wiggle stick rookie seeking advice

[GR_Matt]

This is general MT advice for starting from a stop, so you may already have done this but...

Get good at finding the friction point of the clutch, without using the gas. On level ground, from a stop, start with the clutch all the way down, slowly lift the clutch until the revs start to drop. That's the friction point. Practice lifting your foot quickly from the floorboard to just below this point every time. It's at this point of the pedal travel that you can apply gas for a smooth start.

Also hill starts. Just practice. I went to a hill in a quiet neighborhood and just practiced starting from a stop again and again and again. This was in the weeks after I bought my first MT car and almost returned it because I didn't think I could drive a stick.

"Every day it gets a little easier. But you got to do it every day. That's the hard part. But it does get easier." Ok.

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[romanLegion9574]

DO freely start doing downshifts, honestly the intelligent iMT rev match in the manual Supra is SUBLIME, I absolutely love it.

It won't get you any sympathy from all the purist track rats here who will try to have your head on a spike as a heretic for daring to buy a manual sports car and not disabling iMT, but you bought this car to enjoy it, so do so and don't worry about anyone else getting their panties in a twist because you don't want to heel and toe while going to the fucking grocery store like an idiot.

Seconded on the iMT, Toyota did a great job with it in the GRC, and I expect it would be similar in the Supra.

 

[BMWAF]

Seconded on the iMT, Toyota did a great job with it in the GRC, and I expect it would be similar in the Supra.

I planned on turning iMT off immediately but other than me blipping the throttle between gears out of habit, I agree the iMT is actually pretty good in the Supra. Actually, it's better than that. It hasn't annoyed me once and it does the job well. This is one thing Toyota definitely got right.

Now, about that hill assist..

 

[romanLegion9574]

I planned on turning iMT off immediately but other than me blipping the throttle between gears out of habit, I agree the iMT is actually pretty good in the Supra. Actually, it's better than that. It hasn't annoyed me once and it does the job well. This is one thing Toyota definitely got right.

Now, about that hill assist..

Less said about hill assist, the better.

 

[Tacoma714]

I recently picked up my long awaited (about nine months of waiting as if i were carrying a baby to term) 6MT 3.0L premium Supra on 8/12/23.

I learned how to drive manual in a mx-5 and drove manual a few more times in a 10th gen Si. I could count all the times ive driven manual on one hand to sum it up. This Supra is my first time really driving manual on a daily basis. The car is at about 510 miles so i'm almost halfway with the break in period.

I can drive it from point A to point B no problem. Getting into 1st is super slow still but a lot smoother of a transition now. I am struggling getting smooth transitions from 1st -> 2nd -> and sometimes into 3rd. I don't know enough to pinpoint what exaclty im doing wrong. I think i come off of the clutch too quickly, but idk.

I've heard there is rev hang in 1st and 2nd but dont know what exactly to do with that information.

i have a good grasp on how a manual transmission works but when it comes to putting it to play i am struggling figuring out when to do what exactly. I dont want my ignorance to f up the car in any way. I just want to drive my car without sweating or anxiety lol Any advice would be greatly appreciated

I did the CDV delete recently as someone who grew up with manuals and it definitely made a difference. It wasn't like it turned me into Ayrton Senna, but it helped a lot. My wife who also drives manual very well was asking me what was wrong on my 1st to 2nd and 2nd to 3rd shifts with the CDV. Don't do that mod until you get comfortable shifting first. The true answer is that practice makes perfect. More seat time and practicing the clutch engagement part along with your right foot off and on the gas is the key. I grew up driving manual with my old man teaching me to drive on a 6MT yelling at me at 16 years old. LoL! We now have YouTube and there are plenty of good videos. Just watch a lot of them then go drive. Watch the video and watch his feet.

 

[Rocksandblues]

sigh---- people learning to shift on Youtube- LOL Man, back in the day you just pretended you were brave and stalled a bunch. I bought a used Audi Coupe that was manual when i was 17 after working 2 summer jobs and saving for 3 years. Had NO IDEA how to drive a stick. Stalled it like 3 times on test drive. Actually was scared the grown up owner would not sell to me... def no "tech" in that 1984 Audi

 

[bushido]

ah, i remember when i transitioned from 6spd FWD to 5spd AWD..

to make it short, clutch delay valve (CDV) is meant to help shift smoother but everyone feels it impedes. one of my Si's had this and same as you and several that commented, made the 1-2 shift horrible

~ 500 miles is just a bit! time and practice. you can practice your downshifts on the highway. let's say you're cruising at 70. downshift to 5th, to 4th. upshift to 5th, to 6th. repeat. i can't think of a safer way. eyes on the road, of course

also, to practice shifting faster, you don't need to be hauling ass. you can shift at 0.001 ms while going from 4th to 5th at 30mph, etc.

 

[FlammasWRLD]

This is general MT advice for starting from a stop, so you may already have done this but...

