Supra Manual : "A future classic " ????

[vlad]

Exactly! That’s my point, the manual was popular because it was faster than automatic transmissions, more dependable and engaging, not anymore technology has won and times have changed and the crowd that will be the say 5-10 year owners didn’t grow up with manuals everywhere nor drive them all their lives like many of us. It’s going to be a completely different situation from those buyers life experience from their upbringing.

I think this is the part a lot of people are forgetting. The people buying these used in 10 years didn’t grow up with the shitty 90s automatics.

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[razorlab]

Well I guess if you are going to leave out China which is around 50/50 and India which is around 80/20 in manuals favour and all of South east Asia all three regions which represent around 45% of the worlds population then I guess you're probably right.
Phil

Those numbers are incorrect. China is approx 80% automatic. Japan is 95%.

Also population does not mean car ownership. In India, car ownership is right around only 7% of the population. China is right around 20% of the population owning cars.

USA? 91% of the population owns a car.

India population: 1.4 billion
7% of 1.4 billion = 98 million

USA population: 335 million
91% of 335 million = 304 million

304 > 98

 

[lucky phil]

Those numbers are incorrect. China is approx 80% automatic. Japan is 95%.

Also population does not mean car ownership. In India, car ownership is right around only 7% of the population. China is right around 20% of the population owning cars.

USA? 91% of the population owns a car.

India population: 1.4 billion
7% of 1.4 billion = 98 million

USA population: 335 million
91% of 335 million = 304 million

304 > 98

Knew I could count on you to do the leg work for me You are the" Google Master"

 

[razorlab]

Knew I could count on you to do the leg work for me You are the" Google Master"

Any time I get a chance to show that you actually know very little and do very little to know more.

 

[lucky phil]

Any time I get a chance to show that you actually know very little and do very little to know more.

I don't need to spend any time researching stuff to add to my knowledge base, I've got you buddy and I appreciate your efforts.
Phil

 

[BMWAF]

I think this is the part a lot of people are forgetting. The people buying these used in 10 years didn’t grow up with the shitty 90s automatics.

I don't think that will matter much. Even today when the Supra comes in a non-shitty automatic transmission, 50% continue to choose the manual. This has nothing to do with how good (or bad) the automatic transmission is.. It's a bit like the resurgence of vinyl records has nothing to do with how poor quality the first CD pressings were.

Regardless, buying a car to stuff it away and think about future dollar values is stupid and not the point, but I also don't think the MKV will really land in a bad spot value wise some day long in the future

Exactly. And I agree, the MKV is a good car now so will hold value well enough, I just don't think it has that x factor that will elevate it past that.

full 9 yards of a driving test that took 35 minutes.

Worth mentioning is that the full 9 yards has gotten a lot shorter over the years! My son took the manual test a few years ago and he was allowed to use all the bullshit driving aids like reverse cameras, brake hill-hold, etc. And he didn't even have to do a handbrake start!

 

[BMWAF]

Google? Pfft. According to our AI overlord:

Approximately 30–35% of drivers worldwide currently drive manual transmission vehicles.

 

[Tacoma714]

Don't apologize for being proud! That is awesome Mark! So cool seeing a teenager enthusiastic about manuals in this day and age, especially a female teenager! As a male, I always found it so attractive when a woman would come into my life and she knew how to drive a manual with confidence and capability! Good for you for sharing your passion with your kiddo! Also, that S2K is sweet!

My daughter did the same. Wanted a manual. She had been around the track with me, her ma & racing buddies. First car we helped her out. She paid for ½ and we paid ½. She chose a shitty Fiat 500 turbo. Decent speed and she was happy. Until it started falling apart. I hear most Fiats do. Anyway, she went and traded it for a manual Ford Fiesta and kept that one ever since. Loves it! Especially because it was her choice, not mine, and she’s paying for it (and it’s almost paid off).
*(sorry for the proud papa moment, who doesn’t love their kids and reminiscing)*

Damn they grow up fast! However, still driving a manual ?

