getting worse, rich folks will continue to be rich and buy exotics. Japan continues to be poor for most normal folks (same as USA, rich folks are rich and buys exotics).

It's not retarded like the new Prelude, thankfully.

 

[KahnBB6]

Who are these cars for? Only a few of us can afford these useless sports cars in the upper middle class with situation getting worse, rich folks will continue to be rich and buy exotics. Japan continues to be poor for most normal folks (same as USA, rich folks are rich and buys exotics).

It's not retarded like the new Prelude, thankfully.

From the manufacturer and engineer point of view I think they're going in on these types of vehicles now because on the global scale they have about a decade within which they can make various kinds of niche ICE or mostly ICE powered vehicles.

They probably see it as seizing the opportunity while they can to have these vehicles on offer before the regulations and maturing electric technology change their options by 2035.

That's not to say there aren't going to be the same style of niche sporty brand new vehicles past that timeframe... just that they probably won't be pure ICE or ICE at all by then.

As for most people being able to actually afford niche models like these... yeah the poor to wealth gap has been getting worse rather than better for most. I am glad this sporty car renaissance is happening now during such a crucial time so that these models exist but it is not a great time for most people financially.

....

The new Prelude... ugh. As a former owner of a 5th generation Type SH I'm very disappointed. I loved that car but it was lacking in a few areas even when it was new. Over two decades later it comes back still as wrong-wheel-drive and with roughly the same 200hp as before.

...only now with just a CVT and no manual transmission option? No thanks.

Also personally I still like the looks of the 1997-2001 5th generation much more than that of the new 6th gen. But in today's world I am glad Honda at least kept it as the true two door low to the ground coupe body style that a Prelude is expected to be.

It's funny to me that my GR86 is roughly the same class of car with the same everyday usability but has all the features I used to wish my old Prelude had (RWD layout, a factory LSD, more horsepower, more torque, better more usable powerband, -200lbs lighter)... and yet Honda officials stated at the unveiling that their 6th gen Prelude is not intended to compete with the Toyota GR86.

I think if the new Prelude had been given the CTR's 300hp engine, LSD and manual transmission in at least one trim level they would have many more people interested.

 

[BMWAF]

It's funny to me that my GR86 is roughly the same class of car with the same everyday usability but has all the features I used to wish my old Prelude had (RWD layout, a factory LSD, more horsepower, more torque, better more usable powerband, -200lbs lighter)... and yet Honda officials stated at the unveiling that their 6th gen Prelude is not intended to compete with the Toyota GR86.

This has to be the first time in recorded history where the 86 is praised for its "horsepower" and "torque." ?

 

[puzzled]

Trump is planning to impose 25% tariffs on auto imports starting 4/2.. so your $60K car just became $75K for the same thing.. GL

 

[GRMan]

This has to be the first time in recorded history where the 86 is praised for its "horsepower" and "torque." ?

It’s all relative. The GR86 2.4 has strong torque, more torque than any NA Cars from Honda bar the NSX.

i have drag raced Mk6 Golf GTi, JCW Countryman and came out ahead.

 

[BMWAF]

It’s all relative. The GR86 2.4 has strong torque, more torque than any NA Cars from Honda bar the NSX.

Yes it certainly is relative! The last NA Type Rs were the FN2/FD2 and yes, you're right they had less torque than your GR86.. but, you're telling me that in 17 YEARS the best Toyota/Subaru could muster was to increase the torques by only 35/48? ?

While underpowered relative to today's GR86s, I'd take an ancient properly reliable 8300RPM screaming K20x engine over a Subaru boxer any day of the week.

i have drag raced Mk6 Golf GTi, JCW Countryman and came out ahead.

Yeah. I've dragged and beat many many cars in my Type R.. especially when they weren't trying!

Apart from the fact that your most significant claim is beating relatively mild cars released over 15 years ago, I actually don't even think a stock MK6 GTI that's paying attention would lose to a GR86 anyway.. all things being equal. ?‍

 

[GRMan]

Yes it certainly is relative! The last NA Type Rs were the FN2/FD2 and yes, you're right they had less torque than your GR86.. but, you're telling me that in 17 YEARS the best Toyota/Subaru could muster was to increase the torques by only 35/48? ?

While underpowered relative to today's GR86s, I'd take an ancient properly reliable 8300RPM screaming K20x engine over a Subaru boxer any day of the week.



Yeah. I've dragged and beat many many cars in my Type R.. especially when they weren't trying!

Apart from the fact that your most significant claim is beating relatively mild cars released over 15 years ago, I actually don't even think a stock MK6 GTI that's paying attention would lose to a GR86 anyway.. all things being equal. ?‍

You wrong, the GTi was exhaust modded n wanted to race.

At the end of the day, the GR86 is fast in the first 3 gears because of light weight, instant NA response and short gearings. It feels the rawest out of all the GR cars. The 2.4 is more gutsy than any Honda NA Type R engines apart from the NSX.

You obviously have never owned one and just badmouthing it out of thin air. It’s significantly fsster than the old GT86. The car is very enjoyable to drive slow and fast right out of the box. For me, the Supra is only enjoyable to drive when going fast and that’s with coilovers, exhaust, much wider wheels and RE71RS. If I have to own one stock, I wouldn’t go with the Supra at all.. It’s a soft car out of the box. If I can mod obviously I would go for the Supra.

The new GR Yaris is also very enjoyable to drive and feels very much like the old Lancer Evolutions from another era.

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