Toyota Teases GR Line Up: Supra MK6, Celica MK8, MR2 MK4, 86 MK3 and GR GT

[NicKnack]

I hope they don't base the next Supra on the N platform (IS, RC). If they do, it's inevitable that the car will end up being a porker, just like every other small car based on a larger car. I like the RC-F, but it's really an American Muscle car built by a Japanese company - big, heavy, comfy, with a V8.

The Supra deserves its own bespoke platform, like the 86 gets, but if they must share a platform, I hope Toyota shares it with the 86. Who wouldn't love a GR86 powered by a "G32E" 3.2L I6 turbo, with some higher end materials used in the suspension? Especially if they can keep a similar $65k price point.

There's nothing bespoke about the FT86 Twins platform, it's a heavily modified Impreza Chassis. The Z4 Chassis the Supra uses is worlds better.

If Toyota were to use an entirely bespoke chassis for the Supra and make an I6 based off the G16, by the time it was approved for production, it would put the cost of this car easily in the $150k range, at which point everyone will just complain that it's too expensive for a Toyota. RnD is expensive, and developing a bespoke platform and engine is incredibly expensive.

Although I do agree that I hope any future iterations of this car are not based off of the N platform that Lexus uses, it just doesn't lend well as a sports car platform.

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[Vinny]

I wouldn't be mad if the next RC/LC and Supra take some cues from this

 

[KahnBB6]

To me, in the current line up of Toyota/Lexus there doesn't seem to be a suitable chassis. The most obvious would be the RC chassis, but it seems to be outdated - it's much larger/heavier than the current generation Supra. Unless they've already developed a new RC chassis with the Supra in mind...

Yeah, that is the part I still don't have any information on. My guess is it is one of the "future" sports models that Akio presented a while back. Remember, there were two sports cars.....one looked like what could be the next "LFA" and the other I don't know what it was anticipated to be...but I am assuming it might be that. There was also a big push to ramp up Carbon Fiber production. As exotic as carbon fiber is, it is not a great material to use in Luxury cars as it has high NVH so I assume it might be used on the Supra but not on the Lexus.

I really think the answer you're both looking for is a platform that hasn't been released or formally announced yet. And this has already gained at least some traction:

https://lexusenthusiast.com/2024/10/31/new-lexus-coupe-may-have-supra-roots/

This is what I believe A70TTR was talking about a LONG while back: A RWD scalable sportscar/coupe platform that both Toyota and Lexus can use. The GR GT3 / LFR / GR Super Sport is its own thing as is likely whatever the LFA-II EV concept will eventually be.

Lexus will soon be killing off the RC coupe and LC coupe. Supposedly they're aiming to replace both with a new coupe that will be upmarket from the RC and downmarket from the LC.

https://www.carscoops.com/2024/03/lexus-may-launch-a-new-coupe-to-replace-rc-and-lc/

https://lexusenthusiast.com/2024/09/29/should-lexus-resurrect-the-sc-coupe/

...

So if the plan is to repeat the platform sharing of the 1980's and 1990's again with a Toyota Supra & Lexus SC/Soarer tie-up this would help them spread costs around more and allow for the Supra MKVI to stay somewhat attainable rather than give it a bespoke platform which would take it into much more expensive territory than it already is.

And they will definitely make plenty of money on the Lexus version of the chassis. It very likely being a proper GT 2+2 driver's car again that is tuneable like the old Soarer/SC300/SC400 makes it even better.

They definitely won't use the current aging RC platform for this. It's such a mashup of several chassis and is extremely heavy for what it is.

...

As for the new Celica... that will NOT be based on the current GR86 platform. I own one and it's a great chassis and car... but it's about to go away because the FA24D engine soon will not meet new more stringent fuel economy and emissions regulations around the world in its current form... and because the chassis itself won't meet upcoming new crash safety regulations in its current form.

This is why Toyota decided to take over all development of the 3rd gen GR86 themselves using the current Lexus IS chassis and longitudinal G16E engine as a starting point. But my suspicion has been that it will become a sedan only as an homage to the 1998-2005 Altezza RS200 and original Lexus IS300.

There is no telling if Subaru will even sell a version of their own anymore at that point.

