275 tires and 18x11 vs 18x10 wheel fitment on stock shocks

[Shift9303]

Hey all, I will hopefully soon be an owner of a new GR Supra. I plan to do some light track duty with the car while keeping it as a fast "GT" ish dual duty vehicle for now. I have a S2000 that I have been tracking up to this point that will eventually be a more dedicated track car once fixed up. Because of this I'd like to keep the Supra stock ish for now while I'm still learning it. This means stock shocks though I'd like to go nonstagger to be able to rotate tires. Likely plan on 275/40/18 CRS.

I have read up a decent bit on wheel fitment considerations on this car. I am aware that when mounting 275 on the front you need to start pushing the wheel out because of back spacing against the stock spring perch and need to run effective +25 ish offset. However there are a couple things I'm trying to clarify that I couldn't seem to specifically find through searching.

1) Apex's article primarily comments on 18x10+30 with a 5 mm spacer to run 275s. But how about 18x11? Will there be any further back spacing issues against the stock spring perch? I'd like to get 18x11s for a little future proofing for coilovers and wider tires eventually in the future. I am aware that the extra stretch from the 18x11s over 10s will marginally widen the tire and I'm concerned that it may still cause interference.

2) What is the outer limit of hood/fender clearance? I have found some posts from people running 275 on T7's fitment with up to 15mm spacers meaning +23 offset? How low can I theoretically push offset. I'd like to know since I'm aware that not all tires are made the same and CRS run on the wide side.

3) How much camber should I aim for? I plan on likely getting camber plates. I understand front LCA are popular but tilting the strut inwards at the top should yield marginally more fender clearance. I am aware that the stock strut is limiting with the wide spring and most people max out at -2.7 ish stock.


Ideally I'd just want to slap on some camber plates, a stiffer front sway bar and run 275 nonstagger. I'm aware that the HKS HAS kit will provide extra inboard clearance but I'd rather not get it since it can wear out the shocks prematurely and I'd rather save and spend on a coilover in the future. But for now since I paid for the fancy pants stock electronic shocks I'd like to at least spend a season on them.

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[razorlab]

With 275/40/18 and not much camber you are going to rub/contact the outer fender liner/hood on every compression with enough spacer to fit 11's.

I even rub ever so slightly on the outer liner with -4.0 camber and 295/35/18 with 18x11 +28 on hard compressions

 

[Shift9303]

Thanks for input. For a strut car how much dynamic camber gain (or loss?) is there on compression that I can factor in for stock height compared to a lowered car? For ex: on the S2000 we naturally gain something like 0.5* camber for each inch of compression. So a stock height car with -2* front camber actually has slightly more clearance than a car lowered one inch but with camber reduced back down to -2*. To maintain same clearance on the S2000 when lowering you actually want to leave your static camber the same or increase it slightly from where it naturally sits after a drop. Regardless I'm going to guess not enough with just camber plates on the Supra and will need FLCA.

Did some more searching and found this thread:

https://www.supramkv.com/threads/18in-on-275-40-will-it-fit.26370/

Granted spacer size and camber setting wasn't disclosed but I'm assuming that effective offset was still around +25. Seems like the tire is just boxed in both inboard and outboard with the stock spring perches.

Coming from the S2000 I'm used to extremely tight clearance and rubbing absolutely everything but TBH don't want to deal with it on a brand new car. I think I'm just coming to accept that I'll need to get the HKS or FA sleeve kit and run the stock shocks for a season or two, or until they start leaking and then replace with coilovers. I still want to learn the car relatively stock since I'm not used to power; coming from the S2000 the throttle is relatively like an on and off switch with very little feathering once the car is hooked up.

 

[Subydude]

I run an 18x10.5 +35 and 275/35/18 or 275/40/18 on my car. With a 15mm spacer it makes my effective offset +20 and doesn't rub inbound or outbound lowered on H&R springs with -3.4 camber up front. An 11 would likely rub as Bryan mentioned and would definitely require changes to the spring perch.

There are 10.5" wide options out there, or 10.7" if you go with Titan7 stuff. Those make life a good bit easier as it's just enough to not rub. They also support the 275 better.

Speaking of square setups, I've only worn out one set of tires on the Supra this year but I think staggering them with a 275/295 on 10.5/11.5 wheels will be faster. Square allows you to rotate for longer wear, but I'd be happy to trade that option for the ability to put power down better mid-corner. Once you go coilover or change the perch up front then all bets are off and it's back to the drawing board for what size wheels/tires to run.

