Toyota confirmed 3 sports car lineup: Toyota exec wants to bring back Celica, MR2

[bk5]

Toyota has re-registered the Celica trademark in the U.S. so I think there is hope for a new one in coming years.

My money is on it being the replacement for the 86. I always thought it was weird that the FR-S didn't carry the Celica nameplate, given that was Toyota's traditional lightweight entry-level sport compact for years. I actually went from a 7th gen Celica to a FR-S, specifically because the FR-S felt like an updated Celica (just without the amazing 2ZZ engine).

I could sorta understand they didn't want to confuse people because the car was a Scion, but once they killed Scion, renaming it to 86 just didn't make sense. Yeah, the 7th gen Celica was FWD, but prior generations were RWD (and AWD). Instead, they say it hearkens back to a package on a Corolla -- a car that's also now FWD, but was RWD in the 80s.

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[bushido]

I could sorta understand they didn't want to confuse people because the car was a Scion, but once they killed Scion, renaming it to 86 just didn't make sense.

the 1986 corolla was nicknamed AE86/86. before the FRS released all i read about was a RWD sports car being released in homage to the 86.. specifically.

right now they're releasing a "trueno" edition of the GR86

i believe there aren't any plans to replace this model

 

[Bigboss]

How the hell has this forum been around since 2014? theres no way Toyota made any announcement a supra would be coming almost 6 yr later? So in the beginning it was more like a conspiracy forum lmao

 

[NINaudio]

How the hell has this forum been around since 2014? theres no way Toyota made any announcement a supra would be coming almost 6 yr later? So in the beginning it was more like a conspiracy forum lmao

The FT1 concept, which many thought was hinting at a Supra replacement, came out in 2014.

 

[jtsang25]

My money is on it being the replacement for the 86. I always thought it was weird that the FR-S didn't carry the Celica nameplate, given that was Toyota's traditional lightweight entry-level sport compact for years. I actually went from a 7th gen Celica to a FR-S, specifically because the FR-S felt like an updated Celica (just without the amazing 2ZZ engine).

I could sorta understand they didn't want to confuse people because the car was a Scion, but once they killed Scion, renaming it to 86 just didn't make sense. Yeah, the 7th gen Celica was FWD, but prior generations were RWD (and AWD). Instead, they say it hearkens back to a package on a Corolla -- a car that's also now FWD, but was RWD in the 80s.

It was always called the 86 in other markets. It was the GT86 in Japan, Scion FRS in the US.

 

[KahnBB6]

Based on what Kirk said, they don't want too many coupes in their lineup

Kirk Kreifels is the only one who has said that. HIS speculation. The guy from Automotive News didn't say that and apparently the Best Car article doesn't say that. All it said in that regard was that Toyota was considering a sport sedan variant since RWD affordable sport sedans are desired as well.

Plus the original Toyota Altezza (aka Lexus IS200 and IS300) especially in its home market RS200 spec a 2.0L 210hp 3S-GE twin cam dual VVT-i BEAMS engine mated to an earlier version of the same Aisin 6-speed manual transmission found in the FRS, GT86, GR86 and all BRZ's was a compact sport sedan homage by its designer to the original 1983-1987 Corolla AE86 with the 4A-GE twin cam engine.

I am not sure that the name "Altezza" will be revived but if any sedan variant of this type of car will actually happen it's definitely going to be justified on the basis of how much fan have always loved the Altezza/IS (1st generation).

Besides, name me another 2+2 (that is: two seats behind the front seats no matter how compact they are) RWD two-door manual transmission coupe that Toyota has in their lineup.

The two-seater Supra, two-seater MR2 successor and five door wagon GR Corolla don't offer that layout. The GR Yaris is a three-door hatch which isn't a coupe but a hatchback. Only the GR86 offers a 2+2 two door RWD manual combination and for a somewhat affordable price.

The Lexus LC does offer this 2+2 RWD 2-door coupe layout but it doesn't offer a manual transmission and is a $100k+ car. And it's Lexus rather than a Toyota. Same with the Lexus RC and RC-F but at a lower price point. Lexus is already designing a successor that will combine aspects of both the LC and RC into one single luxury sport coupe offering at a price slightly higher than the RC but slightly lower than the LC.

The current iteration of the Supra as a two-seater and the upcoming extremely limited production "MR2" being another two seater are both coupes... but they're not easy for everyone to justify as daily driver cars the way a 2+2 coupe can be.

There is definitely a market for the formula that the GR86 coupe currently offers in this regard no matter how you choose to use the rear seats.

 

[KahnBB6]

My money is on it being the replacement for the 86. I always thought it was weird that the FR-S didn't carry the Celica nameplate, given that was Toyota's traditional lightweight entry-level sport compact for years. I actually went from a 7th gen Celica to a FR-S, specifically because the FR-S felt like an updated Celica (just without the amazing 2ZZ engine).

