bogglo
Well-Known Member
8 days to go.....Tik Tok Tik Tok
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Toyota "Preparing" Hotter Supra GRMN, Says Chief Engineer
Rotaryrunner
Well-Known Member
I'm going to post this in every 1000hp thread from now on 
A 1000hp car is slower on a track then a 650hp car. As mister Jeremy Clarkson once said, there is a point when you drive the car slower by increasing the hp.
And to be honest, driving fast in a straight line ( which 1000hp is the only thing good for) isn't driving
A 1000hp car is slower on a track then a 650hp car. As mister Jeremy Clarkson once said, there is a point when you drive the car slower by increasing the hp.
And to be honest, driving fast in a straight line ( which 1000hp is the only thing good for) isn't driving
Nurburgring
Well-Known Member
That Toyota GR webpage is pretty cool. This is their plan for GR:
In the case of the 86 in Japan they offer the full lineup:
- Parts: Spoiler, steering wheel, lightweight forged wheels, etc. These are sold as dealer-equipped options.
- "86 GR SPORT": equipped with those "parts" plus Brembo brakes, so mostly an aesthetic package similar to Audi S-line and some BMW "M" packages. Price: 3,780,000 yen.
- "86 GR": increased rigidity by chasis bracing, Recaro seats, SACHS dampers, Brembo 6-pot brakes, Torsen LSD from the GRMN model. Price: 4,968,000 yen.
- "86 GRMN": Limited run of 100 units in 2016. Japan only. 100lbs lighter by carbon hood and trunk, polycarbonate windows. 20 more hp. Various aero parts. Brakes, suspension, LSD similar to 86 GR. Built at Motomachi factory.
Pricing:
Base 86: 2,800,000 yen
86 GR Sport: 3,780,000 yen (+35%)
86 GR: 4,968,000 yen (+77%)
86 GRMN: 6,480,000 yen (+231%!!)
May shed some light on future Supra models and their pricing.
Death666wish_
Well-Known Member
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Tada already said they had a 700hp Supra running around.
AHP
Well-Known Member
I
And to be honest, driving fast in a straight line ( which 1000hp is the only thing good for) isn't driving
I've found that generally the only people that have that opinion are the ones who've never actually done it.
Ignorance is not always bliss..
93Siro
Active Member
Rods and pistons don't make 1000hp. lol
You guys make it sound like BMW use some crappy material and Toyota's piston create additional kinetic energy.
The reason we haven't seen 1000hp I6 new BMW's are not internal strength. It's a combination of air flow and tuning. We are still using OEM DME's, not many ditch their DME's for standalones like you guys are used to. At first there wasn't even a single DI standalone option. Now there is, but few do that because of cost and how we have come with OEM DME's. But still, it's not like a Haltech. Lots of troubleshooting, loads of bugs and still lots of tables to be found. As long as Supra uses the same DME as BMW, i can guarantee that tuning will be much more difficult than you might think. Tada involved or not, i know BMW and i know Bosch. Those companies don't like people accessing their codes, period. I know the tuners and i know what they face.
The other reason is air flow. Heads haven't touched much yet. Factory head sucks (at least the case for N54) and the factory cam is pretty weak. Aggressive cams just came into use. The main reason is with the new BMW's power is cheap, most do just FBO or turbo upgrade and are happy with 500, 600, 700, 800 whp they have. The other reason is also tuning. Tuning for aggressive cams with factory DME and all the Vanos and Valvetronic (in the case of B58) is somehow regarded as a dark art mastered only by a handful. Big turbos are still relatively small compared to what 2JZ guys use. Most settle with a Precision 6466, and 68xx is the biggest i've seen used. Part of that is because we don't rev over the factory redline again because of factory valvetrain, partly because of again, tuning...
It's a big cluster fuck lol Thinking you can make 1000 hp any time soon with a MKV is pipe dream IMHO.
You guys make it sound like BMW use some crappy material and Toyota's piston create additional kinetic energy.
