How rare is your car?! Production Numbers By Model, Trim and Color?

[Vt-mech]

Who the fuck cares. just drive the cars. I swear the whole supra lore has made people lose their common sense.

Yeah definitely enjoy driving your car but also realize the gravity of the fact that these cars are going to be very valuable in the future as well. It’s interesting to some of us

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[razorlab]

Yeah definitely enjoy driving your car but also realize the gravity of the fact that these cars are going to be very valuable in the future as well. It’s interesting to some of us

Sure they are. This is exactly my point. Your mind is tunneled by the past.

 

[Vt-mech]

Sure they are. This is exactly my point. Your mind is tunneled by the past.

I say that as a guy who loves driving his car/investment

 

[BMWAF]

I say that as a guy who loves driving his car/investment

It pains me to say this but I don't believe the MKV Supra is going to hold any real value - even the bullshit special editions in the US - despite how good of a car it is.

Storytime.

My daily is an FN2 Type R and like the Supra it was - and still is - very much hated in the car community as it isn't a traditional or typical JDM Type R. At the time it was exceptionally good value for money and its performance was equal to its main rivals: It's essentially a Type R that has been kitted out with European features (likely to compete with the MKV Golf GTI). It's actually a great daily with a hand built Japanese engine but its not as raw or edgy as the previous EP3. Despite how good of a car it is overall, this makes the FN2 largely unloved by the car community - both when it was new and today.

The Supra also is a great car, and like the Type R is arguably better than the previous model in every way, but here's the thing.. the MKV Supra has also been generally disliked by the car community since its release. The EP3 Type R today is worth twice or sometimes triple that of an FN2, despite it being older; arguably uglier; has fewer features and essentially the same power train/numbers.

Because of its (for want of a better term) cultural shortcomings, I believe the Supra will unfortunately suffer a similar fate.

Despite the Supra being a great and cost effective car in 2019-2024, it doesn't have the bullshit cultural connection that will likely raise its status with collectors in the years to come. And lets face it, the Supra has a bog standard B58 engine found in SUVs, a bland previous generation BMW interior and as we all know (and at least for me, love) a fairly large BMW chip on its shoulder.

Could I be wrong: absolutely.. I have been wrong many times but remember, almost all cars drop in value. And what I'm suggesting is that the Supra has plenty of additional reasons to fall into this category.

And please don't take this personally but if you're ever buying a car as an investment, you really shouldn't be left unsupervised around money.

 

[6mtsoup]

I agree with ya. Half the people here buy the mkv because ‘Supra’ and they’re Toyota / jdm fans, half the people (like me) buy them because it is a bmw. At the end of the day, it is a 40i bmw, they don’t hold value long term as the generation ends.
I see them holding some bit of value because of the Supra lineage, but you can already see how the prices are dropping on them. That effect won’t last long term for the common a90s.
I think only the special editions that have the unique paint (refraction, cul, matte white, Mikan, phantom matte) and the combination of being a CF or MT will hold their value better just because of the scarcity/uniqueness. I didn’t buy mine for that reason, I got it because it was the spec I wanted, and imma drive the shit out of it and keep it until I die

 

[Turbro]

If you look at the breakdown of MKIV supras. In the USA they made ~4500 in Twin Turbo 6 speed manual. The rest were auto or NA. So far there is less new manual MKVs than old manuals. I think MTs will for sure hold value long term. Even if they dip, they will come back in 20 years. Especially with the Hybrid/EV push over the next 2 decades. Manual cars will be very rare in general by any brand. Auto supras are another story, not sure how those will fare over the years. But that’s Just my .2c

fyi I waited specifically for the manual. Ive waited over 4 years for this car. Waited until the manual was offered, then 16 months with a deposit down to actually get one. But now I will have 2 supras, 30 years apart, both blue, turbo and manual. I always wanted to buy an MKIV off the showroom floor but was too young obviously… this is the closest i could get! I’ll be doing my hardest to never sell my pair of supras

 

[Dannyvandelft]

I absolutely love my Supra, and Refraction is obviously the best color, but in the next 2 years it will be replaced. I'm already starting to shop, in the past 3 years I've more than doubled my income, and with that comes looking at cars that can be bought. So far my only criteria is having an engine in the back. I'd love to keep the Supra too, but with my GR Corolla as my daily, the wife's car, I'm out of garage space lol.

 

[jtsang25]

I absolutely love my Supra, and Refraction is obviously the best color, but in the next 2 years it will be replaced. I'm already starting to shop, in the past 3 years I've more than doubled my income, and with that comes looking at cars that can be bought. So far my only criteria is having an engine in the back. I'd love to keep the Supra too, but with my GR Corolla as my daily, the wife's car, I'm out of garage space lol.

Time to install a lift.

 

[Dannyvandelft]

Time to install a lift.

That...... is not a bad idea

 

[Vt-mech]

It pains me to say this but I don't believe the MKV Supra is going to hold any real value - even the bullshit special editions in the US - despite how good of a car it is.

Storytime.

My daily is an FN2 Type R and like the Supra it was - and still is - very much hated in the car community as it isn't a traditional or typical JDM Type R. At the time it was exceptionally good value for money and its performance was equal to its main rivals: It's essentially a Type R that has been kitted out with European features (likely to compete with the MKV Golf GTI). It's actually a great daily with a hand built Japanese engine but its not as raw or edgy as the previous EP3. Despite how good of a car it is overall, this makes the FN2 largely unloved by the car community - both when it was new and today.

