Toyota Teases GR Line Up: Supra MK6, Celica MK8, MR2 MK4, 86 MK3 and GR GT

[Loco38SUP]

Well said Kahn! Their weight alone put the majority of EVs in a whole other category. Hard to hide heft for car lovers who actually enjoy point A to point B experience, like most of us.

However…. If you don’t look at the brand name (bias good or bad), I got a chance to really drive the latest Model 3 performance. It wasn’t what I expected. At all!!!! Long story short, I flung that newer performance model around the very large infield & straight areas of Sebring (where no people were - that track is HUGE). I was cornering & braking so much harder than I should have, completely shocked. One of the officials drove out to talk to us (me ?). I apologized ofc and explained the problem of this EV not giving in -like it should. Luckily he didn’t throw us out of the facility. The latest real upgrades to that vehicle not only made it feel lighter, it gave it the ability to take a proper whoopin incredibly well -brakes included. I’ve even seen a lot more of that model at track events, able to do a full 30 minute session w/out a need for charge. Some claim they can get two sessions. That’s about the same for me. I bring fuel to the track. They drive to Wawa or even more recently there are those super chargers on property. It also helps there are performance parts & consumables available for it.

https://www.tesla.com/model3-performance

Considering the price, performance and how it feels like a much more expensive car, I’m having my 1st ever real EV vs ICE car dilemma. Not for a car like the Supra. But for my wife’s GTi or something similar… Hard to believe!!!!

Which takes me back to the Celica or MR2. While I personally wouldn’t want either to be an EV only, I don’t think a hybrid system would tarnish their names. If/when they get to the point where they don’t inflate cost, weight, or complexity, then we’d have the best of both worlds. Low end torque and a combustion engine to maintain longer drives & higher speeds. If just for in town fun, you could drive on battery mode only, work and back, or longer trips having access to conventional fuel stations. Having redundancy to use either, for something we rely on so heavily, would be dyno ?might ?

I get it and fully understand the performance capability of EVs. But we should never compare to ICE vehicles. They should have their own categories and EV vs EV events. Just like Formula E and F1.

Plus I see all these performance trim EVs flooding my commute daily going 5-10 miles under the speed limit.

My poor Tacoma caps out at 280hp but I fully utilize those 280 ponies to their full extent daily.

- RJM

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[KahnBB6]

Well said Kahn! Their weight alone put the majority of EVs in a whole other category. Hard to hide heft for car lovers who actually enjoy point A to point B experience, like most of us.

However…. If you don’t look at the brand name (bias good or bad), I got a chance to really drive the latest Model 3 performance. It wasn’t what I expected. At all!!!! Long story short, I flung that newer performance model around the very large infield & straight areas of Sebring (where no people were - that track is HUGE). I was cornering & braking so much harder than I should have, completely shocked. One of the officials drove out to talk to us (me ?). I apologized ofc and explained the problem of this EV not giving in -like it should. Luckily he didn’t throw us out of the facility. The latest real upgrades to that vehicle not only made it feel lighter, it gave it the ability to take a proper whoopin incredibly well -brakes included. I’ve even seen a lot more of that model at track events, able to do a full 30 minute session w/out a need for charge. Some claim they can get two sessions. That’s about the same for me. I bring fuel to the track. They drive to Wawa or even more recently there are those super chargers on property. It also helps there are performance parts & consumables available for it.

https://www.tesla.com/model3-performance

Considering the price, performance and how it feels like a much more expensive car, I’m having my 1st ever real EV vs ICE car dilemma. Not for a car like the Supra. But for my wife’s GTi or something similar… Hard to believe!!!!

Which takes me back to the Celica or MR2. While I personally wouldn’t want either to be an EV only, I don’t think a hybrid system would tarnish their names. If/when they get to the point where they don’t inflate cost, weight, or complexity, then we’d have the best of both worlds. Low end torque and a combustion engine to maintain longer drives & higher speeds. If just for in town fun, you could drive on battery mode only, work and back, or longer trips having access to conventional fuel stations. Having redundancy to use either, for something we rely on so heavily, would be dyno ?might ?

Great feedback from your own experiences there!! Thank you for detailing that!! Every little nuance has nuggets of insight as to how these types of vehicles feel to those of us who just want them to deliver the goods positively when they are pushed hard.

Yeah, the weight and battery pack sizes are two of the most pressing issues when approaching true "sportscar" or "fun driver's car" EV design. Currently there is no way around those limitations with conventional battery technology.