The new Celica coupe will be more likely TNGA based with FWD trims and a range topping turbo AWD GT-Four successor in the GR lineup. That way Toyota will also be able to offer a range of other Celica trim levels including a hybrid and probably a convertible.

 

[KahnBB6]

It’s tough for someone to leak this kind of info because it’s just not fair to the manufacturers. I am sure a few prominent YouTubers had been given detailed information about other models (like the GTD Mustang or ZR-1 Corvette) before launch, and only hinted at small details during its development, leaving the manufacturers to have their moment during the official unveiling.

As for your reasoning, you’re not far off. There is definitely some uncertainty around a new Supra. I think there are two possible directions being considered.

1. A GR Supra based on an existing chassis, similar to how the GR Corolla was developed. In this case, they’d use a base chassis (likely from Toyota/Lexus) and add unique hardware for the GR version.

2. A Supra built from the ground up, with its design influencing other vehicles (e.g., new Lexus models). Initially, I thought this might be the route since the GT3/LFR seems to have been developed and tested before the Supra even became a topic of discussion. This approach, along with the rumors of a lightweight and rigid chassis focus, seemed to align with that idea.

However, I’m starting to lean toward the first direction now. It feels more likely that Toyota has an existing chassis in mind and plans to outfit it with unique GR-specific hardware. This approach mirrors the GR Corolla, which is based on the standard Corolla chassis but features completely unique hardware (engine, transmission, differentials, suspension, brakes, aero, etc.). Similarly, the new Celica (if it happens) might use the GR 86 platform with bespoke hardware. I think the new Supra will follow this pattern, built on an existing chassis but equipped with special GR components.

Curious to see how it unfolds!

I do understand how it's a really difficult thing when info gets unintentionally leaked. It takes years to develop one car let alone several or to shift major goings on inside a big design and manufacturing company.

We can't help but be curious as fans! But at the same time we absolutely want these companies and their special car projects to succeed.

I am in the 1st scenario camp based on a few combined rumors and also because it would save overall costs. But I do not think it will be based on an existing chassis that's currently in production but rather one that will also underpin the new Lexus coupe. See my previous reply above.

The new Celica is definitely happening. They trademarked the name again and Akio Toyoda keeps dropping hints about it. They want to do a new GT-Four though and that to me suggests a variation of the TNGA platform... which will also allow for many variants that aren't necessarily in the hardcore AWD turbo rally car category.

See my previous reply above also regarding the GR86 chassis. It's great in its current form but is about to be retired since it cannot meet upcoming very stringent fuel economy, emissions and crash regulations. The "Generation 2" car that has been on sale since 2022 was always a stop-gap to sell a very improved version of the 2012-2021 GT86/BRZ chassis for a bit longer until Toyota could replace it with their own "Generation 3" model.

The new Celica will likely be the affordable coupe offering while the 3rd gen "GR86" will likely be a sedan like the Altezza.

There is also the upcoming S-FR / Copen / Cappuccino two seater RWD coupes and roadsters co-developed trio which will be Miata sized and not Kei class vehicles using a 1.5L detuned version of the G16E turbo I-3.

And the limited production MR2 which will likely share base/starting architecture with the Celica.

And the Rally4 competing GR Starlet 3-door hatch which will get a FWD version of the 1.5L detuned variant of the G16E (But we almost certainly won't be getting that in the U.S.).

Just the same as you I am very curious to see all of this unfold! : )

 

[FLtrackdays]

Yeah, that is the part I still don't have any information on. My guess is it is one of the "future" sports models that Akio presented a while back. Remember, there were two sports cars.....one looked like what could be the next "LFA" and the other I don't know what it was anticipated to be...but I am assuming it might be that. There was also a big push to ramp up Carbon Fiber production. As exotic as carbon fiber is, it is not a great material to use in Luxury cars as it has high NVH so I assume it might be used on the Supra but not on the Lexus.

“Fast, cheap, reliable- pick two“

Truth in that subtext sig of yours! This Supra provided an incredible amount of performance (bang) for the buck. It was hard not to consider it when shopping for more expensive track cars. Add to the fact the ability to mod/upgrade the car, I really hope they continue that route for more models in the future.

