Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 / Subaru BRZ

2JZ-No-Sh*t

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Another classic example of Toyota not listening to the customers, sales drop, and than killing off anything fun in their line up. :doh:

1. Selling it as a Scion in the US.
2. No other engine choices to pick from.
3. No turbos from the factory.
4. No other body styles to pick from.
5. Ugly looking facelift.
6. Did I mention the whole Scion thing...




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A70TTR

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All good arguments that I feel are fairly on point.

The car didnt have great support internally from the get-go (the board was absolutely against building it), then there was the Scion debacle, and ultimately the failure to add power or update the car doomed it further.
 

johnny_10196

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But it seems like a self-fulfilling prophecy, circular blame. Japanese sportscar comes out, sells well, Japanese manufacturer fails to refresh and update car, sales taper off because car hasn't been updated since it came out, Japanese company decides not to renew/refresh car because of declining sales.
:werd:

Thank you for posting that. I tired to make the same argument about past Toyota sports car in other threads, but all the die hard Toyota fan boys here were like lalalalala. :lol:
 

2JZ-No-Sh*t

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I suppose we should be thankful that we got it at all.

But it seems like a self-fulfilling prophecy, circular blame. Japanese sportscar comes out, sells well, Japanese manufacturer fails to refresh and update car, sales taper off because car hasn't been updated since it came out, Japanese company decides not to renew/refresh car because of declining sales.
Yes, at least they tried to give people something new and fun.

I don't mean to come off as bashing the 86. I'm just saying they could have done a few things differently. Hopefully they have learned from this experience with Subaru, and that it will lead to better results with BMW.
 

vb22

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If they were to make a 2nd gen 86 it would probably just be a very heavy updated and reskin version of the current car. I recall reading something awhile back that said most "next gen cars" usually retain around 30% to 40% or so of components from their predecessor.
 

vb22

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I'd rather see a new Celica or MR2 successor as well, with the MR2 carrying a huge edge over the former.

They even had the damn concept done and it was a drivable prototype. And bam! Cancelled...
Same, but it needs to be turbo and AWD. I want a new GT4! The 7th gen was a joke.
 

johnny_10196

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I'd rather see a new Celica or MR2 successor as well, with the MR2 carrying a huge edge over the former.

They even had the damn concept done and it was a drivable prototype. And bam! Cancelled...
Are you referring to this?

Toyota-GRMN-Sports-Hybrid-Concept-II-Carscoop3.jpg
 

tfoxyr

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Actually they had many setups which they were testing for a next gen 86 , even hybrid and supercharged . I don't know if it was scrapped in the recent years but there were 2 main routes the car could take , let me explain. The first route was with subaru and continue maybe with the boxer but with the FB16 with forced induction and increase its output as happened with the FB20 becoming the FA20. The second route is in my opinion more interesting and also all the hints show towards it . The first hint is that the boxer badge on the 86 for the facelift was gone even though people loved it , ok this is minor but still if you knew the second gen would dump the boxer you would try to change the image of the car .The second hint is from insiders at BMW , they revealed the plans for a z3 revival that could be developed with toyota as a next gen 86 / celica . Also a car was actually testing some mystery setup for a futiure z3 . They hinted that the z3 could come with a 3 cylinder . Of these the only concrete thing is the testing of the z3 as a future z car which may or may not be done with toyota.
 

Guff

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I'm pretty regularly probing Toyota and Subaru folks about the 86, for obvious reasons, and nobody at Toyota has even once mentioned to me a next gen 86 in development. However, the Subaru folks have said that they're looking into their options for an update.

All this being said, that doesn't mean that Toyota isn't planning on refreshing the car. Things are getting shaken up at Toyota as we speak. Development on new models has taken a relative backseat after the lastest big refreshes and so don't discount a new ZN6/ZC6 at some point in the future.
 

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