Toyota "Preparing" Hotter Supra GRMN, Says Chief Engineer

justbake

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https://citizen.co.za/motoring/moto...e-to-receive-hardcore-grmn-moniker-next-year/

As it stands, the amount of twist from the 3.0-litre B58 turbocharged straight-six engine shared with the BMW Z4 eventually came to 285 kW with torque remaining unchanged. According to carsguide.com.au however, citing a report from Japan, this will swell to 309 kW with the debut of the GRMN.
Conspiracy theory: this is referring to the V35a which is rated at ~309-310 kw depending on source.




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justbake

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Is there any validity behind the IS refresh having the B58 in the non-F version and the V35a/2UR as the top model?

https://leftlanenews.com/lexus/1517612231550740977/

If so, I don’t see how the IS can have both B58 and a Toyota engine but the Supra can not. It would make more sense for the GRMN Supra to have the V35a than the B58 considering Toyota is launching a performance sub brand with this car to rival M, AMG, and RS. GRMN would immediately be DOA if they launched the brand with another rival company’s mid tier engine Toyota tuned or not.

V35a with a dry sump and a transaxle would be incredible for performance without stepping on the toes of the upcoming M4 and M2 as well as the LC and RC since there will be a clear differentiated between them. Also, this would more effectively make the car a mid engined Cayman GT4 or future GT4RS competitor on the track with the low CoG and better weight distribution of a dry sump V6 and transmission in the rear.

Maybe the headlight housings with 2 rows of 3 lights are a tribute to the first V6 Supra where as the FT1 had just 3 lights per housing. And maybe they do plan on using the fake vents on the door and rear bumper for inlets and outlets for the transaxle.
 
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splv

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Is there any validity behind the IS refresh having the B58 in the non-F version and the V35a/2UR as the top model?
No BMW engines planned for the IS refresh. Will continue with current engine offerings with a possible IS500 using the 2UR-GSE. Unfortunately, this does not appear to be an F model so unlikely to be a track-focused trim.

Maybe the headlight housings with 2 rows of 3 lights are a tribute to the first V6 Supra where as the FT1 had just 3 lights per housing. And maybe they do plan on using the fake vents on the door and rear bumper for inlets and outlets for the transaxle.
Bro, you have some crazy fantasy ideas. Please continue to take all your prescribed medications.
 

justbake

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No BMW engines planned for the IS refresh. Will continue with current engine offerings with a possible IS500 using the 2UR-GSE. Unfortunately, this does not appear to be an F model so unlikely to be a track-focused trim.



Bro, you have some crazy fantasy ideas. Please continue to take all your prescribed medications.
Bored in the house and I'm in the house bored.

You say that like it is crazy, but there has to be some tricks up Toyota's sleeve to compete with a the midengine GT4 with GT3 suspension as a FR inline 6.

Nevertheless, I have been here for 2 years and still havent seen anything that says the Supra won't have the V35a,
 
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Bryster

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Bored in the house and I'm in the house bored.

You say that like it is crazy, but there has to be some tricks up Toyota's sleeve to compete with a the midengine GT4 with GT3 suspension as a FR inline 6.

Nevertheless, I have been here for 2 years and still havent seen anything that says the Supra won't have the V35a,
I
sounds like a headache recalibrating the computers for the sake of the V35a
 

splv

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Bored in the house and I'm in the house bored.

You say that like it is crazy, but there has to be some tricks up Toyota's sleeve to compete with a the midengine GT4 with GT3 suspension as a FR inline 6.

Nevertheless, I have been here for 2 years and still havent seen anything that says the Supra won't have the V35a,
I’m being dead serious, you need to come back down to Earth with your expectations. Toyota has nothing up their sleeves. Toyota has no answer for what Porsche is doing. The Supra, although made to compete with the Cayman, will never be the Cayman-killer fanboys wished for. Toyota and Porsche have two completely different business models. It is as simple as that. We all fantasize, but don’t be silly to think that everything you dream up is coming to reality. That is just not how life works. Not sure how old you are, but most people learn this at a very early age...like when you find out Santa isn’t real.

