About to pull the trigger....MKV or MKIV or GTR?

kona61

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The R35 is a beast, I have no doubt about this. Every single R35 I have ever driven, has put a big smile on my face....every single one. It's no surprise the fastest guys at 2K events are running GTR's. I have put an offer on a used R35, two MKV's, and one MKIV.



I agree...there’s no doubt the new auto cars are much faster than manual cars, but the overall driving pleasure is second to none in a manual car. I’ve come to accept that manual cars are almost all but gone....it’s why the MKV and R35 are on my list.

Also (just throwing this out there), I know the MKIV’s 6spd is great, but I personally have yet to come across a used example that doesn’t have a “crunchy” Getrag box for under $60k. A proper rebuild is (as most people know) NOT cheap. Also not something I want to take on.
I think for how long you’ve been on this forum and how much you have defended this car, it would be surprising if you ended up purchasing another vehicle.

I like the GTR, but it’s not that fun on backroads or just cruising. It’s a bit too big and a bit too disconnected to be a fun sports car. Now it is insanely tunable and ridiculously fast.

The MKIV is a little too old and getting very difficult to get parts for which is a big reason I wouldn’t buy one as my weekend car.




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PerformanceSound

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I think for how long you’ve been on this forum and how much you have defended this car, it would be surprising if you ended up purchasing another vehicle.

I like the GTR, but it’s not that fun on backroads or just cruising. It’s a bit too big and a bit too disconnected to be a fun sports car. Now it is insanely tunable and ridiculously fast.

The MKIV is a little too old and getting very difficult to get parts for which is a big reason I wouldn’t buy one as my weekend car.
I don’t disagree with you at all...lol. The few who know me outside these forums, know I go through cars like socks. I get bored with cars quickly. I agree that the MKIV is not the ideal choice, but it’s powerplant and support is defined very well...which means a quicker and cheaper build up time of a very powerful car. The R35 is in the same boat, except not as cheap to modify. The MKV is fantastic, I truly am impressed with the platform and my original plan was to wait til’ 2022 to let the platform mature more...and hope for rumors of a manual to be available. The manual option (as I’ve mentioned before) is a big factor...but not a deal breaker. I like the MKV and R35 almost equally, and the MKIV is fun to drive with a manual. I think my choice will be down to a MKV and R35. I fly to California Sunday to see a MKV and a MKIV though.
 

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Sounds like you're tired of waiting for a possible manual. You thinking you might just get the auto and sell it for a manual if it becomes available?
 
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Sounds like you're tired of waiting for a possible manual. You thinking you might just get the auto and sell it for a manual if it becomes available?
Absolutely! I figure if I get a MKV now and in two years a manual is available, the trade-in difference hopefully won’t be terrible.
 

r35pect

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Those are completely different cars there and you have to ask yourself what your intent is with them. Two of those are closest in comparison when strictly speaking daily use and weekend power plays. One of those is strictly an art piece that you can literally design to be anything but you would be mad to daily or semi daily unless you don't care about the risks associated with it.

The r35 is a capable daily driver and a weekend bruiser all in one. I love mine. If you want something more modern that requires little to no restoration needs depending on year and want to make great and usable power for fairly reasonable costs; the GTR is very hard to beat currently. Only thing is long term, once you hit a certain point with power mods, the next jump is very very costly. That's why most GTRs (and I'm not referring to youtube ones with 1400+ horsepower) are strictly FBO w/ flex fuel. Not that bad to work on when it comes to simple bolt-ons but maintenance is costly if you have it done by the dealership.

I like the looks of the mkv and the power they are putting out with cheap simple mods (like the mkiv's of yesteryear) but would never purchase one to daily because of the visibility inside. It reminded me of my old daily 370z nismo sitting inside trying to look out the back and quarter windows. As a weekend car, this would definitely fit the bill for a newer, fresher car to own though. You will take a hit on deprecation harder since you will more than likely be purchasing new from the sounds of your price points.

