Analysis, Comments & Reactions from the Web about the new Supra

Z8AKU

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That’s not the same thing at all.



Where are these publications?

Feel free to provide a source that doesn’t repeat the same sentence I posted earlier.

You’re attacking me as a MKIV fanboy whose opinion wouldn’t change, but I’m here open to change my opinion yet you can’t even provide me a credible source.
It was claimed that someone called Johann Krause firm in 2011 and spoke to someone there that allegedly denied any involvement with Toyota or the 2JZ-GTE development when questioned about the publicized statements all over the internet. I never asserted or made any claims that Johann Krause did or didn't have involvement. I'm pointing out that whomever made such silly claims that Johann Krause didn't are full of shit. Johann Krause was acquired by Thyssenkrupp AG in 2006 so whomever stating that they called in or emailed back in 2011 couldn't have possibly spoke to anyone within Johann Krause firm as they had been bought out 5 years prior. So the evidence is very clear here.

1. We have many claims of such an involvement between Toyota with Johann Krause from many sources all over the internet.
2. We have historical evidence that Toyota has indeed sourced out their motors and various parts for co-development before and even have done so on several model Supras prior to even the A80 MKIV.
3. We have evidence that Johann Krause went out of business in 2006 that debunks the claim that someone spoke to them in 2011 and obtained a statement from them that they had no involvement.
4. We have evidence that Johann Krause engineered many other various auto manufactures motors and parts for years prior to 2006 and were indeed involved in many auto manufactures race engine developments especially in the early 90's and there are tons of news articles all about that history.
5. Not one person has shown evidence that substantiates that Toyota solely developed and engineered the 2JZ-GTE and most have known for years that the origin of the JZ line motors have been from the 3M GT motor from Yamaha.

Now then where is your evidence that supports what you think? Do you believe the 2JZ-GTE was solely developed and engineered by Toyota? Then please by all means nows your chance to prove it. You have an entire forum that is watching and eagerly awaiting these answers.

The floor is yours. I'll be waiting for your response. Make sure you do your homework first.
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justbake

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It was claimed that someone called Johann Krause firm in 2011 and spoke to someone there that allegedly denied any involvement with Toyota or the 2JZ-GTE development when questioned about the publicized statements all over the internet. I never asserted or made any claims that Johann Krause did or didn't have involvement. I'm pointing out that whomever made such silly claims that Johann Krause didn't are full of shit. Johann Krause was acquired by Thyssenkrupp AG in 2006 so whomever stating that they called in or emailed back in 2011 couldn't have possibly spoke to anyone within Johann Krause firm as they had been bought out 5 years prior. So the evidence is very clear here.

1. We have many claims of such an involvement between Toyota with Johann Krause from many sources all over the internet.
2. We have historical evidence that Toyota has indeed sourced out their motors and various parts for co-development before and even have done so on several model Supras prior to even the A80 MKIV.
3. We have evidence that Johann Krause went out of business in 2006 that debunks the claim that someone spoke to them in 2011 and obtained a statement from them that they had no involvement.
4. We have evidence that Johann Krause engineered many other various auto manufactures motors and parts for years prior to 2006 and were indeed involved in many auto manufactures race engine developments especially in the early 90's and there are tons of news articles all about that history.
5. Not one person has shown evidence that substantiates that Toyota solely developed and engineered the 2JZ-GTE and most have known for years that the origin of the JZ line motors have been from the 3M GT motor from Yamaha.

Now then where is your evidence that supports what you think? Do you believe the 2JZ-GTE was solely developed and engineered by Toyota? Then please by all means nows your chance to prove it. You have an entire forum that is watching and eagerly awaiting these answers.

The floor is yours. I'll be waiting for your response. Make sure you do your homework first.
So still no sources? Okay good talk.
 

jtsang25

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It was claimed that someone called Johann Krause firm in 2011 and spoke to someone there that allegedly denied any involvement with Toyota or the 2JZ-GTE development when questioned about the publicized statements all over the internet. I never asserted or made any claims that Johann Krause did or didn't have involvement. I'm pointing out that whomever made such silly claims that Johann Krause didn't are full of shit. Johann Krause was acquired by Thyssenkrupp AG in 2006 so whomever stating that they called in or emailed back in 2011 couldn't have possibly spoke to anyone within Johann Krause firm as they had been bought out 5 years prior. So the evidence is very clear here.

1. We have many claims of such an involvement between Toyota with Johann Krause from many sources all over the internet.
2. We have historical evidence that Toyota has indeed sourced out their motors and various parts for co-development before and even have done so on several model Supras prior to even the A80 MKIV.
3. We have evidence that Johann Krause went out of business in 2006 that debunks the claim that someone spoke to them in 2011 and obtained a statement from them that they had no involvement.
4. We have evidence that Johann Krause engineered many other various auto manufactures motors and parts for years prior to 2006 and were indeed involved in many auto manufactures race engine developments especially in the early 90's and there are tons of news articles all about that history.
5. Not one person has shown evidence that substantiates that Toyota solely developed and engineered the 2JZ-GTE and most have known for years that the origin of the JZ line motors have been from the 3M GT motor from Yamaha.

