The Pricing Thread + Potential US Tariffs Impact

AZSupra

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From my knowledge of European engines... When it reaches 30,000 Miles or 50,000 Kms.... It becomes expensive and unreliable. They are highly strung From the get go hence why you see 2.5 lt turbo engines with 400 horse power and 400Nm of torque from low revs... The OEMs crank it for performance rather than reliability and durability.

That is simply not true. Current MQB VW/Audi leave a lot on the table. Start with a GTi that is about 220 whp stock. Those hit 300 whp with a downpipe and tune. No reliability issues.

The 2.5T in the RS3/TTRS are hitting 10s easily with bolt ons. 500 whp.

You can blast the germans for high maintenance costs and I will not fault you. But, they leave a lot on the table when it comes to boosted motors and tuning




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MA617M

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From my knowledge of European engines... When it reaches 30,000 Miles or 50,000 Kms.... It becomes expensive and unreliable. They are highly strung From the get go hence why you see 2.5 lt turbo engines with 400 horse power and 400Nm of torque from low revs... The OEMs crank it for performance rather than reliability and durability.
wat

this is the direct opposite of my experience

maybe if you keep them on the rev limiter 24/7 and run them on cooking oil?

One of my close friends has an S3 with nearly four times the km on it. It gets regular oil changes and serviced correctly - but it's all done by us (euro are super easy to work on in my experience) and the thing has been belted. no issues. same for all the old Mercedes I have owned, the renaults, etc.

look after them like it says in the book - drive them hard and enjoy
 

Guff

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I just want to reiterate that we have strict rules on political discussion, so let's keep that in mind here.

Between Honda, Toyota, Nissan, and Subaru, there are 33 Japanese-car manufacturing plants located in the US. When it comes to American brands, Chrysler has 5, Ford has 16, and GM has 26, that's 47 plants. If you count the German (9) and Korean (5) manufacturers in the same group as the Japanese, then that number is 47 foreign-manufacturers that have cars built in the USA, using American employees and parts sourced from the USA.

So tariffs on foreign manufacturers would affect HALF (more actually) of all American based production jobs, and increase costs on more than half of the cars produced in this country.

:doh:
 

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I just want to reiterate that we have strict rules on political discussion, so let's keep that in mind here.

Between Honda, Toyota, Nissan, and Subaru, there are 33 Japanese-car manufacturing plants located in the US. When it comes to American brands, Chrysler has 5, Ford has 16, and GM has 26, that's 47 plants. If you count the German (9) and Korean (5) manufacturers in the same group as the Japanese, then that number is 47 foreign-manufacturers that have cars built in the USA, using American employees and parts sourced from the USA.

So tariffs on foreign manufacturers would affect HALF (more actually) of all American based production jobs, and increase costs on more than half of the cars produced in this country.

:doh:
Keep in mind, the BMW IX3 will be done in China. So if it hits the fan for foreign cars in the US, other companies might do the same
(That's my two cents on this):popcorn:
 

Craigy

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I really doubt that most of these tariffs come to fruition, particularly on vehicle imports.

It's all a big Trump negotiation tactic. He's hoping that one by one, countries will cave and lower their tariffs on US goods.

Of course time will tell. Tariffs would suck.
 

TrackIt

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I just want to reiterate that we have strict rules on political discussion, so let's keep that in mind here.

Between Honda, Toyota, Nissan, and Subaru, there are 33 Japanese-car manufacturing plants located in the US. When it comes to American brands, Chrysler has 5, Ford has 16, and GM has 26, that's 47 plants. If you count the German (9) and Korean (5) manufacturers in the same group as the Japanese, then that number is 47 foreign-manufacturers that have cars built in the USA, using American employees and parts sourced from the USA.

So tariffs on foreign manufacturers would affect HALF (more actually) of all American based production jobs, and increase costs on more than half of the cars produced in this country.

:doh:
Fake news. All of the parts aren't sourced from the US, hence the tariff.
 