I also own a 98 turbo supra and can tell you if you cant work on a MKIV supra yourself and are not okay with having it sit in the garage 90% of the year to only be driven on nice predictable days; then I would stay away. If you're anything like me, the second you get it you will be replacing moldings, seals, bolts, nuts, clips, screws, glass, trim pieces, panels etc...to refresh all the old weathered parts and have it in comparable condition to a new car. Then comes the maintenance to completely refresh the motor, transmission, suspension, differential, steering, etc...The youngest USDM supra is 21 years old now and not many people who have already done the heavy lifting in restoring these cars are out their willingly selling them so you will more than likely be ending up with an okay supra that requires a ton of work depending on your level of detail and standards.

And we haven't even touched on the power aspect of things and how easy it ease to make if you are starting with a great base.....You may say you plan to buy as-is and just drive and enjoy but you wont. Unless it was an ultra low mile car, I would never just buy a turbo mkiv supra and leave it at that no matter how well it may run. A lot of people cut corners and you may not care about details but if you do, this will drive you up the wall and have you tearing her apart very quickly. One small thing always lead into a full motor restoration or body restoration or interior restoration. This isn't a get and forget it type of car like the r35 and mkv supra. Unless you're prepared to restore and drive a classic and be capable of handling most of the work, then I would either stay far away or reach deep into you pockets to be sending that mkiv supra to a reputable shop.
 

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Sounds like you have a daily and just want a weekend car/track car.....GTR is my vote. If it was more of a street car, MKV Supra, you pay Toyota price for a BMW-ish car. Two very different cars though, so it is hard to pick one or the other. Driving the GTR on the street is 99% boring. For track, it's amazing. People who say GTR is boring likely has not taken the car to its limit or just haven't spend enough time with it, sure not 911 fun, but it is not robotic or boring by any means.
 

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I’ve had my GT-R since 2012. FBO E85 and 600+ whp. I also have a 2016 M3 Competition. Swapped my M3 with my friend’s MKV Supra (with downpipe and tune) and loved it. Great car. Sound was way better than my M3 and it was faster. I didn’t love the auto tranny though. Wish it was a DCT. Overall a great daily driver, though I wish it had some rear seats. It’s a better daily than the GT-R if you are talking about comfort. In a perfect world, I would get a MKV for the weekdays, and just drive my GT-R on the weekends. If I had to pick just one car though, I would stick with the GT-R. It’s just a beast. The awd platform just lets you use all of the horsepower, whether it’s 700, 800, or 1000hp. I’ve driven several 1000hp GT-Rs and they are just awesome. Much easier to drive than an 800hp MKIV Supra. Then again, that’s no longer a daily driver. If you have the money, I’d go with a 911 Turbo S. Spent some time in one recently and it’s just like the GT-R but better, but just too expensive. Literally double the cost of a GT-R.



 

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I have a built Mk3 and a stock mk5. Mk3, like the mk4, is a beast, but no daily driver. mkv is super fun, great gas mileage, great daily, turns heads and gets lots of compliments, and was a great value at list price. i could sell it for more than i paid. As an old supra guy I get the complaints, but supra or not, its a really well designed, balanced, fun car, better than a z4 for a lot less.
 
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Those are completely different cars there and you have to ask yourself what your intent is with them. Two of those are closest in comparison when strictly speaking daily use and weekend power plays. One of those is strictly an art piece that you can literally design to be anything but you would be mad to daily or semi daily unless you don't care about the risks associated with it.

The r35 is a capable daily driver and a weekend bruiser all in one. I love mine. If you want something more modern that requires little to no restoration needs depending on year and want to make great and usable power for fairly reasonable costs; the GTR is very hard to beat currently. Only thing is long term, once you hit a certain point with power mods, the next jump is very very costly. That's why most GTRs (and I'm not referring to youtube ones with 1400+ horsepower) are strictly FBO w/ flex fuel. Not that bad to work on when it comes to simple bolt-ons but maintenance is costly if you have it done by the dealership.