 

[razorlab]

You should have no problem putting power down mid corner on a stock powered supra unless your setup is wack.

Hell, I can even put power down mid corner with 295 RE71RS square with 500wtq+. Well, as long as it's 4th/5th gear corners.

I sometimes miss the ability to just mash the gas back when I had stock power.

 

[Subydude]

You should have no problem putting power down mid corner on a stock powered supra unless your setup is wack.

Hell, I can even put power down mid corner with 295 RE71RS square with 500wtq+. Well, as long as it's 4th/5th gear corners.

I sometimes miss the ability to just mash the gas back when I had stock power.

I've had some conversations about the 275/35/18 vs 295/35/18 vs 305/30/19 71RS and the general consensus is the 295/35/18 seems to put power down the best by far. The 275/35/18's I used had trouble in 3rd gear corners (Pitt Race T5 and T17), but the 295/35/18 would hold fine on another tuned Supra at the same event also in 3rd gear. We assumed it had something to do with sidewall compliance.

-2 rear camber and .2 degrees toe in per side on mine. I would chalk the rotation/wheel spin I had at CMP to the tires being mostly done at that point. I did try manually shifting and it would hold fine in higher gears, but if left in auto where it chose a better gear it would easily over power the grip out back.

Interestingly, the stock Michelin PSS put power down better at CMS than the 71RS did mid corner. I'm trying the 275/40/18 Yok for fun next at VIR and expect it will work better. I'm going to try upping the rear camber a bit after the test with the Yoks if they exhibit the same behavior.

I'm not expecting the ability to floor it everywhere, but I do expect it to not light up the rear as easily as it did on the 275/35 setup. The staggered setup is a good test for that, and I hope to test back to back early next year before any TA competitions.

 

[razorlab]

I've had some conversations about the 275/35/18 vs 295/35/18 vs 305/30/19 71RS and the general consensus is the 295/35/18 seems to put power down the best by far. The 275/35/18's I used had trouble in 3rd gear corners (Pitt Race T5 and T17), but the 295/35/18 would hold fine on another tuned Supra at the same event also in 3rd gear. We assumed it had something to do with sidewall compliance.

-2 rear camber and .2 degrees toe in per side on mine. I would chalk the rotation/wheel spin I had at CMP to the tires being mostly done at that point. I did try manually shifting and it would hold fine in higher gears, but if left in auto where it chose a better gear it would easily over power the grip out back.

Interestingly, the stock Michelin PSS put power down better at CMS than the 71RS did mid corner. I'm trying the 275/40/18 Yok for fun next at VIR and expect it will work better. I'm going to try upping the rear camber a bit after the test with the Yoks if they exhibit the same behavior.

I'm not expecting the ability to floor it everywhere, but I do expect it to not light up the rear as easily as it did on the 275/35 setup. The staggered setup is a good test for that, and I hope to test back to back early next year before any TA competitions.

When tuned, the tune has a lot to do with it as well. The street/car bowling/hot boi tunes requesting 900nm at 1500 rpm and 20% throttle will not work well on track.

I run a linear supercharger style boost curve on mine and it greatly helps with pulling out of corners.

 

[Subydude]

When tuned, the tune has a lot to do with it as well. The street/car bowling/hot boi tunes requesting 900nm at 1500 rpm and 20% throttle will not work well on track.

I run a linear supercharger style boost curve on mine and it greatly helps with pulling out of corners.

Undoubtedly. On my autox car I specifically lower actual throttle plate opening vs requested to make it easier to drive.

The driver of the tuned Supra mentioned it was an off the shelf tune that was more in line with what you reference as being "hot boi". Even with something not optimal the 295/35/18 was able to put the power down better than the 305/30/19, both being 71RS setups.

I've tried doing the normal engine setting in sport mode to lessen how touchy it is and it's helped, but the car was still more than happy to light up the rear.

Either way I think there's plenty of ways to solve this, but if you're on the stock tune and stock suspension then a staggered setup might help. I won't know for sure until I test, but my guesses are it'll make the car faster on track.

 

[Shift9303]

I run an 18x10.5 +35 and 275/35/18 or 275/40/18 on my car. With a 15mm spacer it makes my effective offset +20 and doesn't rub inbound or outbound lowered on H&R springs with -3.4 camber up front. An 11 would likely rub as Bryan mentioned and would definitely require changes to the spring perch.

