Toyota Supra will have DCT & expect production car in Fall of 2018

[vb22]

The forum made the news again.

https://www.carscoops.com/2018/03/new-toyota-supra-might-sold-exclusively-dual-clutch-transmission/
https://www.motor1.com/news/237929/toyota-supra-dual-clutch-only/
https://carbuzz.com/news/new-toyota-supra-maybe-too-powerful-for-a-manual-gearbox

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[SupraFiend]

maybe too powerful for a manual lol. I'm not sure that part translated right, I think he was just saying that with the power of this motor that maybe it is fun enough with a DCT or will be just as fun with a DCT (disagree on both counts).

Also this didn't translate well either...
"However, I think that there is a meaning of MT adoption if it is said that even general people will taste the sequential type transmission installed in the racing car."

I'm not sure if he was saying there was a case for or against offering a MT based on general people trying the DCT.

 

[Modal170]

Fighting words if he meant the DCT is better than a manual. The more I hear about this, the more I wonder if A70 was here to pull a bait and switch on us.

 

[Christopher]

At this point Toyota might as well rename the Supra to BMW Z4 Coupe because what's the point of it any more.

I thought the idea was to make the Supra different from the Z4, just making the Supra with only a DCT will give fans and owners more of a reason to pass it off as a Z4 (even though they have the same engine).

 

[Suprame]

At this point Toyota might as well rename the Supra to BMW Z4 Coupe because what's the point of it any more.

I thought the idea was to make the Supra different from the Z4, just making the Supra with only a DCT will give fans and owners more of a reason to pass it off as a Z4 (even though they have the same engine).

I agree. Tada san keeps implying that their whole goal is to create a PURE sports car, not F1 car. What's more pure than a manual transmission for a sports car?

If a 6 speed Getrag manual transmission can handle 500+ HP, why not?

 

[Supraman]

^ Car politics + budget. During the early stages of this project I thought we could see a new manual sequential gear box for this thing if Toyota wanted to move on from the traditional manual. They could've used it on this and on the upcoming LC-F as an option as well as any other Lexus F car or any other future sports car. That alone would have been revolutionary I think.

But it seems like the budget for this car was extremely tight from the start.

 

[dawsonj87]

I'm so fed up with putting my energy towards hoping for a manual and an affordable base model. I'm just going to get a BRZ (which will actually provoke driving pleasure with a proper manual transmission) and call it a day. I don't understand why it's such a hard concept to grasp to just offer the car with a manual and make less of them if there is truly less demand. Both the turbo 4 and 6 from BMW are offered on other models in the BMW range with a manual, so it is doable-- check out the Z4 that is being co-developed with this car on the exact same platform! I totally understand that a DCT is faster, but I do not care. I like rowing my own gears. It is my form of self-expression, and is fun and makes me happy. The previous statement does not only apply to me, but many many enthusiasts. Toyota, you really messed up in my book if you continue this DCT only nonsense and try and justify it to enthusiasts; the more excuses you make the worse you're making yourself look IMO.

The whole stigma with the MK4 was that it was AFFORDABLE and available with a manual. It gave the option to the masses-- something I know Toyota has in mind with respect to the MK5. This new Supra is now seeming like it will not be affordable, thus making it less available to the masses. What is even the point of putting this much time and money into this car other than measuring phalluses by spitting out pointless 0-60 times, power figures, and being able to say the Supra name again? Maybe I'm being overly-critical here, but it is really disappointing after waiting with realistic expectations for this many years. Is a ~240 horsepower base model with a 6MT really too much to ask for? This would certainly seem to be the car to do it with!

 

[dsds]

@dawsonj87

Affordable? If $55-60k in 1997 or approx $82K today using 2% inflation is affordable for a completely depreciating asset, then I'm living on a different planet. It was never affordable and you shouldn't expect it to be so now.

This has been discussed many times within the forum...