 

[Funkjaw]

I just really, really hope the next gen Supra has a longer wheelbase. The current 97.2" wheelbase on a car that is supposed to be a GT car is absolutely retarded. Now it doesn't need to be 107" like a Mustang, but having it AT LEAST be longer than a GR86 (101.4") would be a start.

 

[Emspilot]

I just really, really hope the next gen Supra has a longer wheelbase. The current 97.2" wheelbase on a car that is supposed to be a GT car is absolutely retarded. Now it doesn't need to be 107" like a Mustang, but having it AT LEAST be longer than a GR86 (101.4") would be a start.

It’s not a GT car.

 

[Funkjaw]

It’s not a GT car.

Regardless - it needs a longer wheelbase, OR lose 600lbs (which we all know it won't). I'd say anything longer than 100" would be a vast improvement in it's handling characteristics.

 

[Emspilot]

Regardless - it needs a longer wheelbase, OR lose 600lbs (which we all know it won't). I'd say anything longer than 100" would be a vast improvement in it's handling characteristics.

Really? ChatGPT and Wikipedia?
No one conceives of and designs a car with a target wheelbase to match a Porsche (cayman I think?) and considers it a GT. You may think it works as one, but it is not a GT.
Your argument that it’s shorter than an 86 makes the prima facia case.

 

[SupraYYJ]

Derp.

 

[KahnBB6]

I'm a fan of the longer wheelbase of the older MKIV model but that car itself was slightly compromised from what its chief designer lobbied for (a bespoke chassis that could be less GT and more pure sportscar). It remained a 2+2 GT for that reason given its Z30 Toyota Soarer chassis starting point.

The classic MKIV is awesome in its own right and character as a 2+2 GT sportscar but the MKV appears to have been deliberately envisioned to be a shorter and more nimble generation purist sportscar and to great success.

The MKVI generation will be interesting since Toyota is going back to sharing a platform with a Lexus coupe... only unlike with the MKIV where the Lexus coupe basis came first and the Supra had to be derived from that it's possible that this time the shared chassis was designed for the potentialities of both cars before their respective chief engineers got to work with what they were given to each their own ends. At least that's what A70TTR seemed to say was the case.

So I am interested to see how that will cause the final product MKVI chassis measure against the MKV chassis in terms of what character of sportscar it will be going forward.

 

[Bryster]

I hope MKVI breaks the cycle of the backseats

 

[Funkjaw]

Really? ChatGPT and Wikipedia?
No one conceives of and designs a car with a target wheelbase to match a Porsche (cayman I think?) and considers it a GT. You may think it works as one, but it is not a GT.
Your argument that it’s shorter than an 86 makes the prima facia case.

Ok, I was wrong the car is not supposed to be a GT like the 4 generations before it. You win. Congrats.

It still needs a longer wheel base. The wheel base it has now is more fitting for a vehicle 300lbs+ lighter (like the Caymen). I suspect the next gen will infact get this longer wheel base and I will be a happy boy.

 

[Bigboss]

Ok, I was wrong the car is not supposed to be a GT like the 4 generations before it. You win. Congrats.

It still needs a longer wheel base. The wheel base it has now is more fitting for a vehicle 300lbs+ lighter (like the Caymen). I suspect the next gen will infact get this longer wheel base and I will be a happy boy.

You live your life dictated by AI now eh old timer?

 

[bk5]

It still needs a longer wheel base. The wheel base it has now is more fitting for a vehicle 300lbs+ lighter (like the Caymen)

You're grossly misrepresenting the weight of the Cayman by comparing the lightest Cayman to the heaviest Supra. The base four cylinder automatic Cayman model is 50lbs lighter than the base four cylinder automatic Supra.

The weight difference isn't in the chassis, it's in the engine. If you want a car powered by a turbo inline six, then you've got to pay the weight penalty of such a configuration. But if weight is the primary concern, then you're after the four cylinder versions of either model.

Personally, I'm fine with the weight of the Supra. I don't notice a difference when I have a 150lb passenger, so I doubt I'd notice if the car was suddenly the weight of a GTS 4.0L cayman.

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