And that WILL begin to change for the better over the next few years. This is not early days for mass produced regular battery electric cars but it is still very early days for full battery electric cars for car people.

Glad you got to flog that Tesla 3 Performance on track (and glad the referee/official was kind enough to let you stay). I haven't been able to drive one THAT violently yet but I have driven a friend's Tesla 3 Long Range (RWD and about 360hp I think @ 3700lbs or so?).

I gave it a good aggressive drive for a bit on a busy and fast L.A. highway. I floored it and drove it the way I drove my turbo Lexus--no regard for energy consumption, just throttle and push everywhere.

I was a little concerned as to how much grip the factory tires actually had in them given the weight but I also wasn't trying to cause trouble on a highway either.

I have no doubt that it is true what you say that with suspension, wheel and tire tweaks the Model 3 chassis does even better in a track environment.

I felt the lack of an LSD (or any simulation of one which torque vectoring could have provided) which required more steering input but the steering ratio was surprisingly tighter than I figured for such a heavy car. Power delivery felt a bit like a torquey small block domestic V8... but super linear and flat with 1 speed (which was a bit less fun than with gear changes).

I goosed the hell out of it and it loved to go. And so did the battery range with my driving style.

The energy density isn't quite there yet even for those cars. And I am certain that if I kept pushing it for too long the battery temperature or motor drive unit temperature or both would trigger a reduced power mode or even a reduced reaction from the throttle/potentiometer.

The suspension felt pretty good. The entire foorpan being an extremely heavy battery did help with the center of gravity.

But I did feel like I was driving something far too heavy for its own good.

I drove it hard for a bit and it delivered... but it definitely wasn't set up for that kind of hard driving on the regular.

As for the car itself... the interior alone turned me off. I almost never bothered with the screen because I wanted to keep my eyes on the road. I never knew how fast I was going. Not putting any instrumentation just in front of the steering wheel is a poor cost cutting move. The interior design alone was a dealbreaker.

The exterior also was a second dealbreaker. Too much like a scrunched egg shape. The Model S on the other hand is a very good looking design with marginally OK interior with driver instrumentation but still too much reliance on a touchscreen. But it's even larger and even heavier than the 3.

The poor ability to buy any and all replacement parts for Teslas directly outside of a service center is also a turnoff after dealing with every other major automaker for years.

I've only seen them around but the Porsche Taycan is large and very heavy but seems to do better when driven hard on track.

...

But right now all of these are still not technologically where they need to be to be true evolutionary successors to special fun cars we love.

Even when they get some things right and some things wrong, so far I like the creative thinking that Hyundai, Toyota and Dodge are doing with their early steps into fun EV sports models.

The programming and calibration of these cars needs to be very different from how, say... a soccer mom BEV crossover with 450hp would be set up from the factory. The fun cars need unique software and hardware tweaks and additions that aren't really about efficiency but which are much, much more about what feels fun and interesting.

BEVs can go fast very easily. Yeah, they'll feel different because they are different but even when battery size, weight, energy density, fast recharge, fast discharge, long lifespan and thermal safety are all solved... designers and engineers really working hard at defining driver car fun and theatricality are so important. Noise included somehow. We're human and we love and respond to noise.

And so is the vehicle's very identity and character in its exterior design and interior design as related to a driver/owner who wants a machine they can pilot... not a thing they just sit on and suggest inputs to.

....

RIght now I also don't want THIS Celica, MR2, Supra, GR86, SFR, Starlet, Yaris, etc. to be full battery EV. We are getting *some* of them with hybrid variants but nothing like how a Prius hybrid behaves.

Yeah, pure EV driving modes will have their uses even with these models so equipped.

I do think the GR engineers know exactly how to tackle the challenge of incorporating electrification but with a proper car enthusiast's methodology. Here's hoping.

Down the road a few years when their solid state battery packs trickle down the model line, then I think we'll see the real test as to how well they can take that car enthusiast ethos hand in hand with new tech that finally allows some better weight and packaging options.

....

I keep coming back to the main points of a unique fun vehicle's very identity and personality in every aspect. I very very very strongly feel that this is extremely key to how any future BEV "sports" models will ever have a chance of being regarded highly and fondly by car people.

That and our ability to service them on our own with aftermarket community support long after they're new. That is always a big factor.

