Do NOT buy a Supra right now

ourlee

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Truly I’m holding out for a CPO 6-sp 4 cyl for $35k. My TT can hold me off til then.
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Supra Guy

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Truly I’m holding out for a CPO 6-sp 4 cyl for $35k. My TT can hold me off til then.
Thought you were going for a Golf R.

I’m wait for 22 when my GTI Sport is paid off before I get a Supra.
 

alex2364

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I think you make a good point. I’m not trying to disrespect you or anything (thanks for the vid) but i Will use a different analogy to make my point.

When the Tesla Model 3 came out, all we heard about was lowest priced Tesla ever and $35,000 starting price

A lot of people got caught up with that.

It’s now years later and the cheapest Tesla Model 3 that I have found in my area is $42k. In fact, two coworkers bought there’s for such that (they were also some of the ones who made a big deal about the $35,000 price).

Now does a $35,000 Tesla Model 3 exists somewhere? Perhaps, but I haven’t seen it. But it is a unicorn as far as I’m concerned.

I feel like if Chevy were to really have a $59,999 C8 on their lots (like literally, several to choose and not just one per dealer per region, per state, per quarter or something) and not just showing up on someone’s inventory sheet, then they have a winner. If that happens, it’s good for the performance car world because it forces many many companies to go back to the drawing board! But I have a feeling the $59,999 will be just a unicorn.it sounds like a marketing ploy like the example that I used, even though on paper, it is technically “available”

And I actually think it would be a good thing if you were right and I was wrong. But looking at listed C7 prices in my area (High 60’s to mid 70’s seem to be the lowest median price) and I have my doubts on a $59,999 C8 even further. I personally feel like the $59999 price doesn’t mean anything if the average car buyer can’t go into the dealership and find one for that marketed price. And when I look at C7 prices (technically, dealers should be “motivated” to move these out) in my area, I think those suspicions are confirmed
What does Tesla have to do with the C8 Corvette? Two completely different companies. Do you not understand the concept of custom ordering your exact specs? The C8 has tons of options compared to the Supra and any other regular Toyota. If you want a base $60k then custom order your car and it will arrive in a month.
 

acadapter

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What does Tesla have to do with the C8 Corvette? Two completely different companies. Do you not understand the concept of custom ordering your exact specs? The C8 has tons of options compared to the Supra and any other regular Toyota. If you want a base $60k then custom order your car and it will arrive in a month.
I think he was making a correlation between vapor-prices and real prices. There is definitely a relationship there when it comes to the Model 3 "base" and Model 3 "real" prices. It remains to be seen whether the C8 will follow that path. Maybe custom orders will be easily accessible, maybe they won't; we don't have much to go on currently.

There are several factors here BUT I think the most important one is the total number of vehicles available on each platform. It's similar to shopping at a dealer that sells 100 cars a month vs 250 cars a month --- Some dealerships make their quota with volume, some make it by selling less cars without as much discount. It's a fair assumption Chevy will sell maybe 7-8x as many C8s than Supras (Chevy produced 32k in 2017 and of those production cars, I wouldn't qualify "most" sales being the base car --- https://www.corvettemuseum.org/wp-c...6/2017-Corvette-FINAL-Year-End-HWC-UPDATE.pdf). Just the sheer fact that I don't expect to see a Supra at every corner is a plus but that's just my personal feeling. Some may prefer the many multiples look.

All in all, which one you like shouldn't be about which is the fastest; how many of us are going to be testing that 0-60 regularly? In a separate comparison, a loaded Tesla Model 3 Performance is faster than both of these, cheaper than both of these, sits 4, and has $0 gas cost yet I don't see many folks bringing it into the discussion. That's actually what I'm deciding between because I thought for a while, I wouldn't buy another gas car.
 
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ynguldyn

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And I actually think it would be a good thing if you were right and I was wrong. But looking at listed C7 prices in my area (High 60’s to mid 70’s seem to be the lowest median price) and I have my doubts on a $59,999 C8 even further. I personally feel like the $59999 price doesn’t mean anything if the average car buyer can’t go into the dealership and find one for that marketed price. And when I look at C7 prices (technically, dealers should be “motivated” to move these out) in my area, I think those suspicions are confirmed
Getting $10K or more below sticker on a C7 was trivial even a year ago. Right now, C7 GS is the best deal - you basically get all GS stuff for free. The same is going to happen to C8 after a couple of years. Both Supra and Cayman will suffer.
 

KahnBB6

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I'm also perplexed as to how we got onto any comparison of the Tesla Model 3 to a Corvette C8 or Supra MKV in any way at all.

Don't get me wrong. In addition to cars like the Supra, etc. I am also in favor EV technology.

But the Tesla Model 3 is a soon-to-be driverless taxicab sedan that you don't really drive and which can be optioned in a fast spec (but no longer in RWD only for some incomprehensible reason only known to Elon Musk) but with a mere steering wheel and pedals as the only concessions for the actual driver. The Corvette and Supra on the other hand are clearly driver-centric vehicles from interior to exterior form as well as their function purely as sportscars first and everything else second.