I like the looks of the mkv and the power they are putting out with cheap simple mods (like the mkiv's of yesteryear) but would never purchase one to daily because of the visibility inside. It reminded me of my old daily 370z nismo sitting inside trying to look out the back and quarter windows. As a weekend car, this would definitely fit the bill for a newer, fresher car to own though. You will take a hit on deprecation harder since you will more than likely be purchasing new from the sounds of your price points.

I also own a 98 turbo supra and can tell you if you cant work on a MKIV supra yourself and are not okay with having it sit in the garage 90% of the year to only be driven on nice predictable days; then I would stay away. If you're anything like me, the second you get it you will be replacing moldings, seals, bolts, nuts, clips, screws, glass, trim pieces, panels etc...to refresh all the old weathered parts and have it in comparable condition to a new car. Then comes the maintenance to completely refresh the motor, transmission, suspension, differential, steering, etc...The youngest USDM supra is 21 years old now and not many people who have already done the heavy lifting in restoring these cars are out their willingly selling them so you will more than likely be ending up with an okay supra that requires a ton of work depending on your level of detail and standards.

And we haven't even touched on the power aspect of things and how easy it ease to make if you are starting with a great base.....You may say you plan to buy as-is and just drive and enjoy but you wont. Unless it was an ultra low mile car, I would never just buy a turbo mkiv supra and leave it at that no matter how well it may run. A lot of people cut corners and you may not care about details but if you do, this will drive you up the wall and have you tearing her apart very quickly. One small thing always lead into a full motor restoration or body restoration or interior restoration. This isn't a get and forget it type of car like the r35 and mkv supra. Unless you're prepared to restore and drive a classic and be capable of handling most of the work, then I would either stay far away or reach deep into you pockets to be sending that mkiv supra to a reputable shop.
I feel the same, the more I talk to MKIV owners...the more I feel like if I get a MKIV, I won't enjoy it because I will be too afraid of something happening to it as a weekend/track car. Let's be real, the chances of a track car getting dings and dents and body damage is good. To do that to a 20yr+ car that 90% of it's body parts are discontinued is making me not want to proceed with a MKIV. I am schedule to see the R35 tomorrow and the MKV on Friday.
 

r35pect

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I feel the same, the more I talk to MKIV owners...the more I feel like if I get a MKIV, I won't enjoy it because I will be too afraid of something happening to it as a weekend/track car. Let's be real, the chances of a track car getting dings and dents and body damage is good. To do that to a 20yr+ car that 90% of it's body parts are discontinued is making me not want to proceed with a MKIV. I am schedule to see the R35 tomorrow and the MKV on Friday.
There are better track cars out there that are much cheaper to repair and maintain so I wouldn't be looking at doing that to mkiv supra unless you had more than 1 and can work on them or have deep pockets and don't give a f**k.

As a fair-weather type of car, the mkiv supra is hard to beat when it comes to street presence and history with car enthusiasts. If this is mainly it's intent, then a mkiv supra would be my pick over the other two.

As a combination car, the r35 or mkv would be much better choices.
 

He_drives

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I own year one mk4 supra and year one r35 Gtr And 997.2 gt3.
The mk4 should be treated like a classic great power but comes with alot of minor costs to repair such as seals bushings etc to keep it in a great shape. you have to have a yearly budget to keep it at top shape. My last order of oem trans repairs parts came from France, Brazil and Australia fun factor is the highest of any of my cars.

The R35 has been isues free with bolt ons for the last 10 years used it as a daily for 3, very usable, $120-$150 oil changes. tires are $2000 use aftermarket breakpads and forget them the only time I wouldn't recommend it is when you have bad paved roads it becomes unbearabley unbalanced noisy and ugly, feeling wise alot to be desired as your not always full throttle .

