Manual Supra 1st and 2nd gear weird sound.

[AndyK5]

I honestly haven't driven it enough to provide concrete information - I'm just over 3000km at the moment - but it just feels shit. It feels like getting a gear shift completely wrong, except you didn't; you were smooth as butter but the car just hates you.

And for the record, I don't consider myself a perfect manual driver! Every so often I fuck up a change in my other car but when I do, I'm fully aware that I messed up: Maybe I got lazy with my foot action or wasn't paying attention or generally just mistimed it all.

In the Supra, it just happens because fuck you.

So like I said above under heavy load, race track conditions where I grab the shifter a bit too hard, 3-2 downshift can be problematic.

However outside that this gearbox is fantastic. I mean it is one of the best I have owned and I have been driving manual cars for 25 years.

It is mind boggling to me that you find it so atrocious. Out of curiosity, what gearbox would you say has better feel/gear engagement than Supra? I have trouble finding anything besides a porsche gear box.

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[BMWAF]

It is mind boggling to me that you find it so atrocious. Out of curiosity, what gearbox would you say has better feel/gear engagement than Supra? I have trouble finding anything besides a porsche gear box.

That's easy.

The FN2 Type R gearbox leaves this Toyota/BMW mash-up gearbox for dead.

I've been driving my Type R for over 15 years.. over 200,000km without ever needing to replace the clutch and even now after 15 years of use, it is orders of magnitude better than the brand new Supra box.

EDIT: I should add that shortly after release, the 3rd gear syncro was replaced as part of a recall. After that, the gearbox was smooth as butter, up shift, downshift, under load, whatever. And as I mentioned earlier, the only time this gearbox gives me any trouble is because I fuck up, not because the gearbox itself decides 2nd is just too difficult on any particular occasion! And I hasten to add, the Type R gearbox has a CDV which is incidentally one of the reasons why I am so skeptical about removing the one in the Supra.

Other than some form of choice-supportive bias, I find it mind boggling as to how you can find a "problematic 3-2 downshift" acceptable on a gearbox made in 2023! Especially since Honda managed to provide gearboxes devoid of such issues.. fifteen years ago!

 

[AndyK5]

That's easy.

The FN2 Type R gearbox leaves this Toyota/BMW mash-up gearbox for dead.

I've been driving my Type R for over 15 years.. over 200,000km without ever needing to replace the clutch and even now after 15 years of use, it is orders of magnitude better than the brand new Supra box.

EDIT: I should add that shortly after release, the 3rd gear syncro was replaced as part of a recall. After that, the gearbox was smooth as butter, up shift, downshift, under load, whatever. And as I mentioned earlier, the only time this gearbox gives me any trouble is because I fuck up, not because the gearbox itself decides 2nd is just too difficult on any particular occasion! And I hasten to add, the Type R gearbox has a CDV which is incidentally one of the reasons why I am so skeptical about removing the one in the Supra.

Other than some form of choice-supportive bias, I find it mind boggling as to how you can find a "problematic 3-2 downshift" acceptable on a gearbox made in 2023! Especially since Honda managed to provide gearboxes devoid of such issues.. fifteen years ago!

I don’t find it acceptable, just trying to see if its user error. Although not adding a lift tab to reverse is miss on Toyota and would have prevented this.

 

[lucky phil]

That's easy.

The FN2 Type R gearbox leaves this Toyota/BMW mash-up gearbox for dead.

I've been driving my Type R for over 15 years.. over 200,000km without ever needing to replace the clutch and even now after 15 years of use, it is orders of magnitude better than the brand new Supra box.

EDIT: I should add that shortly after release, the 3rd gear syncro was replaced as part of a recall. After that, the gearbox was smooth as butter, up shift, downshift, under load, whatever. And as I mentioned earlier, the only time this gearbox gives me any trouble is because I fuck up, not because the gearbox itself decides 2nd is just too difficult on any particular occasion! And I hasten to add, the Type R gearbox has a CDV which is incidentally one of the reasons why I am so skeptical about removing the one in the Supra.

Other than some form of choice-supportive bias, I find it mind boggling as to how you can find a "problematic 3-2 downshift" acceptable on a gearbox made in 2023! Especially since Honda managed to provide gearboxes devoid of such issues.. fifteen years ago!

You need to bare in mind something here. A gearbox thats designed to take probably around 600ft/lbs of torque max unless made with some high spec/exotic gear materials and complex machining to reduce the weight of the gears is never going to shift as well as the comparatively light duty gearbox such as the Typr R is fitted with. The Supra gearbox is probably designed to take double the torque of the R gearbox and what comes with that is in a mass produced built to a cost production gearbox much heavier gears and much greater gear inertia so the shift action is never going to be the snickty snick of a much lighter duty gearbox.
The Supra box will improve I'm sure as the clutch wears in and the gearbox loosens up a little.

Phil

 

[BMWAF]

The Supra gearbox is probably designed to take double the torque of the R gearbox..

I was patiently waiting for this comment.. which is of course 100% true. Having said this, it doesn't dull the disappointment of the Supra box much.

The Supra box will improve I'm sure as the clutch wears in and the gearbox loosens up a little.

I sure hope so.

 

[Boataur]

So like I said above under heavy load, race track conditions where I grab the shifter a bit too hard, 3-2 downshift can be problematic.

However outside that this gearbox is fantastic. I mean it is one of the best I have owned and I have been driving manual cars for 25 years.

It is mind boggling to me that you find it so atrocious. Out of curiosity, what gearbox would you say has better feel/gear engagement than Supra? I have trouble finding anything besides a porsche gear box.

I’m with you…I think the gearbox (and clutch) are excellent. This car is incredibly easy to drive. My Civic Si and Focus ST were pretty darn good as well; WRX and Speed3 were not.

 

[digicidal]

That's easy.
...snip...

Yeah. If Honda didn't make it so hard (and expensive) to get RWD... I'd never have left the brand in the first place. Put >300K miles on my first Civic on 2 clutches over that whole period (11 years). Then again it had less than a third of the torque that the MKV has.

 

[BrettMRC]

I find 1st & 2nd are great if you are slowly cruising or absolutely nailing it... in the middle of those two extremes is where it becomes difficult.
My gut feeling is that it's nothing to do with CDV and more to do with how the engine accelerates and holds/loses revs in the mid range - changing up at this point is where it seems to introduce kangaroo petrol for me, but only ever on 1st to 2nd, and only maybe 1% of the time.

 

[kylekay24]

What about when you shift at say 5000rpm and don't baby it. Still bad? Typically these gearboxes that are designed to take relatively high power and torque need some road speed to help the syncros work. The Tremec T56 is one such box although Tremec refer to it as a " medium duty" gearbox. Drive it around short shifting it and it's balky and not great. Get the engine revving which equates to more road speed and bang it through the gate and it's a lot better.

Phil

No! At high rpm’s it’s smooth as butter. It only acts up at low rpm’s.

 

[lucky phil]

No! At high rpm’s it’s smooth as butter. It only acts up at low rpm’s.

Yep, higher revs= greater road speed for the gear you are in and a better shift action. If you experiment you will find the minimum rpm or road speed in first, take your pick that gives a nice clean 1st to 2nd shift and drive it to that if the short shifting action bothers you. Most drivers want to short shift into second generally but a bit more road speed/rpm and it shifts nicer

Phil

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