Toyota "Preparing" Hotter Supra GRMN, Says Chief Engineer

justbake

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Just thought the same thing :rofl:

Although is the LC500 sold as a Toyota anywhere like the NSX is a Honda? I'm not sure.
I think it is a Honda in Japan and the LC500 is still a Lexus. I just don't think halo car means auto only or that manual means performance. I am just theorizing a potential 7MT as an option to go head-to-head with the Cayman GT4.
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Dannyvandelft

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I think it is a Honda in Japan and the LC500 is still a Lexus. I just don't think halo car means auto only or that manual means performance. I am just theorizing a potential 7MT as an option to go head-to-head with the Cayman GT4.
Yeah who knows what their reasons are lol. I don't mind the Supra being an auto. I understand why others would though. I just want to see what wing the GRMN gets.
 

justbake

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Yeah who knows what their reasons are lol. I don't mind the Supra being an auto. I understand why others would though. I just want to see what wing the GRMN gets.
I don't mind it either, I will still probably get an auto unless there is a manual only model (like the Cayman GT4) that has some sort of inherit performance or styling advantage over the other models.
 

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Lexus halo car is still the LFA. LC500 is not the pinnacle. Wait for the LC-F ;)

GR Supra 3.0L is already comparable or better than the Cayman GTS for the price point. Probably the reason why Porsche made the Cayman GT4. And still needed to up the game with the soon to be Cayman GT4 RS. :rolleyes: Porsche knows they have been the targeted benchmark for the GR Supra. Toyota is very vocal and public about it.
 
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justbake

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Lexus halo car is still the LFA. LC500 is not the pinnacle. Wait for the LC-F ;)

GR Supra 3.0L is already comparable or better than the Cayman GTS for the price point. Probably the reason why Porsche made the Cayman GT4. And still needed to up the game with the soon to be Cayman GT4 RS. :rolleyes: Porsche knows they have been the targeted benchmark for the GR Supra. Toyota is very vocal and public about it.
Just because it isnā€™t the pinnacle doesnā€™t mean it isnā€™t a halo car.

Porsche made the GT4 before the Supra. An argument could be made they made the GTS 4.0 in response to the Supra though.
 

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i don't believe in the slightest porsche has any fear for the supra , porsche has been making exellent sport cars for years without stopping a second. The reason why the supra mk4 is a legend is in my opinion that they continued to make the supra for years and refining it. Then they stopped and then all others that still chose to not abandon their sports cars have made leaps in this segment.

Objectively the only japanese brand that threatened porsche in the moden era seriously was nissan with the gtr. When it came the gtr was half the price with twice the performance of a 911. For me this is commitment . The supra while not a bad car by any means has not done anything close to rock the sport car stage.

The 86 grmn was double the price with 10 more hp and weight savings, if they think that is a good formula for grmn cars then this will make porsche for sure to respond but not with a car but with a laugh.
 

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i don't believe in the slightest porsche has any fear for the supra , porsche has been making exellent sport cars for years without stopping a second. The reason why the supra mk4 is a legend is in my opinion that they continued to make the supra for years and refining it. Then they stopped and then all others that still chose to not abandon their sports cars have made leaps in this segment.

Objectively the only japanese brand that threatened porsche in the moden era seriously was nissan with the gtr. When it came the gtr was half the price with twice the performance of a 911. For me this is commitment . The supra while not a bad car by any means has not done anything close to rock the sport car stage.

The 86 grmn was double the price with 10 more hp and weight savings, if they think that is a good formula for grmn cars then this will make porsche for sure to respond but not with a car but with a laugh.
If you mean Supra ā€œhas not done anything close to rock the sports car stageā€ with performance numbers, probably Iā€™d agree with you. But by allowing alot of old and new car enthusiasts to enjoy, drive and own a pure sports car, for less the money and with better value, then it probably has made a big impact in this segment! GTR dubbed ā€œsupercar killerā€ has a better value vs a 911, yes, but still out of economic range of most people.

No argument here, Porsche is a sports car company. No one can probably topple them in this segment thatā€™s why they are the benchmark. When people say that you are a benchmark, itā€™s actually a complement. People look up to you, to reach your level at par or better. Kudos to Porsche! Toyota, on the other hand, is a mobility company and a point A-B car manufacturer where they are the worlds car global leader. To me, Toyota venturing again to sports car segment is not really to challenge sports car manufacturers on a poorly profitable area but itā€™s a more of a large marketing strategy in injecting excitement back to the brand, thus the 86 (AE86), GR Supra (A80 Supra) and GR Yaris (Celica GT4). They may not get huge ROI out this but still decided to do so.

Toyota is bringing fun and excitement closer to normal and ordinary people by bringing back their exciting cars of yesteryears. They may have abandoned the sports car stage before, but they are coming back with the Gazoo Racing brand, and for me it is a huge committment nowadays. They are even promoting and competing at the top of motorsports and also winning (WEC, LeMans, WRC) just to show to us what they can achieve.

I am just grateful, optimistic and just excited of the new GR Supra. Although I do respect what others may think otherwise. Cheers!
 

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I truly wish that they see the sports car making as a marketing strategy because it is actually , but the bizzare thing is they also expect them for some reason to be profitable even though they didn't make a sports car for a decade just because of their past success. The problem is that they simply do not go all out on their sports cars, the only toyota in my opinion that is a true bargain and a killer car is the gr yaris, this car is insane and my prediction is that its used market price is going to be higher. The yaris was developed without a ceiling in what technology it has, the engine is fantastic at least on paper , the awd system too, they went all out and i respect that .
Now for the supra , they can't go all out. Bmw has many other performance cars , all their serious performance cars have m engines , it is no secret. The 86 is a similar story, subaru has the wrx as their performance car.