 

[dawsonj87]

@dawsonj87

Affordable? If $55-60k in 1997 or approx $82K today using 2% inflation is affordable for a completely depreciating asset, then I'm living on a different planet. It was never affordable and you shouldn't expect it to be so now.

This has been discussed many times within the forum...

You're talking about a top-tier Supra Turbo. Assuming so, your numbers still are rather large according to my findings. In 1997, https://www.topspeed.com/cars/toyota/1993-1998-toyota-supra-ar163626.html states that the top trim Supra Turbo cost $39,900. While, yes, this number with about 2% inflation is not affordable (roughly $62,000 which is a pretty hefty $20,000 less than what you're claiming), the base model-- which I specifically referenced in my previous post-- was priced at $29,500 in 1997. In todays dollars, you're looking at roughly $45,000, which today is pretty average for what people will shell out for their fully loaded crossovers and pickup trucks that seem to be so popular.

I appreciate your input, but do not agree with you. If this has been discussed previously within the forum, it must've been using numbers that do not add up if you came up with $82,000 in todays dollars. I also do not catch up with every single post in every single thread, so I must have missed the conversation, as I am also busy finishing my engineering degree. From my point of reference, an in-industry engineer in 1997 could have afforded a Supra, as well as a competitor, the R34 GTR. Using data from 1999, the MSRP of an R34 was 54,000 British pounds. 1 pound was roughly equal to 1.6 USD at the time, putting MSRP in USD at around $33,000. Taking into account our 2% inflation, that is roughly $49,000 today. And now, a GTR STARTS at $99,990. Anyway-- my point is: there is the possibility that the Supra will go down the same road as the GTR, considering it is thought of as a competitor, and $100,000 is not affordable.

 

[A70TTR]

Fighting words if he meant the DCT is better than a manual. The more I hear about this, the more I wonder if A70 was here to pull a bait and switch on us.

I've never intentionally mislead anyone here, but those supplying the first hand information can always manipulate it as they see fit. In this case, I never felt that way but tried to be careful so that it wouldn't come back to haunt me.

That said, as we all know things change and there's miscommunication too. All you can do is try to read between the lines and end up on the right side.

 

[solidsamir]

You're talking about a top-tier Supra Turbo.

How are you going to join a forum and not read previous discussions because you don't have time but still post walls of text with your uninformed speculation?

The new supra is expected at 45-55k with an upper trim model at 80k which will be a halo car.

If that's unaffordable for you, wait for the new 86 in 2021

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2...working-new-86-sports-car-model/#.WsPGehYpCaM

 

[Spilner]

^ yaaayyy

 

[chrisephoto]

Using data from 1999, the MSRP of an R34 was 54,000 British pounds. 1 pound was roughly equal to 1.6 USD at the time, putting MSRP in USD at around $33,000.

I realize the intention of this post wasn't to discuss R34 prices, but I just thought I should point this out...

54,000 GBP * (1.6 USD/GBP) = 86,400 USD

If your MSRP and exchange rate are correct, then the MSRP on an R34 would be ~130,000 USD today.

GT-Rs and Supra were never really directly compared in Japan when they were new. The Z32 Fairlady Z (300ZX) was really the Supra competitor.

 

[SupraFiend]

Also keep in mind the jump in price over the previous model, and the gradual price increases over the years on the mk4. In the 90s the Supra was indeed perceived as very expensive. Its only the cars later in life aftermarket exploits, its appearance in F&F and its well earned reputation for being bulletproof that people realized how good of a deal it was at the time. Hindsight.

 

[PerformanceSound]

DCT to be shared with the Z4??? What other BMW would this be out of??? M3/M4? M2? Reason I ask is....of it’s anything like the E46 Getrag SMG, the bellhouse was interchangeable with the 6spd Getrags. It’s true, people do this swap all the time. I’m thinking it might be possible down the road to swap bellhouses with an M3/M4 manual trans???

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