SUPRA ULTIMATE B58 JB4 GUIDE AND LOG REVIEW (V1)

[ColonelAdama]

More of a general question but I saw a previous post where you said to watch the torque value. What does that value represent? I don’t think it was mentioned at the beginning of this thread.

it was really just for MT cars. Its just the calculated torque, I don't know the scaling, I just know 50 is the maximum and car will close throttle if exceeded.

On an MT you can mostly avoid the throttle closures staying under ~48

AT can hit 49-50 usually fine.

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[Arnabio]

How about my 2023 A91MT at 9000 feet altitude.
This is the first try for sending logs. Only 91 really available up here. Any help is much appreciated.

intake only. MAP 0

https://datazap.me/u/arnabio/log-17...67&mark=830-843-1006-852-984-1026-963-871-855

 

[Bug2th]

huh. Interesting. Thanks. I have an AT but for mt do you normally look at/adjust ff/duty bias if you see that happen??

it was really just for MT cars. Its just the calculated torque, I don't know the scaling, I just know 50 is the maximum and car will close throttle if exceeded.

On an MT you can mostly avoid the throttle closures staying under ~48

AT can hit 49-50 usually fine.

 

[JTIGNOR]

not bad, try FF at 25 next and see if it can clean up timing a bit

There was some typos in my initial post I went back and corrected. FF was actually 30 and I missed my BMS BOV.

Here is Map1 FF=25
https://datazap.me/u/jtignor/map1-ff25-0?log=0&data=1-11-14-18-25-26-27-28-29&zoom=9-261

 

[ColonelAdama]

huh. Interesting. Thanks. I have an AT but for mt do you normally look at/adjust ff/duty bias if you see that happen??

I don't really look at calc_tq on AT cars moreso just try to keep ecu_psi about 1 psi under dme_bt and minimal if any throttle closure

 

[ColonelAdama]

There was some typos in my initial post I went back and corrected. FF was actually 30 and I missed my BMS BOV.

Here is Map1 FF=25
https://datazap.me/u/jtignor/map1-ff25-0?log=0&data=1-11-14-18-25-26-27-28-29&zoom=9-261

a little better, thats probably the best you'll get on that fuel. Maybe try a different station next time ands see if timing cleans up more

 

[ColonelAdama]

How about my 2023 A91MT at 9000 feet altitude.
This is the first try for sending logs. Only 91 really available up here. Any help is much appreciated.

intake only. MAP 0

https://datazap.me/u/arnabio/log-17...67&mark=830-843-1006-852-984-1026-963-871-855

if you are stock DP try FF 30 on Map 1, need a full pull 2500-6500 3rd gear

 

[Cornfed5.3]

I added some ethanol, Fuel-It reads 50% now. I made a few adjustments after this log. Dropped WGDC in the lower rpm, dropped the FF from 35 to 30, increased FOL from 60 to 70, PID from 20 to 18. Is throttle closure related to calc_torque being 50 or is the HPFP low and offsetting with throttle? I did lower the max additive 1psi in case the HPFP was near its limit. Ideally I’m thinking of a target around 23psi with as much ethanol as it’ll take (up to 50%e) and then add boostane to see if timing increases with additional octane. Stock Dp currently, but have a Kenji “race” on the way.

https://datazap.me/u/cornfed53/log-...27-28-29&solo=2-4-10-13-15-20-34&zoom=102-171

 

[ColonelAdama]

I added some ethanol, Fuel-It reads 50% now. I made a few adjustments after this log. Dropped WGDC in the lower rpm, dropped the FF from 35 to 30, increased FOL from 60 to 70, PID from 20 to 18. Is throttle closure related to calc_torque being 50 or is the HPFP low and offsetting with throttle? I did lower the max additive 1psi in case the HPFP was near its limit. Ideally I’m thinking of a target around 23psi with as much ethanol as it’ll take (up to 50%e) and then add boostane to see if timing increases with additional octane. Stock Dp currently, but have a Kenji “race” on the way.

https://datazap.me/u/cornfed53/log-...27-28-29&solo=2-4-10-13-15-20-34&zoom=102-171

you just need to drop duty4000 by 5 or so till the throttle clears up. yeah try to keep calc_tq under 49.

The car seems to take E50 fine but thats because boost is low. Ideal blend is more like E40 so you can run more boost, and timing should be fine.

 

[Cornfed5.3]

you just need to drop duty4000 by 5 or so till the throttle clears up. yeah try to keep calc_tq under 49.

The car seems to take E50 fine but thats because boost is low. Ideal blend is more like E40 so you can run more boost, and timing should be fine.

What is considered a good boost target for E40? Have you ever seen timing increase on e40 where octane was increased through boostane or methanol? I think I read 16* was as much as it would add without spoofing. I don’t think I’ll be but a couple degrees off that with the boost <20psi. I’m kinda taking it as 16*, 23psi, and e40+ are solid numbers to shoot for.

