Why I'm NOT Hyped About The New Toyota Supra

[Supra93]

well to be nice, I guess he's not doing anything wrong, He's not HYPED about the supra *points to Thread title* and a bit aggressive about it.

I would rather all the negativity be posted here then throughout the forum on a bunch of random threads and derail the topic at hand. Remember, no personal attacks. Carry on everyone.

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[Spilner]

I'll just leave it here.

One hell of a drop between '89 - '90

 

[Captain_Kirk]

One hell of a drop between '89 - '90

Around that time Nissan had just release the new 300ZX. I imagine the new Z took a bit out of the A70's sales.

 

[Mike Myers]

One hell of a drop between '89 - '90

Not only this drop. Looks like they never came back up with the A80. Very interesting. Which market is this from? Worldwide?

So the A80 was all over the years sold less than the A40 in its worst year? Why?

 

[Spilner]

Not only this drop. Looks like they never came back up with the A80. Very interesting. Which market is this from? Worldwide?

So the A80 was all over the years sold less than the A40 in its worst year? Why?

It says US on the top

 

[Mike Myers]

I know for a fact that this occurred. BMW was legitimately struggling to keep up with the Toyota team, Tada-San offered considerable help to them in order to do a lot of fine-tuning.

Guff, I really really do respect you in person, your expression and your knowledge with no discussion.

And of course Toyota / Tada-San may have said that. But something inside me makes it feel like they have to say that keeping their face true.

So when I read “Tada helped BMW to better the Z4.” it sounds like this is a one way support. But it isn’t indeed. I fear that Toyota’s role in this game is much smaller than we want to believe.

 

[Mike Myers]

It says US on the top

Thank you and please excuse my fault.

Is it representative for other markets? Does anyone has the numbers for worldwide sales?

 

[Guff]

Guff, I really really do respect you in person, your expression and your knowledge with no discussion.

And of course Toyota / Tada-San may have said that. But something inside me makes it feel like they have to say that keeping their face true.

So when I read “Tada helped BMW to better the Z4.” it sounds like this is a one way support. But it isn’t indeed. I fear that Toyota’s role in this game is much smaller than we want to believe.

Believe whatever you want to believe, but you're still entirely wrong. I've been speaking to people internally about this project since I got the slightest hint that it was part of their tech sharing contract in 2015. I have no reason to not believe trusted contacts that I've had for nearly a decade.

I'm not sure why you or others think that Toyota is "licensing a BMW" but not only is it wrong it's just plain silly. If you even had the slightest idea at the scale of the partnership involved or the engineering teams behind this project, you'd understand why that's the case. I also really don't understand why you think Toyota would be the weak negotiator in this level of a partnership, especially with a company like BMW. Toyota is a ruthless giant when it comes to contract negotiation, and honestly BMW is lucky to have gotten as much as they did through the partnership agreement.

That's all I'm going to say on that, it's probably more than I should have said already. Understand that it's one thing to have biases about what companies you think can provide what, and it's another thing to know actual fact of what is going on and what has been going on since this project's inception.

 

[Jdmuscle]

A80 became a much more expensive a car than what A70 was.

Z32 certainly did a number on the A70 sales and in 93, A80 was the last to arrive as the FD, 3KGT were already in the market with their shinny new sheetmetal and tech. Then A80 dropped with A much higher tag and the target audience was very different all of a sudden. Toyota did drop the msrp on the 97 MY by almost 10k iirc.

 

[Mike Myers]

Believe whatever you want to believe, but you're still entirely wrong. I've been speaking to people internally about this project since I got the slightest hint that it was part of their tech sharing contract in 2015. I have no reason to not believe trusted contacts that I've had for nearly a decade.

I'm not sure why you or others think that Toyota is "licensing a BMW" but not only is it wrong it's just plain silly. If you even had the slightest idea at the scale of the partnership involved or the engineering teams behind this project, you'd understand why that's the case. I also really don't understand why you think Toyota would be the weak negotiator in this level of a partnership, especially with a company like BMW. Toyota is a ruthless giant when it comes to contract negotiation, and honestly BMW is lucky to have gotten as much as they did through the partnership agreement.

That's all I'm going to say on that, it's probably more than I should have said already. Understand that it's one thing to have biases about what companies you think can provide what, and it's another thing to know actual fact of what is going on and what has been going on since this project's inception.

It’s not only what I believe, it’s how it feels like after all that’s known so far.

I do not question your statements. You are indubitable the expert. I’m not, not just a little. I’m just a customer who likes both brands and is interested in what happens in this project. So what I feel and believe is only the result on what I see and read on several sources. And after all I know so far it’s almost hard to believe that Toyota is the big player in this partnership.

 

[MA617M]

I'm not sure why you or others think that Toyota is "licensing a BMW" but not only is it wrong it's just plain silly. If you even had the slightest idea at the scale of the partnership involved or the engineering teams behind this project, you'd understand why that's the case. I also really don't understand why you think Toyota would be the weak negotiator in this level of a partnership, especially with a company like BMW. Toyota is a ruthless giant when it comes to contract negotiation, and honestly BMW is lucky to have gotten as much as they did through the partnership agreement.

That's all I'm going to say on that, it's probably more than I should have said already. Understand that it's one thing to have biases about what companies you think can provide what, and it's another thing to know actual fact of what is going on and what has been going on since this project's inception.

This


Thank you

 

[2JZ-No-Sh*t]

Does anyone has the numbers for worldwide sales?

http://mkiv.supras.org.nz/specs.htm

Japan: 31,575
USA/Canda: 11,446+227 = 11,673
Europe/General Europe: 1671+27 = 1,698
Gulf Corp Council: 120
Pre-Production: 62
Unknown: 102

TOTAL: 45,230

 

[BrettS]

http://mkiv.supras.org.nz/specs.htm

Japan: 31,575
USA/Canda: 11,446+227 = 11,673
Europe/General Europe: 1671+27 = 1,698
Gulf Corp Council: 120
Pre-Production: 62
Unknown: 102

TOTAL: 45,230

Wow I didn’t realize so few supras came to Canada

 

[supraboi]

Why didn't they bring any to China? Also what are the Pre-Production cars? Were they just used for auto shows, farther testing, photo shoots, and media test drive/events? Lastly, what happen to them? Did Toyota crush them when it was all said and done?

 

[Mike Myers]

Why didn't they bring any to China? Also what are the Pre-Production cars? Were they just used for auto shows, farther testing, photo shoots, and media test drive/events? Lastly, what happen to them? Did Toyota crush them when it was all said and done?

Maybe they get dismantled, like BMW does with its pre production cars. Lots of them find their end in Eastern Europe, little later you can buy some parts on eBay.

But I actually don’t now how Toyota handled them.

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