They took the less risky approach on both their sports cars , have them jointly built and mostly without their own tech. Nothing wrong with that to be clear , bmw makes great cars but if they are serious about compting with porsche , this is simply not enough. I hope they take some risks.
 

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i don't believe in the slightest porsche has any fear for the supra , porsche has been making exellent sport cars for years without stopping a second. The reason why the supra mk4 is a legend is in my opinion that they continued to make the supra for years and refining it. Then they stopped and then all others that still chose to not abandon their sports cars have made leaps in this segment.

Objectively the only japanese brand that threatened porsche in the moden era seriously was nissan with the gtr. When it came the gtr was half the price with twice the performance of a 911. For me this is commitment . The supra while not a bad car by any means has not done anything close to rock the sport car stage.

The 86 grmn was double the price with 10 more hp and weight savings, if they think that is a good formula for grmn cars then this will make porsche for sure to respond but not with a car but with a laugh.
I'd kinda disagree, before the Supra came out, all we had for the Cayman was the 4cyl. Now that we have the Supra, there's a flat 6 on the Cayman again
 

tfoxyr

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I'd kinda disagree, before the Supra came out, all we had for the Cayman was the 4cyl. Now that we have the Supra, there's a flat 6 on the Cayman again
People that buy porsches were used to other kind of engines , so a lot of people that are actual porsche customers complained about the 4 cyl and then porsche answered with an engine they wanted. It's simple really , they just listened to their customers and that is the biggest reason porsche can sell at a premium. No conspiracy theories about rivals there seriously.

The supra had nothing to do with it, the only other car that porsche may have considered a serious cayman rival is the alpine 110s and that is just speculation on my part. Personally i am not a fan of the cayman or the alpine , i find the supra to be better suited to my tastes because i am fan of FR cars in general.

Anyway even though toyota does a good job of finding what the average car buyer wants and needs , they fail to connect with their sports car fans.
For the supra they said they partnered with bmw for the inline 6 because that was what people wanted... what? then why is there a 4 cylinder aswell and no manual? for the 86 literally everybody cried for a turbo version , no delivery , just better brakes and fatter tyres (the better tyres was a good idea actually).
 

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They're definitely not putting a manual in the car that's supposed to be faster. Better chance would be to get a manual in the regular 3.0 before the GRMN gets it. If ever. Simple truth is performance numbers sells more cars than manuals do. That's why the C8 Corvette doesn't even get one. And if I'm not mistaken, neither does the newest Cayman GT4. It's just outdated tech. Sure there's people complaining that want a manual, but they're vastly outnumbered by people who don't care, or who would buy the auto/DCT version of a car because of the better performance.
Look at the GT-R. It's 11 years old, never had a manual.
Other GRMN cars have set the precedence for manual transmissions. No guarantee of course, but also, so far the GRMN brand has been about ultimate enjoyment, rather than ultimate performance numbers. :dunno:

What I'd really like to see is both a GT4 street trim (top of the numbers game) and a GRMN (limited and manual)... but that's in my ideal world.
 

tfoxyr

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Other GRMN cars have set the precedence for manual transmissions. No guarantee of course, but also, so far the GRMN brand has been about ultimate enjoyment, rather than ultimate performance numbers. :dunno:

What I'd really like to see is both a GT4 street trim (top of the numbers game) and a GRMN (limited and manual)... but that's in my ideal world.
Hopefully they will offer a manual on the base models and not only on the grmn, because the high end supra models will be very expensive for sure. Personally if i had the money for a 90k car at the moment i would want a lightweight dct and close to 450-500ps.
 

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https://citizen.co.za/motoring/moto...e-to-receive-hardcore-grmn-moniker-next-year/

GRMN will be significantly lighter than the ā€˜regularā€™ GR Supra.

With a number of markets having been privy to a more powerful version of the Toyota Supra, a new report from Australia has alleged that the forthcoming GRMN model will breach the 300 kW mark when it becomes a reality.

Last year, Supra project Chief Engineer Tetsuya Tada hinted to Autoblog that an uprated Supra could appear with more than the provided 250kW/500Nm, with the publication going so far as to predict the mentioned increase amounting to 37 kW.

As it stands, the amount of twist from the 3.0-litre B58 turbocharged straight-six engine shared with the BMW Z4 eventually came to 285 kW with torque remaining unchanged. According to carsguide.com.au however, citing a report from Japan, this will swell to 309 kW with the debut of the GRMN.

On course to receive a number of extensive exterior revisions, which will more than likely extend to the interior, the online publication also states that the GRMN will be significantly lighter than the ā€˜regularā€™ GR Supra, before going so far as to allege the availability of a manual gearbox.

Based on the report, the GRMN could make its unveiling as early as the first half of next year. Donā€™t be surprised however if more details or possibly even spy images emerge before then.
 

justbake

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Has ZF stopped producing 6MT transmissions? I looked on their site and only see 7MT transmissions. Also, the 7MT shares architecture with the 7DCT.

GRMN with the option for 7DCT or 7MT perhaps?

https://www.zf.com/products/en/cars/productfinder/driveline.html?filterLang=en
You raise some interesting questions good sir. I wonder if this is why the Cayman GT4 suffers from poor gearing with the 6mt and is preparing for a 7mt model as well (with the GT4RS receiving a PDK.) This would set the scene for Toyota to undercut Porsche.

I know this is farfetched but what gearbox will the new M3 be using since it has been confirmed to have a manual option?
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