No need to apologize. I’m just gonna say something real quick as a father of 7 and 5 year old boys who finally realized this now rather than 10 years later when it’s too late. We are our kid’s first role models and likely who they will grow up to be like and/or look for in a partner to date or marry. When our time is up (looking at everyone in this forum in their 20’s and 30’s who won’t understand the concept of time until you turn 40), all we will have is our legacy and what we handed down. This is what car culture and manual transmission is about. It may be a niche thing in the future, but it will carry mem

There was a time when automatics sucked and people would prefer manuals for performance, but performance is not the only factor. I think it's always been true that many drivers prefer a manual for the engagement. I have yet to find any automatic or DCT that can recreate that magical part of the experience. The C8 has a great DCT but that car is dead to me since it doesn't offer a manual. May as well play a video game.

A collector is normally going to look for the rarer and more limited versions of a car, and they want one in original condition or as close as possible. I think both the automatic and manual Supras have future collector potential if they are not modded, but the rare/limited factor may depend on what happens in the next generation or even if there is a next generation. There are many enthusiasts and collectors on a "deathwatch" for manual sports cars, and the last generation of them is going to be a hot ticket going forward. Everybody knows the future is trending towards hybrids and electrification, which doesn't bode well for the MT.

I rewatched Doug's "classics" video and the other videos he did on the Supra over the years. It's clear he thought the car needed an MT from the very beginning and was happy when it showed up. In Doug's mind the automatic Supra just wasn't fully baked and thus has limited appeal into the future. Just like he mentioned for the M2/M3/M4 at the beginning of the classics video, he is of the opinion that we're on the cusp of losing great manual transmission sport cars. Put it all together, and naturally he'd name the MT Supra as a future classic . In my mind, the MT Supra and M2/M3/M4 are all in the same boat. Appreciate them while you can.

Exactly. People don’t realize we are on borrowed time with engaging sports cars. They don’t sell like SUV’s and sedans.

 

[vlad]

Worth mentioning is that the full 9 yards has gotten a lot shorter over the years! My son took the manual test a few years ago and he was allowed to use all the bullshit driving aids like reverse cameras, brake hill-hold, etc. And he didn't even have to do a handbrake start!

You’re old enough to have a kid that drives? I wonder how ages compare of manual vs auto Supra buyers.

 

[BMWAF]

You’re old enough to have a kid that drives? I wonder how ages compare of manual vs auto Supra buyers.

Hahaha.. yes, I may act like a child but I'm ancient.

 

[lucky phil]

I don't think that will matter much. Even today when the Supra comes in a non-shitty automatic transmission, 50% continue to choose the manual. This has nothing to do with how good (or bad) the automatic transmission is.. It's a bit like the resurgence of vinyl records has nothing to do with how poor quality the first CD pressings were.



Exactly. And I agree, the MKV is a good car now so will hold value well enough, I just don't think it has that x factor that will elevate it past that.



Worth mentioning is that the full 9 yards has gotten a lot shorter over the years! My son took the manual test a few years ago and he was allowed to use all the bullshit driving aids like reverse cameras, brake hill-hold, etc. And he didn't even have to do a handbrake start!

I'll give my daughter credit, no reverse camera or hill start assist in her new to her car. I came up with a good technique for teaching people how to use a clutch. I explained ad nauseum about the relationship between pedal travel and the actual slip/grip point to not much avail. People have a problem it seems initially understanding that when the clutch starts to bite from that point on it's mere millimetres or even less to full engagement under normal driving. They see/feel all that pedal travel and assume you need to let the clutch move the final 2 inches to fully engage from the first point of friction.
So with my daughter in the Pax seat on a hill I started to engage the clutch and got her to watch the pedal movement and when it started to bite which she could see by the nose of the car rising slightly and the engine sound I got her to put her hand on my clutch knee and actually feel how much the pedal moved in relationship to the clutch fully engaging which she could see and observe. After that it was all plain sailing and she had the clutch pedal to engagement clear in her mind and her technique and hill starts under control quickly.
Phil

 

[razorlab]

What you all should really be doing is teaching your kids about engine oil so we don't continue to have 5,000 threads a week about oil.

 

[NicKnack]

What you all should really be doing is teaching your kids about engine oil so we don't continue to have 5,000 threads a week about oil.

"Okay son so what do we do if we hear a knocking noise that increases with RPM"

"Fill it with 20W60 and put it on marketplace?"

"That's my boy."

 

[lucky phil]

"Okay son so what do we do if we hear a knocking noise that increases with RPM"

"Fill it with 20W60 and put it on marketplace?"

"That's my boy."

What we really need is a Corvette oil thread on here
Phil

 

[razorlab]

What we really need is a Corvette oil thread on here
Phil

Don't inspire them. Hahah.

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