Guff

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Fake news. All of the parts aren't sourced from the US, hence the tariff.
None of the cars, American brands or foreign have a fully domestic source. GM pickups are less domestically sourced than Toyotas pickups. And while Buick Enclaves and Chevy Traverses may be 90% American, Accords at 81% and Camry's & Siennas at 78% aren't far behind (Kogod MIA Index).

While there are some American models that are more domestically sourced than Japanese models, that doesn't discount the fact that foreign manufacturers (Japanese OEMs namely) have a rapidly growing impact on Made-In-America manufacturing and are getting more and more American with every passing year. Toyota is opening its eleventh manufacturing facility very soon.

Oh, and guess what, that Fiesta you drive? It's 15.5% American made.
 

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Anyone with experience ordering a car directly from Toyota? Do dealers "Market Adjustments" still apply in such cases?
 

BRZer86

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I know its great fun to compare specs but c'mon guys, have you driven a 370z? It drives like a once-sports car was poured over with molten rubber and left to set. Everything about it feels rubbery, disconnected, not-thought-out. And not in the Audi way where they knowingly do it because they're assholes, but in a "we tried our best but just don't know what we're doing" way. The VQ was wheezy, the CD009 was rubbery, and the chassis never felt like it was willing to adjust at the limit like you wanted it to... Yeah, they sold plenty, and they still sell them for god's sake, but I'd take dozens of worse HP/$ cars over a Z (ND or 86 for example).



I always say this, and I know it sounds stupid in internet-land, but cars are not spec-sheets, you have to drive them to know what they really offer. What a car tells in just a moment at the limit is far more informative than a thousand pages of forum spec-vomiting. I know it sucks because all we can do is talk on the forums, but my advice is just don't jump to conclusions. There's still plenty left to learn.
Well said.
 

BRZer86

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Anyone with experience ordering a car directly from Toyota? Do dealers "Market Adjustments" still apply in such cases?
Absolutely. When the FR-S and BRZ were released, there were market adjustments for the first 18 months, even if you pre-ordered it. This was the first time I purchased a car a sticker and I was ok with it. The Supra may go through a higher market adjustment thanks to Hollywood’s revival of the A80 at the turn of the century.
 

BRZer86

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But a lot assumptions are made here. I have owned 1987, 1990, 2004, 2005 z(zx) cars. The current Z cars are bullet proof. Can you say that with the BMW engine or anything BMW build?
The VQ motor is one of the most reliable motors ever built by Nissan. There’s a reason why Nissan hasn’t shied away from the VQ35 architecture from 2003. It can be compared to a similar approach by Toyota with the 2JZ and the lengthy production run. The problem with the 370Z is the anemic drivability along with mundane design elements. It says a lot when an underpowered FR-S/BRZ/GT86 is substantially more exciting to drive than the Z of today.
 

BRZer86

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From my knowledge of European engines... When it reaches 30,000 Miles or 50,000 Kms.... It becomes expensive and unreliable. They are highly strung From the get go hence why you see 2.5 lt turbo engines with 400 horse power and 400Nm of torque from low revs... The OEMs crank it for performance rather than reliability and durability.

Japanese OEMs are more about durability... I would know. When I worked as an engineer for one... Its always function and durability/quality rather than flashy performance. That was chief engineer motto.


Still if you can afford European performance cars including the maintenance down the line they're very good performing cars. Just that there's a reason why European cars with mid to high mileage are cheap.... Because it cost a lot to maintain. That engine has been squeezed a lot hence the amazing performance numbers.. Again if you have the money then all good.
Although a Laguna Seca Blue - E46 BMW M3 would be worth the headache.
 

BRZer86

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Maybe the engine is, but from all I've heard, the clutch slave cylinder on current-gen Zs is almost guaranteed to need replacement fairly early. Haven't seen anything to suggest this problem was solved with the switch to an Exedy clutch in 2018, but it may have been.
The godforsaken throw out bearing on the FR-S/BRZ took Toyburu 4 full production years to remedy. Sometimes I feel like there’s a business decision behind certain components that auto manufacturers select. Conspiracies....
 

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