I could sorta understand they didn't want to confuse people because the car was a Scion, but once they killed Scion, renaming it to 86 just didn't make sense. Yeah, the 7th gen Celica was FWD, but prior generations were RWD (and AWD). Instead, they say it hearkens back to a package on a Corolla -- a car that's also now FWD, but was RWD in the 80s.

Toyota has indeed revived their "Celica" trademark and plan to use it again for another coupe. It could be used for this 3rd generation "GR86" or it could be used for whatever the battery EV or hybrid coupe they've been developing (NOT the FT-Se concept or rumored G16 powered "MR2") will turn out to be.

In 2012 when the U.S. FR-S and its Japan and other export market twin "86" and the BRZ were released it did make some sense to associate the "86" badging with it since the 2.0L FA engine's bore and stroke was 86mm x 86mm. Also that was a different time in their marketing and they had to fight tooth and nail to even get the low powered overly simple car approved by management. The intention was to make it as a dual homage to the 1983-1987 Corolla GT-S AE86 and the even older Toyota Sports 800 (which used what I think is Toyota's only in-house designed flat four engine to this day).

The Celica name is huge from the 1970's models, the RWD AE86 models, the All-Trac GT-Four ST165/185/205 rally cars and the last 7th generation 2ZZ-GE 6-speed manual GT-S.

I think one issue is that the "GR-Four" entire AWD turbo drivetrain has now been taken up by the rally Yaris and GR Corolla so this means the Celica GT-Four may not be revived again. But it also has its RWD manual scrappy roots taken up by what the GR86 has become today.

This 3rd generation car may be a Celica or the next Celica may succeed the 3rd gen GR86 when the G16E engine and Gazoo Racing's feelings on an ideal sports hybrid drivetrain can no longer be pursued again in the 2030's.

...

Whatever happens we're definitely getting something badged a "Celica" again be it sooner or a bit later.

 

[Bryster]

Would Toyota do a two door sedan these days?

 

[KahnBB6]

Would Toyota do a two door sedan these days?

Usually there isn't a "two door sedan", just a two door coupe or a four door sedan.

But Holden's Monaro and the identical Pontiac GTO sort of did this by retaining nearly the same interior dimensions as the Holden Statesman chassis which the Monaro coupe was derived from. If you've ever been inside one the rear seating area is very deep compared to most other 2+2 coupes.

Toyota and GR are supposedly not only heavily lightening the soon to be outgoing Lexus IS sedan chassis architecture that they're using as a starting point but also shortening its wheelbase for the GR86 so no, technically this new car will probably not have "two door sedan" proportions but proper two door coupe proportions.

That is unless they *only* offer this car as a four door sport sedan... in which case it would still be a "sedan".

We'll see. This latest report talking about a traditional two door coupe AND a sedan AND a wagon is really making things confusing.

 

[BMWAF]

The overthinking in this thread is just nuts. Toyota doesn't give two shits about any of this. They're going to simply slap whatever name makes sense and proves to be most popular in their market research on whatever new car they build.

 

[KahnBB6]

The overthinking in this thread is just nuts. Toyota doesn't give two shits about any of this. They're going to simply slap whatever name makes sense and proves to be most popular in their market research on whatever new car they build.

You're going to have to be a lot more specific than that. I'm not getting what you feel is being over-thought in this discussion.

So far whatever Toyota is doing appears to be much more involved than what Acura did by taking the Civic Type R chassis and drivetrain, changing the front and rear bumpers, headlights and tail lights, slapping "Integra" badges on the end result and calling it a day.

 

[GRMan]

How the hell has this forum been around since 2014? theres no way Toyota made any announcement a supra would be coming almost 6 yr later? So in the beginning it was more like a conspiracy forum lmao

Toyota officially kicked off the project in 2013. Meetings with BMW started back in 2012. So now take a guess as to why this forum was started at around that period

 

[BMWAF]

You're going to have to be a lot more specific than that.

I'm talking about the concept of lineage and how car companies think when they name cars. It's all bullshit. Car companies will rename/chop/change and ascribe "lineage" based on projected sales and market research.

The 45th anniversary is an example where they decided to include the Celica timeline because it fits their schedule, lol.

Don't believe the hype.

 

[jtsang25]

I'm talking about the concept of lineage and how car companies think when they name cars. It's all bullshit. Car companies will rename/chop/change and ascribe "lineage" based on projected sales and market research.

The 45th anniversary is an example where they decided to include the Celica timeline because it fits their schedule, lol.

Don't believe the hype.

Exactly. Mitsubishi Eclipse SUV good example.

 

[nosavingthrow]

I'm talking about the concept of lineage and how car companies think when they name cars. It's all bullshit. Car companies will rename/chop/change and ascribe "lineage" based on projected sales and market research.

The 45th anniversary is an example where they decided to include the Celica timeline because it fits their schedule, lol.

Don't believe the hype.

This. They care about making money, not lineage. They will do whatever market research tells them to do as far as naming goes.

I mean, just look at Ford and the Mustang... now the name is on a fucking SUV lol

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