Now then where is your evidence that supports what you think? Do you believe the 2JZ-GTE was solely developed and engineered by Toyota? Then please by all means nows your chance to prove it. You have an entire forum that is watching and eagerly awaiting these answers.

The floor is yours. I'll be waiting for your response. Make sure you do your homework first.
Where are your legitimate sources. Blog posts hardly count as a legitimate source as anyone can write those. And just saying googling it will have many sources isnt sufficient. Produce the exact source of which any of your statements are said.
 

Z8AKU

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Holy hell. Seems I completely ignored this topic for a long while. Things escalated so quickly.

Sounds like someone needs to create a personal blog and rant about the engine there or join the guys over at SF.

My personal opinion: I'm in automotive industry. There are so many decisions, trials, outsourcing, external consultations... No matter what position you hold in the company unless you were in/directly involved in these or have 1st, close 2nd hand info, you can only have limited "educated" guesses, which I'll be bashed for, but who cares?
After development ends, even the engineers barely remember the cumbersome steps they took to get there. People here trying piece together a puzzle of history whilst calling names... just funny. :popcorn:
Yes, however you're leaving out the fact that when companies move to outsource a product from another company there are strict NDA and NCC agreements that come into play to protect the parties involved from infringement and or theft. What's fascinating is the bullshit story that someone had debunked the many claims and statements that Johann Krause engineering firm didn't have any involvement in the development or engineering of the 2JZ-GTE motor. A simple Google check on timelines provides empirical evidence that that claim is completely false.

Even with that evidence being presented here people are remaining stubborn to reason, and even question why anyone would go to great lengths to make up a rumor as bold about two major automotive companies. What was there to gain for such a rumor? If it was in fact a rumor, didn't anyone presume that Toyota or Johann Krause would have made public statements attesting that these allegations or claims were false when they were posted on the internet years ago?

Neither company has challenged the validity of the claims or statements that they worked together on the 2JZ-GTE motor so, therefore wouldn't that strike someone as giving some credibility that this isn't some rumor but perhaps the truth?
 

Z8AKU

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Blog posts are hardly good sources. It's not eve


Where are your legitimate sources. Blog posts hardly count as a legitimate source as anyone can write those. And just saying googling it will have many sources isnt sufficient. Produce the exact source of which any of your statements are said.
You're an idiot! Did you not read anything I posted?
 

Z8AKU

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Blog posts are hardly good sources. It's not eve


Where are your legitimate sources. Blog posts hardly count as a legitimate source as anyone can write those. And just saying googling it will have many sources isnt sufficient. Produce the exact source of which any of your statements are said.
How many blog posts? How many articles? How many other links where this information has been shared? TONS! Are you seriously that obtuse?
 

jtsang25

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How many blog posts? How many articles? How many other links where this information has been shared? TONS! Are you seriously that obtuse?
I'm saying blog posts arent legitimate sources. I saw the comments the several times you copied and pasted it. I could go write a blog post.
 

Z8AKU

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I'm saying blog posts arent legitimate sources. I saw the comments the several times you copied and pasted it. I could go write a blog post.
Great and would your blog show these emails and/or phone call from the person/s who contacted Johann Krause back in 2011? Please provide LOL
 

jtsang25

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Great and would your blog show these emails and/or phone call from the person/s who contacted Johann Krause back in 2011? Please provide LOL
I'm talking to a wall. I'm saying your sources arent good enough to support your claim. Get better ones and maybe the people involved will listen to you. A70TTR atleast works for toyota and has had some accurate information. His words have more legitimacy than some random person. Using blog posts as a source. I'm done. I don't really care where the engine is from I drive fast cars that's all that matters.
 
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zakira

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I remember asking in a thread somewhere what BMW guys think of BMWs getting bashed on by the (traditional) Supra community and I think I finally got my answer.
 

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@Z8AKU You know you can maybe e-mail yourself Toyota or this german company about your clams right?

Your arguments have no basis because from my understanding you don't understand how the internet works. Because an article is written 2007 does not mean it is real info, i mean if you search automotive sites right now you will see a "car story/rumour" and then 1 hour later all the other car sites have copied it and added minor stuff of their own but that does not mean that the original story is true just because it was kinda laundered by all the other websites.

p.s. don't go full boomer
 

FasTTurbo

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Does ANY of this matter on a car forum that doesn't use the 2JZ engine?
Maybe this conversation should be had on the the MK4 forums? o_O
Please no, we've had the conversation till blue in the face. You guys can keep this one.;)
Just staying subbed until z8Apu starts citing infowars.com for his lizard people defense creams.
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