If hypothetically the Tesla Model 3 were a beautiful pure sports car like the other two vehicles but of course fully electric and with a very driver-centric interior emphasizing an instrument cluster over the steering wheel rather than a giant distracting iPad in the middle of the dash... then I could see reason for comparison. The Model 3 looks like an ugly squished egg honestly. And it has not even a simple HUD over the steering wheel.

Totally different kinds of cars. And just to be clear about where I'm coming from, when I say that I am not even focusing on the fully electric vs gasoline combustion differences. Full EV and pure driver-centric sportscar can exist as one. But the Model 3 isn't even slightly that. It's a driverless taxicab that just happens to have a steering wheel and pedals. Even Mr. Musk believes this to be its true purpose.

Back to the Supra MKV... I am interested to see how things begin to take shape once we're past the Launch Edition rollout and start to get into the regular allocations. Especially if Toyota starts adding some more options to the spec sheet... :)
 
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Bryster

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Getting $10K or more below sticker on a C7 was trivial even a year ago. Right now, C7 GS is the best deal - you basically get all GS stuff for free. The same is going to happen to C8 after a couple of years. Both Supra and Cayman will suffer.
As well as the Hellcat and GT500
 

NDavis

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Are we still comparing the price of the c8 to the Supra? Pointless imo. Who cares if an average C8 will sticker for 10k more then an average mk5. The important thing with the c8 is it will sticker on average 100k to 300k under its actual competition. New NSX, R8, Ferrari 488, Lambo Huracan, Maclaren 570 etc.
I think you’re both making good points. I can’t fault either perspective.
 

acadapter

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I'm also perplexed as to how we got onto any comparison of the Tesla Model 3 to a Corvette C8 or Supra MKV in any way at all.

Don't get me wrong. In addition to cars like the Supra, etc. I am also in favor EV technology.

But the Tesla Model 3 is a soon-to-be driverless taxicab sedan that you don't really drive and which can be optioned in a fast spec (but no longer in RWD only for some incomprehensible reason only known to Elon Musk) but with a mere steering wheel and pedals as the only concessions for the actual driver. The Corvette and Supra on the other hand are clearly driver-centric vehicles from interior to exterior form as well as their function purely as sportscars first and everything else second.

If hypothetically the Tesla Model 3 were a beautiful pure sports car like the other two vehicles but of course fully electric and with a very driver-centric interior emphasizing an instrument cluster over the steering wheel rather than a giant distracting iPad in the middle of the dash... then I could see reason for comparison. The Model 3 looks like an ugly squished egg honestly. And it has not even a simple HUD over the steering wheel.

Totally different kinds of cars. And just to be clear about where I'm coming from, when I say that I am not even focusing on the fully electric vs gasoline combustion differences. Full EV and pure driver-centric sportscar can exist as one. But the Model 3 isn't even slightly that. It's a driverless taxicab that just happens to have a steering wheel and pedals. Even Mr. Musk believes this to be its true purpose.

Back to the Supra MKV... I am interested to see how things begin to take shape once we're past the Launch Edition rollout and start to get into the regular allocations. Especially if Toyota starts adding some more options to the spec sheet... :)
The point should be, comparisons are very subjective in a class like that. People don't tend to cross-shop sports cars the same way you cross-shop minivans or SUVs because they aren't typically being used for practical purposes.

Other than your opinion of the Model 3 interior, the other information you used is all speculation on the future; same way people are comparing what MKV values will be 5-10 years from now. None of that is guaranteed. So if people are buying this, the C8, etc on what it will be 5+ years from now, cool but that remains to be seen.
 

SilverMk2

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I don't know where you guys are getting your pricing ideas on Corvettes, but you'll easily be able to buy a C8 after a year or so under sticker. It's be that way since at least the C5 days. Nobody pays sticker or more for a GM car unless you're an idiot. You have to know what dealers to go to but there are dealers that specialize in Corvettes around the country to buy from that discount them.

For instance base C7 corvettes;
[URL]https://kerbeck.com/new-corvette-inventory/?body%5B0%5D=1YY07&action=filter&sort=msrp&order=ASC[/URL]
[URL]https://www.macmulkin.net/VehicleSearchResults?search=new&make=Chevrolet&model=Corvette[/URL]
https://www.boardwalkchevrolet.com/VehicleSearchResults?model=Corvette
https://www.criswellcorvette.com/Ve...vrolet&model=Corvette&trim=Stingray Coupe 1LT
https://www.corvetteking.com/Vehicl...vrolet&model=Corvette&trim=Stingray Coupe 1LT

Typically base C7s are about $50k, GS about mid to upper 50s, Z06s low 70s, and ZR1s at sticker. Starting with the C7 GM started to nickel and dime you with frilly options like Porsche, but you can always special order what you want. I'd say most cars on the lot don't have those things anyways. The 2LT trim is kind of the sweet spot in the trim levels IMO. It's nicer, but doesn't have the huge jump in price of the 3LT. The most annoying option is the comp seats which are ridiculously expensive and not that common to find.
 