There are 10.5" wide options out there, or 10.7" if you go with Titan7 stuff. Those make life a good bit easier as it's just enough to not rub. They also support the 275 better.

Speaking of square setups, I've only worn out one set of tires on the Supra this year but I think staggering them with a 275/295 on 10.5/11.5 wheels will be faster. Square allows you to rotate for longer wear, but I'd be happy to trade that option for the ability to put power down better mid-corner. Once you go coilover or change the perch up front then all bets are off and it's back to the drawing board for what size wheels/tires to run.

What 10.5 options are there? Apex EC7RS no longer seem to be available in the fitment. I'm aware of TSW Imatra and Kemora but production seems to be very limited or also discontinued? Enkei GTC02 are an option but TBH i'm not a fan of the design.


I'm also a pretty big fan of non stagger in most front engine applications, especially if it's like the Supra and ever so slightly forward biased. The fronts do most of the braking and turning so to me it only makes sense to maximize grip in all corners and then sort out corner behavior later with springs/sways/aero. I've even seen front engine Corvette drivers moving more towards nonstagger or minimal stagger.

Also one of my local tracks is a roval which destroys your passenger rear so being able to rotate will be super important.

You should have no problem putting power down mid corner on a stock powered supra unless your setup is wack.

Hell, I can even put power down mid corner with 295 RE71RS square with 500wtq+. Well, as long as it's 4th/5th gear corners.

I sometimes miss the ability to just mash the gas back when I had stock power.

I'll likely be staying stock power for a decent amount of time. I'm not really one to chase power and to be frank, seeing that Supras are dynoing around 370-380 wheel, it essentially makes double the power of my S2000 (190-195 wheel). That said I can't deny that I'm some what excited at the prospect of more power. Not to toot my own horn too much but I can put down a pretty decent lap time in my S2000 and as I've gotten faster it's only become more common that slow drivers under driving fast cars will bog my corner entry and then out drag me down the straight only to give me a limp wristed point by 2/3s the way to the braking zone.

My friends Supra seriously impressed me to get one before it's too late. With just 265/285 RE71RS and an Eibach bar he's putting down blistering times to rival much more prepped cars. He also has a GR86 which I'm pretty evenly matched with in my S2000. Getting to drive his 6MT kinda clinched that FOMO for me.

 

[Subydude]

What 10.5 options are there? Apex EC7RS no longer seem to be available in the fitment. I'm aware of TSW Imatra and Kemora but production seems to be very limited or also discontinued? Enkei GTC02 are an option but TBH i'm not a fan of the design.


I'm also a pretty big fan of non stagger in most front engine applications, especially if it's like the Supra and ever so slightly forward biased. The fronts do most of the braking and turning so to me it only makes sense to maximize grip in all corners and then sort out corner behavior later with springs/sways/aero. I've even seen front engine Corvette drivers moving more towards nonstagger or minimal stagger.

Also one of my local tracks is a roval which destroys your passenger rear so being able to rotate will be super important.




I'll likely be staying stock power for a decent amount of time. I'm not really one to chase power and to be frank, seeing that Supras are dynoing around 370-380 wheel, it essentially makes double the power of my S2000 (190-195 wheel). That said I can't deny that I'm some what excited at the prospect of more power. Not to toot my own horn too much but I can put down a pretty decent lap time in my S2000 and as I've gotten faster it's only become more common that slow drivers under driving fast cars will bog my corner entry and then out drag me down the straight only to give me a limp wristed point by 2/3s the way to the braking zone.

My friends Supra seriously impressed me to get one before it's too late. With just 265/285 RE71RS and an Eibach bar he's putting down blistering times to rival much more prepped cars. He also has a GR86 which I'm pretty evenly matched with in my S2000. Getting to drive his 6MT kinda clinched that FOMO for me.

I have the TSW Lasarth on mine from Tire Rack (pictured). They're not the lightest, but they're cheap(ish) 18x10.5 +35 wheels and seem to have held up well for the 3 track events I've used them in so far.

I generally prefer non-staggered applications as well and run that on a C5 track car since it just flat works. On the Supra I think staggered is fine, but am just posting my data points in terms of thinking the car will be faster on a stagger setup. My Supra has a front Eibach bar and while tuning it did tame the rear down some it wasn't a full fix (IMO). I'm sure if you had more adjustments and potentially tried a taller sidewall that it could be solved. In my case I wanted to add mechanical grip via wider tires

In the end there are a ton of variables in play and starting with a square setup just to get on track then tuning from there is a good path. If it works for you then that's all that matters.