The reason we haven't seen 1000hp I6 new BMW's are not internal strength. It's a combination of air flow and tuning. We are still using OEM DME's, not many ditch their DME's for standalones like you guys are used to. At first there wasn't even a single DI standalone option. Now there is, but few do that because of cost and how we have come with OEM DME's. But still, it's not like a Haltech. Lots of troubleshooting, loads of bugs and still lots of tables to be found. As long as Supra uses the same DME as BMW, i can guarantee that tuning will be much more difficult than you might think. Tada involved or not, i know BMW and i know Bosch. Those companies don't like people accessing their codes, period. I know the tuners and i know what they face.
The other reason is air flow. Heads haven't touched much yet. Factory head sucks (at least the case for N54) and the factory cam is pretty weak. Aggressive cams just came into use. The main reason is with the new BMW's power is cheap, most do just FBO or turbo upgrade and are happy with 500, 600, 700, 800 whp they have. The other reason is also tuning. Tuning for aggressive cams with factory DME and all the Vanos and Valvetronic (in the case of B58) is somehow regarded as a dark art mastered only by a handful. Big turbos are still relatively small compared to what 2JZ guys use. Most settle with a Precision 6466, and 68xx is the biggest i've seen used. Part of that is because we don't rev over the factory redline again because of factory valvetrain, partly because of again, tuning...
It's a big cluster fuck lol Thinking you can make 1000 hp any time soon with a MKV is pipe dream IMHO.
PerformanceSound
Well-Known Member
So the bare MKV chassisā I was told about earlier going to Japan might actually be true???
. Wow....So far, nothing I have heard from my source has been false.
AHP
Well-Known Member
There's a lot of caveats to that statement. Yes, 1000WHP has been done on the dyno multiple times over the years; however, you never see these cars doing big pulls, let alone 1/4 or 1/2 mile runs at that power level. A healthy stock bottom end with a lazy turbo (less peak TQ) will almost always live on the dyno for hero pulls, but it absolutely would not survive say a 1/2 mile run at that level. The ones that actually live a long happy life are always turned back down to sub 800WHP and more importantly sub 600WTQ.
justbake
Well-Known Member
No one said the MKV B58 will make 1000hp soon. "Sooner than anyone thinks" being a relative statement, not to be confused with our own internal definitions of 'soon'
No one said a 1000hp B58 would be easy
No one said a 1000hp B58 would be cheap
No one said building and tuning a 1000hp B58 would be cheaper/easier/better than a building and tuning a 1000hp 2jz
Literally all that was said was, "1000whp+ capable MKVās will be around way sooner than anyone thinks."
No one said a 1000hp B58 would be easy
No one said a 1000hp B58 would be cheap
No one said building and tuning a 1000hp B58 would be cheaper/easier/better than a building and tuning a 1000hp 2jz
Literally all that was said was, "1000whp+ capable MKVās will be around way sooner than anyone thinks."
PerformanceSound
Well-Known Member
Bro, your wasting your time....there has been an influx of trolls recently on this forum that are ārepeat members.ā They are literally three of the same identities posting on a few threads. Let them think what they want, the more attention you give them, the more they will come back.
Rotaryrunner
Well-Known Member
Some people have sources inside that are sources as long as they are kept secret.
A small part of these ppl diceded to give us a bit of insight, and we should be glad to have them.
A small part of these ppl diceded to give us a bit of insight, and we should be glad to have them.
93Siro
Active Member
Actually i think it will be later than anyone thinks. These guys are not familiar with how things are with BMW engines. They are used to 2JZ, or VR38 and other hugely supported platforms. I will agree that B58 will make 400whp easier than anyone think. I can argue that it will be even the easiest. Slap on a JB4and intake and be done. 500whp? just add hybrid turbo and on meth it can be reached. On par with VR38 in terms of ease of process. 1000hp though, its a whole other ball park. You will need to learn Russian because you are gonna get to know with so many of them to get the RSA codes of the Tricore ECU unencrypted to bypass the fuel cap set in the ECU and thatās just of the many things to do. Or ask Syvecs to build a PnP standalone that can control the ZF TCU as well which hasnāt happened yet.
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