The Supra also is a great car, and like the Type R is arguably better than the previous model in every way, but here's the thing.. the MKV Supra has also been generally disliked by the car community since its release. The EP3 Type R today is worth twice or sometimes triple that of an FN2, despite it being older; arguably uglier; has fewer features and essentially the same power train/numbers.

Because of its (for want of a better term) cultural shortcomings, I believe the Supra will unfortunately suffer a similar fate.

Despite the Supra being a great and cost effective car in 2019-2024, it doesn't have the bullshit cultural connection that will likely raise its status with collectors in the years to come. And lets face it, the Supra has a bog standard B58 engine found in SUVs, a bland previous generation BMW interior and as we all know (and at least for me, love) a fairly large BMW chip on its shoulder.

Could I be wrong: absolutely.. I have been wrong many times but remember, almost all cars drop in value. And what I'm suggesting is that the Supra has plenty of additional reasons to fall into this category.

And please don't take this personally but if you're ever buying a car as an investment, you really shouldn't be left unsupervised around money.

Maybe you’re right. I didn’t buy it originally for the investment. I bought it because it’s a badass affordable car that drives as good as it looks. But a guy can hope! And I do think that low production numbers may help twenty years down the road or so

 

[MSport]

The moment you make a modification doesn’t your car likely become a 1 of 1?

Not if you have TE’s

 

[CSUfiend]

i will say this.. plenty of valuable cars have their engines shared with mainstream cars. Mustang engines were also found in LTD’s, Camaro engines were in Impala’s/Biscayne’s, and even the MKIII and MKIV’s were shared with Aristo’s/Lexus GS’. I don’t see the values of those Mustang’s, Camaro’s and Supra’s being adversely tied to the resale values of LTD’s, Camaro’s and Aristo/GS’s.

I will also say that when SUV’s, Sedans, and trucks have the same engine, the sporty 2-door cars have always held their values slightly better. My old Lexus GS430 didn't hold its value as much as an SC430, even though my GS was as capable performance wise (and even slightly faster due to weight) than the SC430. If I had to guess, I would say that I don’t think think the MKV will be a valuable collectors car for another 25 years though.

But I still think everything all depends on whether or not this is the last “Supra”. If this ends up being the last Supra, I think MKV values will hold up, maybe not up to MKIV levels, but they will hold some value. Despite rumors of a next gen Supra, I think it’s quite likely that this is the last Supra because Toyota is such a conservative car company. The battle that it took to even get the MKV into production, IMO, will be hard to replicate.

 

[Sunstorm]

1 of 24 A90 Launch Editions in the UK. (90 total in Europe)

With a few modifications, I'm guessing it's unique, at least in the UK. TE37 SLs arent that common over here.

 

[BMWAF]

i will say this.. plenty of valuable cars have their engines shared with mainstream cars. Mustang engines were also found in LTD’s, Camaro engines were in Impala’s/Biscayne’s, and even the MKIII and MKIV’s were shared with Aristo’s/Lexus GS’. I don’t see the values of those Mustang’s, Camaro’s and Supra’s being adversely tied to the resale values of LTD’s, Camaro’s and Aristo/GS’s.

I don't think it has anything to do with shared engines, it's more about the fact that the car is almost universally disliked because of its Toyota shell over a BMW design. That and the random Mark IV spastics who hate on it because their "legendary" car has essentially been superseded by something made in Austria.

My quip about the engine was just pointing out that the Supra's engine, albeit a good one, is really just a run of the mill BMW engine: Nothing particularly special. And that's the rub, it's a special car because of the sum of its parts, not the individual parts, which I believe is what generates most of the hate.. hence my referencing the FN2.

I think only the special editions that have the unique paint (refraction, cul, matte white, Mikan, phantom matte) and the combination of being a CF or MT will hold their value better just because of the scarcity/uniqueness.

Doubt it. A91s are just Supras with a marketing spin.

While it's not all doom and gloom, I just don't think the Supra is a shoe-in to go up in price for the reasons outlined. If they do become a wanted commodity, I can almost guarantee a manual will trump an "A91" every day of the week. A91s are such a small "improvement" from a regular model that it is almost laughable. Missing HUD anyone? When a collector is looking at a "classic" car today, beyond condition, do you think they're paying greater attention to the spec sheet or the shift mechanism?

And I do think that low production numbers may help twenty years down the road or so

My greatest worry is that in 20 years time, we may not be able to readily buy (decent) fuel for these cars because lets face it, that eventuality is coming like a freight train too.

 

[CSUfiend]

Point taken. I agree that you have valid points on all fronts.

I still think the a90’s resale value will depend on the a100. Will there be an a100?

I believe if you have an a90, or have a vested interest in a90 values being higher than average, your best bet is to hope that there is no a100. An a100, whether it is a joint or in house product, would make the a90 a red headed step child of the Supra family (if it isn’t already).

There might be other things that we don’t know about it. Perhaps the a90 just fades into oblivion in a decade after subsequent a100 and a110 generations. Perhaps the a90, heated upon at first, eventually starts to gain momentum and respect amongst car collectors (like the 2nd gen Camaro, which has been gaining in value for only the past decade or so), or there could be other factors too. But I think if the a90 is the last Supra, the a90 will eventually be looked upon in a more positive limelight than it is right now.

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