👣 Official: Toyota Announces Manual Transmission Supra!

[DesmoSD]

So what are you talking about? BMW uses different center consoles for manual G chassis cars so I don't know why the Supra wouldn't have one either. The Z4 has a stamped firewall for a CMC so I am pretty sure the Supra does as well. BMW clutch pedals attach to the brake pedal bracket so a hole in the firewall wouldn't be needed for that. The Z4 has a manual so theres a transmission tunnel that fits the chassis. Am I missing anything?

I only addressed electronics because that seems to be the most difficult hoop to jump through.

My bad, I sort of jumped the gun before realizing the EAG 6 speed swap. Yeah, they made it work but since a manual wasn't available, they had to fab some pieces up and make some tweaks here and there. They did a drive it after SEMA and all seemed fine and dandy but they didn't really touch base on the ECU issues.

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[justbake]

My bad, I sort of jumped the gun before realizing the EAG 6 speed swap. Yeah, they made it work but since a manual wasn't available, they had to fab some pieces up and make some tweaks here and there. They did a drive it after SEMA and all seemed fine and dandy but they didn't really touch base on the ECU issues.

Yeah I think from an aftermarket standpoint a manual swapped Supra would be rather difficult, it is no surprise that we haven't heard much of it since SEMA.

 

[Dannyvandelft]

If you're going to purposely miss my point then I think it is fair to mention your argument is incredibly flawed since the Supra isn't the top Toyota, the LC and RC are above the Supra. Your point comes across as: "if you ignore the cars above the Supra, the Supra is the top Toyota."

The LC and RC aren't Toyota's. They're nowhere branded as such.

 

[justbake]

The LC and RC aren't Toyota's. They're nowhere branded as such.

Agree to disagree on that.

Nevertheless, you're welcome to address what I said about power levels being a factor in this. 382hp is different than other manufacturers having way more hp in their top cars where a manual is a huge performance hit and costly to manufacture at those power levels reliably. Being the "top" car from a manufacturer is irrelevant and has no bearing on a car having a manual or not, correlation is not causation.

I'll record myself eating a banana with the peel if you show me where I said a car has to have a manual to be a driver's car.

 

[Dannyvandelft]

The Supra is Toyota's fastest car, not counting Lexus. Top Nissan, Top Porsche, Top Honda, Top Ford, Top Chevy, etc. ALL AUTO ONLY.

That correlation is irrelevant. The difference is that Toyota’s fastest car has a lot less power and is meant to be a driver’s car.

Right there.

 

[justbake]

Right there.

Youre missing the implications of it being a driver's car and not a car chasing numbers, not that autos aren't drivers cars. We literally talked about this is another thread in how I would probably buy the auto even if there was a 6mt

 

[Dannyvandelft]

Youre missing the implications of it being a driver's car and not a car chasing numbers, not that autos aren't drivers cars. We literally talked about this is another thread in how I would probably buy the auto even if there was a 6mt

The Supra has to chase numbers. It's the top of the line Toyota, the return of a legend, etc, etc. If they stuck in a manual and the 3.0 did 0-60 in 5 seconds instead of 4, it would be DOA. Why do you think Chevy only put a DCT in the C8? There's faster versions coming, why not put a manual in it? Because numbers matter.

 

[justbake]

The Supra has to chase numbers. It's the top of the line Toyota, the return of a legend, etc, etc. If they stuck in a manual and the 3.0 did 0-60 in 5 seconds instead of 4, it would be DOA. Why do you think Chevy only put a DCT in the C8? There's faster versions coming, why not put a manual in it? Because numbers matter.

"It's not a numbers car" - Toyota on 335/382hp
"It's for the numbers" - Toyota on why its has an auto

 

[Dannyvandelft]

"It's not a numbers car" - Toyota on 335/382hp
"It's for the numbers" - Toyota on why its has an auto

I didn't say it's a numbers car, I said it has to chase them. If it was a numbers car they'd have given it 600 horsepower and a $120k price tag. The auto/DCT is such a performance improvement, that just about every flagship exclusively has it as I've outlined before. The Supra is Toyota's flagship, so take it as you will. It has to compete, and beat, performance numbers in it's price class, or it won't sell. As far as the 2.0, they could stick a manual in there. It's priced enough far away from the 86 that it shouldn't draw too many customers away.

 

[justbake]

I didn't say it's a numbers car, I said it has to chase them. If it was a numbers car they'd have given it 600 horsepower and a $120k price tag. The auto/DCT is such a performance improvement, that just about every flagship exclusively has it as I've outlined before. The Supra is Toyota's flagship, so take it as you will. It has to compete, and beat, performance numbers in it's price class, or it won't sell. As far as the 2.0, they could stick a manual in there. It's priced enough far away from the 86 that it shouldn't draw too many customers away.

I never said you did, it clearly states Toyota did.

Of course the auto is a performance improvement, this isn’t 2005. But it doesn’t address that you’re equating it to cars like the NSX, GTR, Ford GT, and 992 Turbo S. It’s ridiculous to think the Supra in its current form had the same development goals and target demographics as the cars I listed above.

 

[Dannyvandelft]

I never said you did, it clearly states Toyota did.

Of course the auto is a performance improvement, this isn’t 2005. But it doesn’t address that the cars you’re equating it to cars like the NSX, GTR, Ford GT, and 992 Turbo S. It’s ridiculous to think the Supra in its current form had the same development goals as the cars I listed above.

Of course they do. They all have the same goals. To sell cars. How do you sell them? By being faster in your price bracket than the competition. Doesn't matter if it's a 20k Hyundai or a 3 million Koenigsegg. How do you become faster? By dropping the manual. That's why the current STI is hilariously outperformed by just about anything right now, and that's why Corvette designers didn't even bother with a manual. Not to mention an auto is usually better in MPG because of the better gear ratios and higher amount of gears. It all adds up to manuals being ancient tech and pretty much useless.

 

[justbake]

Of course they do. They all have the same goals. To sell cars. How do you sell them? By being faster in your price bracket than the competition. Doesn't matter if it's a 20k Hyundai or a 3 million Koenigsegg. How do you become faster? By dropping the manual. That's why the current STI is hilariously outperformed by just about anything right now, and that's why Corvette designers didn't even bother with a manual. Not to mention an auto is usually better in MPG because of the better gear ratios and higher amount of gears. It all adds up to manuals being ancient tech and pretty much useless.

That is an incredibly simplistic way to look at this. By that logic only the Mustang and Corvette would sell.

I remember an interview with Tada San about what the FR-S does better than it's competition and he said "nothing" then just smiled

 

[Dannyvandelft]

That is an incredibly simplistic way to look at this. By that logic only the Mustang and Corvette would sell.

I remember an interview with Tada San about what the FR-S does better than it's competition and he said "nothing" then just smiled

And they sell incredibly well.

He's right about the FR-S. It really isn't anything special. The FA20 sounds awful, the midrange dip is annoying, the interior is awful, etc.

 

[justbake]

And they sell incredibly well.

He's right about the FR-S. It really isn't anything special. The FA20 sounds awful, the midrange dip is annoying, the interior is awful, etc.

So why would someone buy the 86 if they aren’t the best? Why did you buy the Supra if it isn’t the fastest in its price bracket?

 

[Dannyvandelft]

So why would someone buy the 86 if they aren’t the best? Why did you buy the Supra if it isn’t the fastest in its price bracket?

I have no idea why anyone would buy an 86 lol. Never appealed to me.
The Supra is plenty fast. That's my point. Because it has the auto. What's a faster 2 seater coupe than it for $50k?

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