If your looking for an investment that your going to drive and enjoy it's a manual 997.2 gt3/turbo/gt2 porche but comes with a cost.

you have a problem in your garage like mine called an sti its the best daily car in the world would you share split the week days between the mkv and the STi? I'm telling my self I would but I always go back to my STi.

The mkv is new alot of development is coming and that makes it the most interesting platform out of all the choices if you love to mod, build and try new setups it's the way to go be a experimental and pioneering
All are fun in there own way you chose your path

Classic life style mk4 supra, mega power GTR, investment porsche, pioneering mk5 supra.
 

Z8AKU

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I have owned a CBA 2009 GT-R and a DBA 2012 GT-R. 2009 model was FBO/E85 and the 2012 was intakes, down pipes 100 octane tune. Both were very fast however, I never felt connected to either of them. The interiors to me seem cheap and/or borrowed from an Altima. The two back seats are good for nothing more than maybe throwing a laptop or your gym clothes in for a trip. It's a heavy car that's a one trick pony (straight line performance). I have drag raced them both, taken them both on full road course events and even on many open cruises through some very tough canyons.

The GR6 transmission and the VR38's rods are it's Achilles heels on the R35. Once the R35 has been taken to full bolt-on with a flex kit you're pretty much done for adding power unless you begin building the transmission and block. 600whp and under 600 lb-ft is the limit on stock block and trans before you start blowing things up. The VR38DETT is known for bending stock rods past 600 lb-ft and for blowing a stock GR6 transmission at these torque numbers. Then there is the dreaded bell house issue that most forget to mention. It's notorious for stripping out after launch control being used often. It begins to rattle worse than the stock GR6 transmission already does and causes sonic vibrations to travel down the drive shafts alerting the knock sensors on the block which put the car into good ol' limp mode every time. Replaced several of those with Nismo's alleged revised parts and it did not make a difference. Brake fade is equally horrible as the bell house issue mentioned too. Upon road course events the GT-R after one session experienced horrible brake fade and I would get transmission temp warnings. In some instances I was thrown into limp mode during a few sessions. Literally, had to limp off track and then go drive the car out of R mode at low speeds to cool it down. The Porsche's handed the GT-R severe beat downs without effort on track days during road course events. No competition! A stock GT3/GT3RS walked circles around my FBO/E85 600whp GT-R. I would catch them on the straights and then get lit up through the turns.

The used market on the GT-R has come down considerably and it's becoming more common to see more and more used GT-R's popping up at meets driven by 18 year old boys who burnt through their college money. Even fully built wide body GT-R's with the most intense liveries are ignored or passed up at the meets I go to. It's yesterdays news and everyone has seen the best of the best and the fastest GT-R's. Really nowhere left to go on that platform.

The MKIV Supra, although a timeless classic JDM car had it's time of glory in the 2000's. It's just that in today's standards, a classic. The iconic 2JZ and 6 speed Getrag manual transmission combo are merely a thing of the past now. Any manual these days will struggle to keep up with any auto transmission whether it's conventional or DCT. The 2020 MKV with just a down pipe and tune walks a BPU MKIV easily. Even a 700whp BPU++ MKIV struggles to get away from a BPU MKV. Sure the MKIV still gets attention and is highly regarded as Japan's best known sports car from the 90's but now that the MKV is out the MKIV is slowly being shadowed by it's new sibling and those high priced used MKIV gems will be coming down in prices very soon as a result.

Within the first 3 months of the MKV release we have seen the platform go from a stock mid 12 second 1/4 mile to high 9's with basic modification on stock block and transmission. We have seen the MKV with an array of body kits and wheel combos as well as some serious engine development for future high horsepower builds. Hands down, the MKV as we all have now discovered is a true successor to the MKIV. The B58 and ZF combo are incredibly potent and when the tuning market is able to control all tuning aspects including the TCU maps we are going to see 8, 7 and 6 second MKV's very soon. The beauty of all this? The MKV builds can be done for a fraction of the cost that it would to build the other cars on the list i.e. R35 GT-R or the MKIV Supra. My only complaint about the MKV Supra is the stock suspension. It's sloppy from the factory. However, nothing that can't be remedied with a good set of springs, sway bars and bushings.