I saw where FOL could be increased to 100 (by spoofing the fuel pressure sensor). Is this similar to an aftermarket standalone port injection, per se, that increasing FOL would work better if the injectors were large enough by running a lower base fuel pressure and flowing more? ie, on my 85mm turbo 5.3 I run 35psi base fuel, but have Bosch 210’s that flow a lot.
Thanks for answering all of our questions!

 

[ColonelAdama]

What is considered a good boost target for E40? Have you ever seen timing increase on e40 where octane was increased through boostane or methanol? I think I read 16* was as much as it would add without spoofing. I don’t think I’ll be but a couple degrees off that with the boost <20psi. I’m kinda taking it as 16*, 23psi, and e40+ are solid numbers to shoot for.

I saw where FOL could be increased to 100 (by spoofing the fuel pressure sensor). Is this similar to an aftermarket standalone port injection, per se, that increasing FOL would work better if the injectors were large enough by running a lower base fuel pressure and flowing more? ie, on my 85mm turbo 5.3 I run 35psi base fuel, but have Bosch 210’s that flow a lot.
Thanks for answering all of our questions!

Typically E40 you can run an additive 6 psi but with a taper up to 5k. I am around +6.3 psi on my car, it is about 20-21 psi but depends on IATs. Not really far off from an MHD map, but will never be as potent due to running leaner. (jb4 cant control AFR... yet)

FOL >70 starts to make the car behave strangely, VANOS faults, weird boost targets, limp mode, etc. You can't lower fuel pressure with JB4, only raise it.

My car for reference at FOL 65 at E35ish, Trims between 35-40 usually and quite flat. should be around 460-470whp.
https://datazap.me/u/coloneladama/log-1755810285?log=0&data=1-2-3-4-11-14-25-26-27-28&zoom=138-327

 

[razorlab]

Typically E40 you can run an additive 6 psi but with a taper up to 5k. I am around +6.3 psi on my car, it is about 20-21 psi but depends on IATs. Not really far off from an MHD map, but will never be as potent due to running leaner. (jb4 cant control AFR... yet)

FOL >70 starts to make the car behave strangely, VANOS faults, weird boost targets, limp mode, etc. You can't lower fuel pressure with JB4, only raise it.

My car for reference at FOL 65 at E35ish, Trims between 35-40 usually and quite flat. should be around 460-470whp.
https://datazap.me/u/coloneladama/log-1755810285?log=0&data=1-2-3-4-11-14-25-26-27-28&zoom=138-327

Yea, you won't be anywhere close to maxing out the oem HPFP on the stock turbo in the high mid and high rpm range. It's the low and low midrange you need to keep the boost down.

Even on something like a Pure800 you can run a bunch of boost through the top end on oem HPFP and ethanol. 28psi or so out the top you will max the oem injectors, depending on ethanol level.

For reference, here is a Pure800 with E33, stock fuel system.

Even at almost 27psi there is room. HPFP angle and Injector IDC have a good amount of room still. You can see the HPFP angle isn't even above 90 here (max of 126) on a Pure 800 with basically 27 psi. So stock turbo ain't going to be an issue.

 

[Jofro6]

Hey guys... Finished tuning my JB4 map with Jesse on 93. Tons of fun for this summer so I can enjoy the car at different stages

Next step is an E blend, but no point in doing that now since I can't drive the car through winter in the northeast.

I do like to have supporting mods and was looking to do either the Fuel It or Visconti Flex fuel kit over the winter. I know neither is necessary to run an E blend, but what's your guys thoughts on one over the other?

At some point I will upgrade the turbo, and keep stock location. Would one be usable now and still good to run with an upgraded turbo (with or without sending to Femto)?

Appreciate how helpful you guys are in this thread without the bashing of all us looking to learn.

 

[Jofro6]

https://burgertuning.com/products/t...9&_sid=aa1d396d7&_ss=r&variant=46083875733678
You can run this fuelit kit with Bluetooth straight from bms and you can upgrade to this https://burgertuning.com/products/s...sure_upgrade_kit?_pos=36&_sid=aa1d396d7&_ss=r. Cheap hp. I would save money for a manifold next then upgraded turbo.

Thanks. I actually have the FP upgrade already on the JB4.

And I know there are addtl mods to go with an upgraded turbo. Just trying to not double buy things if I can just buy one flex fuel kit that will work now as well as in the future so I dont have to just trust my own math and measurements to know the E blend.

 

[JTIGNOR]

a little better, thats probably the best you'll get on that fuel. Maybe try a different station next time ands see if timing cleans up more

My dumbass saw that BMS MT Supra video and set my FOL to 0, lord help me. Here is 2 more runs at FF=25 and FOL=50. I think the timing, AFR, and Trims look better.

https://datazap.me/u/jtignor/map1-ff25-1?log=0&data=1-8-9-11-25-26-27-28-29

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