MickOpalak

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I am over the C8 comments. They are not even close to the same car. The allure of the Supra has always been the aftermarket community, and the fact that once the owner started on the car it became unique. It was the same way with the 300 and RX-7. While we dont know if the A90 will have the same support, initial interest is promising.

The 2nd thing is your comparing a base Corvette to a loaded (although there is a small model range) Supra. And while its very impressively priced, start adding any of the options etc and you will be well over 75K. Move to any of the track focused editions and now were talking well into 6 figures.

Ill take a 60K supra with some mods that you will see very few of, over a corvette any day.
upload_2019-7-26_10-43-54.png
 

CSUfiend

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Did people really think that I was cross shopping a C8 and Tesla Model 3?:eek:

Just read guys. Read the entire post. This is how fake news gets spread, when people don’t read:(
 
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Dick

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Typically base C7s are about $50k, GS about mid to upper 50s, Z06s low 70s, and ZR1s at sticker. Starting with the C7 GM started to nickel and dime you with frilly options like Porsche, but you can always special order what you want. I'd say most cars on the lot don't have those things anyways. The 2LT trim is kind of the sweet spot in the trim levels IMO. It's nicer, but doesn't have the huge jump in price of the 3LT. The most annoying option is the comp seats which are ridiculously expensive and not that common to find.
For 2019, transaction prices for corvettes run 90-92% of MSRP (transaction prices includes customer paid cash incentives; does not included finance/lease or dealer cash incentives). Highest discounts as a % of MSPR are on the stingrays with the Z51 package which sell for ~87% of MSRP. The ZR1 isn’t discounted at all (99.5%-100%). For comparison a Silverado 1500 sells for ~83% of MSRP.

One other data point - the trend since model
Year launch of the C7 in 2014:
2014 99%
2015 98%
2016 97%
2017 96%
2018 93%
2019 91%
(The base model 1LT dropped off a bit quicker selling at 95% of MSRP for model year 2016. Today it sells for $54k with an avg MSRP of $60k.

Might have some Supra data in a few weeks, would skewed by a small sample size though.
 

CSUfiend

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I don't know where you guys are getting your pricing ideas on Corvettes, but you'll easily be able to buy a C8 after a year or so under sticker. It's be that way since at least the C5 days. Nobody pays sticker or more for a GM car unless you're an idiot. You have to know what dealers to go to but there are dealers that specialize in Corvettes around the country to buy from that discount them.

For instance base C7 corvettes;
https://kerbeck.com/new-corvette-inventory/?body[0]=1YY07&action=filter&sort=msrp&order=ASC
https://www.macmulkin.net/VehicleSearchResults?search=new&make=Chevrolet&model=Corvette
https://www.boardwalkchevrolet.com/VehicleSearchResults?model=Corvette
https://www.criswellcorvette.com/VehicleSearchResults?search=new&make=Chevrolet&model=Corvette&trim=Stingray Coupe 1LT
https://www.corvetteking.com/VehicleSearchResults?search=new&make=Chevrolet&model=Corvette&trim=Stingray Coupe 1LT

Typically base C7s are about $50k, GS about mid to upper 50s, Z06s low 70s, and ZR1s at sticker. Starting with the C7 GM started to nickel and dime you with frilly options like Porsche, but you can always special order what you want. I'd say most cars on the lot don't have those things anyways. The 2LT trim is kind of the sweet spot in the trim levels IMO. It's nicer, but doesn't have the huge jump in price of the 3LT. The most annoying option is the comp seats which are ridiculously expensive and not that common to find.
Thanks for the post. That’s really helpful stuff right there for anyone shopping for a car
 

CSUfiend

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For 2019, transaction prices for corvettes run 90-92% of MSRP (transaction prices includes customer paid cash incentives; does not included finance/lease or dealer cash incentives). Highest discounts as a % of MSPR are on the stingrays with the Z51 package which sell for ~87% of MSRP. The ZR1 isn’t discounted at all (99.5%-100%). For comparison a Silverado 1500 sells for ~83% of MSRP.

One other data point - the trend since model
Year launch of the C7 in 2014:
2014 99%
2015 98%
2016 97%
2017 96%
2018 93%
2019 91%
(The base model 1LT dropped off a bit quicker selling at 95% of MSRP for model year 2016. Today it sells for $54k with an avg MSRP of $60k.

Might have some Supra data in a few weeks, would skewed by a small sample size though.
Excellent stuff. I would definitely be curious about stats like these for other cars as well. It would’ve been useful to know when I bought mine last year. I did all of my research and paid $500 below invoice. Although I felt good about it, Perhaps I could’ve done better by knowing!

Too often we see people post stuff on the internet that is questionable, getting ridiculous discounts and such. It’s good to have some substance behind and beyond people proclaiming “I pAId 10k bElOw MsRP” on some random internet blog and having zero specifics behind it.
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