The technology limitations will be solved over time. Nothing will 100% ever be the same as a true 1967 Shelby GT500 with a 428 dual carb or an MKIV Supra with a big single turbo or an 80's Lancia Delta Integrale Evo.

But building them right even with battery electric technology is what needs to happen.

These types of cars have never been for the average car buyer. So... new technology? Cool! But that's just the technology. Automakers need to stop applying average everyday car design ethos and style to vehicles that are specifically for car enthusiasts who value the experience and fun factor of a special model.

Regardless of whether that special model is an inexpensive VW GTI or a massively expensive $100k+ very high performance special model.

I am optimistic over the long haul as to how some automakers will design some of their future full BEV sports models. I don't think everyone will be won over but some of their models hopefully will be masterminded by true car enthusiast chief engineers who value what we do regardless of what technology is their challenge of the day.

Right now though... the current generation of Toyota/Lexus GR models seem to be set to give us a lot of what we have been wishing from Toyota for many years now on the ICE front.

 

[Captain_Kirk]

Toyota Trademarks GR Celica Name

https://www.carscoops.com/2025/02/toyota-trademarks-gr-celica-name/

Toyota’s GR Supercar With 900HP V8 Could Drop This Summer

https://www.carscoops.com/2025/02/t...ould-debut-this-summer-with-900-hp-hybrid-v8/

 

[bk5]

That gives some serious Viper / AMG GT vibes.

 

[ColonelAdama]

Considering the price, performance and how it feels like a much more expensive car, I’m having my 1st ever real EV vs ICE car dilemma. Not for a car like the Supra. But for my wife’s GTi or something similar… Hard to believe!!!!

Real. Considering a Model 3 to replace my GTI as a daily next.

Supra scratches the "driver's car" itch for me. As awesome as the GTI is, would rather auto-pilot to work some days for nearly no travel cost, and save the fun drives for the Supra. Needing a 4 door for the growing family, will consider the Golf R as well.

Have a few friends with M3P/MYP. Loved driving them all. Hard to beat for a daily imo.

 

[Loco38SUP]

Real. Considering a Model 3 to replace my GTI as a daily next.

Supra scratches the "driver's car" itch for me. As awesome as the GTI is, would rather auto-pilot to work some days for nearly no travel cost, and save the fun drives for the Supra. Needing a 4 door for the growing family, will consider the Golf R as well.

Have a few friends with M3P/MYP. Loved driving them all. Hard to beat for a daily imo.

What about a GR Corolla? Practical AWD, 4 doors and fun.

-RJM

 

[FLtrackdays]

What about a GR Corolla? Practical AWD, 4 doors and fun.

-RJM

Yeah warning to fellow ICE car lovers… just don’t drive a 2024 Tesla model 3 performance or go to their website below and see how competitively priced it is ?

https://www.tesla.com/model3-performance

 

[Rob_SER]

What about a GR Corolla? Practical AWD, 4 doors and fun.

-RJM

I have a 3 year old and it's a good daily. I own it since 2 years now and still love it, I'd even say I love it more now than 2 years ago.

 

[ColonelAdama]

I have a 3 year old and it's a good daily. I own it since 2 years now and still love it, I'd even say I love it more now than 2 years ago.

I'd love to own one but hard to justify 4-5x the price of my GTI when it's similar enough of a car (for daily purposes)

 

[Rob_SER]

I'd love to own one but hard to justify 4-5x the price of my GTI when it's similar enough of a car (for daily purposes)

Well that's up to you to decide!

I've drivent countless MK7 GTI and R (we also own an MK7.5 Sportwagen for 7 years now) and the GR Corolla is very different in character and behavior.

But as a mean of transportation, I agree, they manage the same thing, especially for you in South Carolina where snow is not a big concern

 

[FLtrackdays]

How bout this one? Any truth to it

https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a...could-share-an-inline-6-in-future-sports-cars

 

[Stvee]

The rumor is from Best Car, so probably not.

 

[Bryster]

It needs braps

 

[gymratter]

https://bestcarweb.jp/news/scoop/1103497

●GR Super Sport expected specifications
・Length x width x height: 4600 x 1950 x 1200 mm
・Wheelbase: 2700 mm
・Power unit: V8, 4L twin turbo + multi-stage hybrid
・Maximum output / maximum torque: 720ps / 70.0kgm
・System output: 900ps
・Drive system: FR
・Release date: October 2025
・Expected price: 30 million yen = $197k USD

 

[Bryster]

Side by side comparison

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