Get good at finding the friction point of the clutch, without using the gas. On level ground, from a stop, start with the clutch all the way down, slowly lift the clutch until the revs start to drop. That's the friction point. Practice lifting your foot quickly from the floorboard to just below this point every time. It's at this point of the pedal travel that you can apply gas for a smooth start.

Also hill starts. Just practice. I went to a hill in a quiet neighborhood and just practiced starting from a stop again and again and again. This was in the weeks after I bought my first MT car and almost returned it because I didn't think I could drive a stick.

"Every day it gets a little easier. But you got to do it every day. That's the hard part. But it does get easier." Ok.

Liked for the bojack quote LOL

 

[_Sp1ral0ut]

Great tutorial on how to drive a manual while in front of a car and behind it.

 

[MaximumAttack]

It's probably not you. The gearbox in the Supra isn't as good as people suggest. I suspect they have come from an automatic gearbox or a very poor manual one so they think they have stumbled on gold. They haven't. My 15 year old Type R has a much better gearbox - And I don't mean when it was new.. I mean it's better now, after 15 years of pretty hard use!

For context, I have been driving manuals (almost exclusively) for over 20 years and the aforementioned Type R is still on its original clutch after over 200,000km! I can say with confidence that the 1-2 shift in the Supra is at best unpredictable and at worst dog shit. On occasion, by some miracle it does feels good but after 2,000km I still can't ascertain what I am doing to perform a "good" change in this car.

Don't get me wrong - the Supra's gearbox/clutch are almost mind-numbingly easy to drive casually.. they're just not very good.



Unpopular opinion: I am not a believer in the CDV argument. While I have no experience in shifting a car without a Clutch Delay Valve, my Type R has a CDV and the clutch is great: Smooth as butter. Pulling hard; driving in traffic, etc. the clutch engagement is always on point.

Is the CDV in the Supra as bad as it's (1-2 shift) gearbox? Now that is a good question. But CDVs in and of themselves - in my experience at least - are just an excuse people jump to when they're presented with a less than stellar gearbox/clutch implementation or otherwise find drivng manuals challenging.

Just depends on how you define "good", IMO. I have an S2000 (currently being built into a time attack car and soon won't have the original manual transmission in it anymore, but I drove it with it for like 8 years). The S2000 shifter certainly has a shorter throw and feels tighter/more crisp overall, but it also can be pretty notchy (in a bad way, particularly in the cold), and it definitely isn't going to take anywhere near as much abuse. I think the same is true of most other manual Hondas.

I do agree that the Supra's manual is exceptionally easy to use. Very easy car to drive. While the throw is a little longer than in the S2000, I think the manual is pretty great and very smooth. It matches the character of the smooth inline 6 and more refined feeling of the car.

However, it take some getting used to in order to shift smoothly from 1st to 2nd. You just have to release the clutch much more slowly. The engine has quite a bit of torque.

The only purpose of a CDV is to try to reduce shock to the drivetrain. That's it. Some people hate them, and some people don't mind them, but the reason manufacturers put them there is to try to reduce wear and tear.

I will say that the clutch feels very light in this car compared to what I was used to with the S2000. It's a little too light for my tastes. Will probably feel better with an upgraded clutch that can hold more torque.

 

[BMWAF]

The S2000 shifter certainly has a shorter throw and feels tighter/more crisp overall, but it also can be pretty notchy (in a bad way, particularly in the cold), and it definitely isn't going to take anywhere near as much abuse. I think the same is true of most other manual Hondas.

The manual in the FN2 Type R is a good deal newer than the S2000 and it really is sublime - Pretty sure you guys never got anything like it in the US. My understanding is that the gearbox is pretty much regarded as the gold standard under Porsche money.

I do agree that the Supra box needs to handle far more power by necessity but - and I drive these cars back to back regularly - the Supra gearbox really is dog shit in comparison to the 15 year old Honda box.

 

[XtremeMaC]

Question is how does it compare to BMW rivals that Toyota didn't touch

 

[BMWAF]

Question is how does it compare to BMW rivals that Toyota didn't touch

Good question. I wonder if the 1-2 shift is shit in the M2.. or any other BMWs. I haven't seen any reports but I haven't looked, in fairness.

 

[romanLegion9574]

Question is how does it compare to BMW rivals that Toyota didn't touch

I tried a stock Supra shifter and it felt a bit more tactile than F87 M2 my buddy has. He also changed out some parts to reduce the rubbery feel and the Supra still felt better.

 

[Boataur]

Count me among what seems to be the few who actually like both the clutch and the gearbox. Every manual takes some getting used to, and not all shifts will be perfect.

I’ve been driving a manual for 54 years, and this one rates right up there with a Civic Si and a Focus ST as my favorite. This is my first time with auto rev match, and it’s a blast. I’m not too proud to use it. The hill assist works like every other one I’ve used, and it is better than my most recent car, a GLI.

Its not perfect, but it’s darn good for me.

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