The V35a is not coming to the Supra. Inline 6 is what they wanted. Otherwise, they would not have partnered with BMW.
 

justbake

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sounds like a headache recalibrating the computers for the sake of the V35a
Toyota did it with the RAV4, Avensis, and Verso and the N47 so I don’t see why they can’t do it here.
 

justbake

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I’m being dead serious, you need to come back down to Earth with your expectations. Toyota has nothing up their sleeves. Toyota has no answer for what Porsche is doing. The Supra, although made to compete with the Cayman, will never be the Cayman-killer fanboys wished for. Toyota and Porsche have two completely different business models. It is as simple as that. We all fantasize, but don’t be silly to think that everything you dream up is coming to reality. That is just not how life works. Not sure how old you are, but most people learn this at a very early age...like when you find out Santa isn’t real.

The V35a is not coming to the Supra. Inline 6 is what they wanted. Otherwise, they would not have partnered with BMW.
Get off your high horse, I’m posting theories since this thread has been dead. I have no expectations, no need to be an actual prick. I just don’t see how Toyota plans on launching a global performance brand with a motor (B58D) that doesn’t even meet EU regulations. “Masters of the Nurburgring” but they have to have the car towed to the track sounds even more ridiculous than believing in Santa.

I don’t see why a V6 and I6 can’t coexist with one higher than another, a dozen of Mercedes models do the same thing. Not that I expect it to happen or anything, but Toyota got their inline 6 and they never said other engine configurations weren’t a possibility.
 
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RyanGT3RS

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Get off your high horse, I’m posting theories since this thread has been dead. I have no expectations, no need to be an actual prick. I just don’t see how Toyota plans on launching a global performance brand with a motor (B58D) that doesn’t even meet EU regulations. “Masters of the Nurburgring” but they have to have the car towed to the track sounds even more ridiculous than believing in Santa.

I don’t see why a V6 and I6 can’t coexist with one higher than another, a dozen of Mercedes models do the same thing. Not that I expect it to happen or anything, but Toyota got their inline 6 and they never said other engine configurations weren’t a possibility.

I still believe in Santa every year for Christmas
 

justbake

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I still believe in Santa every year for Christmas
Someone has to have some imagination around here.

The current narrative is that Toyota revived their halo car after 20 years and launched a performance sub-brand just to put a performance tune on another company's mid-tier 6 cylinder motor, which doesn't even meet EU regulations. What about the other GR models you ask? One is rumored to be a Subaru motor from an SUV and the other is currently in the Yaris/Corolla. Yeah that's right, GR's sole in house motor is from the Yaris. But that's not so bad right since the GR Yaris has a bespoke chassis? Nope, the US won't be getting it, we will be getting the econobox chassis Corolla instead and it has been detuned.

As much as I want GR/GRMN to succeed, it is sounding like the joke of all performance trims, TRD, but rehashed.

Launching GRMN with the V35a (or whatever the new Dynamic Force engine is between the V35a and TT V8) in the Supra would be a surefire way to legitimize GRMN out of the gate.
 

ayau

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Can’t just slap in V35A engine just like that. That’s not how car manufacturing works. It takes a lot of capital to shift to a different engine only to sell a few thousand cars.
 

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Can’t just slap in V35A engine just like that. That’s not how car manufacturing works. It takes a lot of capital to shift to a different engine only to sell a few thousand cars.

You misread or misinterpreted what I said. I never said switch to a different engine, I said add an additional engine to the lineup which is something CLAR is designed to handle. For example, GR Supra 2.0, GR Supra 3.0, and the additional GRMN Supra 3.5.

If you’re comment was even remotely accurate, then low volume performance variants such as the GS-F and LC-F wouldn’t exist at all.
 

justbake

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Well that's pretty strong evidence.
I should back up and change my statement from "won't have the V35a" to "can't have the V35a."

Although very unlikely, putting the V35a in the GRMN model is the fast track to legitimizing GRMN as a performance sub brand.
 

splv

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Although very unlikely, putting the V35a in the GRMN model is the fast track to legitimizing GRMN as a performance sub brand.
I don't know what your obsession is with the V35A but this isn't the engine to put Toyota on the "performance" map. I would argue that the 2UR-GSE is a better sports engine. Just to keep things really simple for you, please review the rough specs of each engine below. Even as a "mid-tier" BMW engine, the B58D is substantially better than the V35A if viewed from a pure performance perspective.

V35A-FTS
416HP, 443 lb ft
85.5 x 100 mm -- very undersquare
6400 RPM redline
Open-deck with cast iron cylinder liners

B58D
Est. 450HP, 490 lb ft (based on dyno and 15% drivetrain loss, 380RWHP, 420RWTQ)
82 x 94.6 mm -- undersquare
7000 RPM redline
Closed-deck aluminum block
 

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