Have a look at the Prototype Supra's engine

[Spilner]

Here's a high-res version of the B58 image. You can clearly see the front profile (and exhaust side "overhang") is different to the engine in the Z4/Supra.

Similarly, a quick google suggests it is not like any head from the current BMW range, and all manifolds are a combination of pressed and cast material, whereas this one seems entirely cast.

Interesting.

I hope they don't just call it the B58 "TU" and it has enough differentiating factors to get a new name.

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[Matador]

Similarly, a quick google suggests it is not like any head from the current BMW range, and all manifolds are a combination of pressed and cast material, whereas this one seems entirely cast.

Interesting.

Thanks for the High res pic. Might be a bit premature to make that assumption though no?

 

[MA617M]

Yeah possibly. Typical the bmw mani are cast in the middle two runners and the front and rear are pressed/tube.

The front two are cast on this one, hence my assumption. But absolutely is a guesstimate .

 

[mrarm]

Definitely seems like a new head casting compared to B58. Does anyone know if such big changes are normal in a "TU"?

edit: for clarification - the entire head is a different casting, going by the hot side manifold interface.

Are BMW's Technical updates normally smaller changes, or would an entire new head denote an entire new engine nomenclature? (I have revision control best practice swimming in my head as I ask these questions)

For the 340i b58 only 3 parts are identical to other bmw engines.

For more explanation see https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1277450&d=1441950445

 

[mrarm]

There are more details view of the BMW engine in this video.
We even see the exhaust manifold 6:20 to 6:26.

 

[MA617M]

For the 340i b58 only 3 parts are identical to other bmw engines.

For more explanation see https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1277450&d=1441950445

and we're fairly confident item 13 is unique to Z4/A90.... fascinating.

thanks for the info, this tech stuff is fantastic.

certainly looks like a lot of room on the hot side for a six slanted on it's side (one airboxes etc are removed )

 

[Jdmuscle]

Would you guys be surprised if you found out that the motor is nothing special? Just a new standard issue B58 that’s possibly revised/updated.

 

[Spilner]

Would you guys be surprised if you found out that the motor is nothing special? Just a new standard issue B58 that’s possibly revised/updated.

It's being discontinued

 

[MA617M]

Would you guys be surprised if you found out that the motor is nothing special? Just a new standard issue B58 that’s possibly revised/updated.

Yeah, that makes sense... My inner optimist hopes for a new engine, only in Z4 and Supra, new engine code etc, but my inner realist thinks it will just be the B58B30TU (Technical upgrade)

 

[mrarm]

Would you guys be surprised if you found out that the motor is nothing special? Just a new standard issue B58 that’s possibly revised/updated.

I would not be surprised if the engine has nothing special. toyota and bmw each patent if they combine they could make an exceptional engine.

I just think that if Toyota makes the engine reliable allows it to have a strong power if you change without internal engine change I'm interested otherwise I buy an old version of the supra ^^

 

[rtoadyt]

Both companies had made amazing i6 engines, opportunity to make the best of any i6 ever. I have faith on bmw and toyota, and I think it would be so awsome if both bmw and toyota decided to name the engine something like M53J (m for bmw's m division, 5 for 5th gen of z4 and 3j as toyota's heritage descendant of 2j) *do suggest a better name if u have one* They could make one hell of a benchmark i6 engine. I mean, think abt it, aside from the excrement of plastic engine cover that it has as we've seen. Goddamn I just got super-hyped. A70TTR, what do you have to say good sir?

 

[justbake]

Definitely seems like a new head casting compared to B58. Does anyone know if such big changes are normal in a "TU"?

edit: for clarification - the entire head is a different casting, going by the hot side manifold interface.

Are BMW's Technical updates normally smaller changes, or would an entire new head denote an entire new engine nomenclature? (I have revision control best practice swimming in my head as I ask these questions)

Id say if they are still using a B58 block (although made from a different material,) then they would just add the TU.
For example, the M52 head is completely different from M52 TU head (single VANOS vs dual VANOS.) and the Z3 had the aluminum block variant while all other cars had cast iron in the american market.

 

[PerformanceSound]

Would you guys be surprised if you found out that the motor is nothing special? Just a new standard issue B58 that’s possibly revised/updated.

I wouldn't be surprised, I would be more confused and disappointed to be honest. With all the hints from Tada that the motor can be pushed up to or past 700HP (reliably), there has to be something reworked on the new engine platform. Plus, knowing Toyota's "commitment" to reliability, there has to be more to this. What about sleeves as the difference?

 

[Jdmuscle]

I wouldn't be surprised, I would be more confused and disappointed to be honest. With all the hints from Tada that the motor can be pushed up to or past 700HP (reliably), there has to be something reworked on the new engine platform. Plus, knowing Toyota's "commitment" to reliability, there has to be more to this. What about sleeves as the difference?

Current B58s have been pushed to that limit and are living rather well. So that statement from Tada (while true) is probably not a result of what Toyota did.

What I’m hoping they’ll hold true to is letting that ECU be tunable. If that turns out to be not true.. then we can assume this car will live a short life.

 

[CantEven_Supra]

Current B58s have been pushed to that limit and are living rather well. So that statement from Tada (while true) is probably not a result of what Toyota did.

What I’m hoping they’ll hold true to is letting that ECU be tunable. If that turns out to be not true.. then we can assume this car will live a short life.

Agreed about the ECU. Are the current B58 ECU's like any other normal BMW unit? Usually JB4 then eventually someone like VF engineering comes out with an ECU tune but you have to physically access the unit (mail them the ECU).

I would imagine even if its the same B58 unit currently used that it will be focused on MUCH more now that the Supra is (possibly) using that unit and an ECU tune will be available at some point. Just going to take time.

For what its worth, I do remember reading in some interview with Tada that they were going to use "older" software so maybe that's so aftermarket companies have earlier access to the Supra's computer.....as with everyone else though......idunno

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