My guess is that the MKV Supra is going to go up in value rather than down like most have predicted. Why? The MKIV hype has been a major contributing factor for the massive MKV controversy and hate that the A90 has received recently. Bad publicity is always good. That Fast and Furious 9 will be featuring the A90 MKV on May 22, 2020 when it's released. Slated to appear in the iconic Lamborghini orange like Walker's MKIV in the original movie should provide even more demand on the A90 driving up prices. I would not be surprised to see the MKV's MSRP go up to $80K or even over $100K within the next few years.

For me the choice was easy. I went with the MKV and haven't looked back since. I have been converting so many haters and nay sayers along the way as well. A simple in person view of the car and one drive with a launch control demo and their pessimistic views are instantly converted to an optimistic questioning of how much does the car cost and where they can get one. Priceless!
 

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It's a heavy car that's a one trick pony (straight line performance). I have drag raced them both, taken them both on full road course events and even on many open cruises through some very tough canyons.
I get that you have your own opinion, but saying the GTR is a one trick pony in straight line speed is completely inaccurate. Maybe the stuff you have done to your cars turn it into total crap in corners, but the car is a lot more than a muscle car. It just so happens that 99% of the people who bought this car ends up turning it into a total pile of crap, and nothing but huge power.

On a more general note, not sure how a Porsche GT3 is brought up in this thread as the OP wasn't even asking. It is almost always that a GT3 wins in any type of comparison because they are on a different level in both price and performance.
 

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I get that you have your own opinion, but saying the GTR is a one trick pony in straight line speed is completely inaccurate. Maybe the stuff you have done to your cars turn it into total crap in corners, but the car is a lot more than a muscle car. It just so happens that 99% of the people who bought this car ends up turning it into a total pile of crap, and nothing but huge power.

On a more general note, not sure how a Porsche GT3 is brought up in this thread as the OP wasn't even asking. It is almost always that a GT3 wins in any type of comparison because they are on a different level in both price and performance.
I have owned 2 R35 GT-R both were modestly modified to FBO and even just partial FBO. Ran stock suspension, stock motor, stock turbos and stock transmission. Ran them both on Advan GT wheels with Toyo R888R tires and driving them on professional circuits and a pro NHRA drag strip constitutes my thoughts as more than mere opinion. Again, it's a one trick pony with factory OEM suspension, wheels and tires. Heavy body roll in turns, transmission and brakes are temperamental and are greatly effected by the slightest increments of additional heat from tracking. It's a very heavy car in fact, when I weighed my 2012 Black Edition with me in it and 1/4 tank of fuel it weighed 4,050 lbs. that's nearly 2 tons. The only reason the GT-R are quick is the AWD and DCT system other than that it's VR38DETT is a very feeble and weak power plant hence why it cannot handle over 600whp stock.
 

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Any time you put more power into a car while leaving the important components (i.e. suspension) OEM generally mess up the balance of the car, especially any forced induction car in which a tune can make a huge difference. I don't disagree with you about the weight, but that's a known fact.

Anyways, agree to disagree as it sounds like you just happen to have a very bad experience with the car. I too have spent time on the track and huge amount of autox in the GTR in the last 10 years since I have owned it. While I understand your complaints about the car, I never felt the need to make 600whp, instead, I focused on making the car turn better and handle better in transitions than Nissan has set it. "One trick pony" is reserved for cars like the Dodge Charger, Hellcats and the like. I wouldn't even say the Mustang and Camaro are one trick pony anymore as those cars have come a long way in recent years and they are fun to drive.
 

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