 

[razorlab]

There are some decent options. I have three sets of 18x10.5, a set of 18x11, a set of 19x10, a set of staggered 19x9/19x10.

Square is faster if setup correctly. You want as much front grip as you can get.

 

[FLtrackdays]

What 10.5 options are there? Apex EC7RS no longer seem to be available in the fitment. I'm aware of TSW Imatra and Kemora but production seems to be very limited or also discontinued? Enkei GTC02 are an option but TBH i'm not a fan of the design.


I'm also a pretty big fan of non stagger in most front engine applications, especially if it's like the Supra and ever so slightly forward biased. The fronts do most of the braking and turning so to me it only makes sense to maximize grip in all corners and then sort out corner behavior later with springs/sways/aero. I've even seen front engine Corvette drivers moving more towards nonstagger or minimal stagger.

Also one of my local tracks is a roval which destroys your passenger rear so being able to rotate will be super important.




I'll likely be staying stock power for a decent amount of time. I'm not really one to chase power and to be frank, seeing that Supras are dynoing around 370-380 wheel, it essentially makes double the power of my S2000 (190-195 wheel). That said I can't deny that I'm some what excited at the prospect of more power. Not to toot my own horn too much but I can put down a pretty decent lap time in my S2000 and as I've gotten faster it's only become more common that slow drivers under driving fast cars will bog my corner entry and then out drag me down the straight only to give me a limp wristed point by 2/3s the way to the braking zone.

My friends Supra seriously impressed me to get one before it's too late. With just 265/285 RE71RS and an Eibach bar he's putting down blistering times to rival much more prepped cars. He also has a GR86 which I'm pretty evenly matched with in my S2000. Getting to drive his 6MT kinda clinched that FOMO for me.

If you stay at stock power (like me), a square setup works quite well. I’m on 275/35 tires with 18’ Apex wheels. Tons of tires available in that size. If you don’t lower the car, get some spacers and camber plates = good to go

I came from a dedicated S2K track car and the Zupra is very easy to modulate power. You’re not going to loose control like you would in a Bugatti. The S2K is so tail happy. You’re going to find this car much easier to drive. You’ll likely want some toe out up front like I did, coming from a S2000. Again, just don’t lower her, get some spacers, and tilt the tires away from the hood (fender) so you don’t rub. You’re going to be quite surprised how easily she sets up for track.

 

[Shift9303]

At this point I'm likely going to get the HKS HAS and set it for only a mild drop. The clearance for Nankang CRS in 275/40/18 seems too tight for my liking. Would like to go with the 40 aspect ratio to maintain the speedo. Likely in the future will go for RE71RS once I go to 295s as they're my preferred compound.

BTW I know this is tangential, but what front sway bars are people running? Are there any super fancy splined sway bars like Karcepts for the Supra? I think I'm leaning towards the Eibach bar at this point.

 

[razorlab]

At this point I'm likely going to get the HKS HAS and set it for only a mild drop. The clearance for Nankang CRS in 275/40/18 seems too tight for my liking. Would like to go with the 40 aspect ratio to maintain the speedo. Likely in the future will go for RE71RS once I go to 295s as they're my preferred compound.

BTW I know this is tangential, but what front sway bars are people running? Are there any super fancy splined sway bars like Karcepts for the Supra? I think I'm leaning towards the Eibach bar at this point.

Out of curiosity, why is speedo accuracy valuable for you? I personally rarely look at the speedo on track. Probably only in the straights when I have some breathing room. Also, speedo is going to be off anyway, no matter the diameter you have.

Sway bars are really going to depend on your setup and what you are looking for. They are tuning devices.

I went down to a OEM sized front bar but solid (whileline) because the bigger Cusco made the car too pushy for me. I even prefer slight push (it's faster anyway), but the bigger bar was too much with my setup.

 

[Shift9303]

I'm just OCD like that. I have my weird fixations. I know the 295s will be shorter overall but at that point I'll be past it.

I'm not necessarily asking about stiffness, though I understand that the eibach is one of the stiffer ones available, more so the adjustability. Karcepts bar has me spoiled on the S2000.

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