Spool and Dorch HPFP upgrades

[kern417]

The way I see it, if you're looking to stay stock trans or just in general around 600-650whp, DI will be king. It's the reason the Gen 1 is so fast so easily. Downpipe, HPFP, and turbo gets you very far.

The most unfortunate thing about gen 2 is the injector limit is so low. So you need to upgrade it for 700-750, but by then the cost of supporting mods can increase the price exponentially.

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[EddieNel]

The way I see it, if you're looking to stay stock trans or just in general around 600-650whp, DI will be king. It's the reason the Gen 1 is so fast so easily. Downpipe, HPFP, and turbo gets you very far.

Ok so if I stay with the above si

The most unfortunate thing about gen 2 is the injector limit is so low. So you need to upgrade it for 700-750, but by then the cost of supporting mods can increase the price exponentially.

The way I see it, if you're looking to stay stock trans or just in general around 600-650whp, DI will be king. It's the reason the Gen 1 is so fast so easily. Downpipe, HPFP, and turbo gets you very far.

The most unfortunate thing about gen 2 is the injector limit is so low. So you need to upgrade it for 700-750, but by then the cost of supporting mods can increase the price exponentially.

I love the idea of staying around 600 HP but then you add the flex fuel kits and you start running e85 then your having fueling issues and your at over 700 HP.

 

[Vimugsy011]

It's actually about 50HP. The stock fuel system can take you to about 600 WHP. It's the stock turbo that gives up earlier.

In my experience with my car on an E blend and hybrid turbo, it maxes out the stock fuel system at around 550. With HPFP alone they hit 650, and it looks like they are at about 750 with HPFP and injectors. Once they add the cams in they will probably be over 800. When you start going past this point most people need pistons/rods.

Either way, it is great to see 2 options in fueling, I am not sure why so many are opposed to adding a good viable alternative. Been working well on the Gen 1's and other vehicles, there are pros and cons to each of these paths it looks like.

 

[razorlab]

I am not sure why so many are opposed to adding a good viable alternative.

I think you know the answer to this. It's either chasing 8 secs and what works for that or nothing else. Anything else is "a waste of time", "doesn't work" or "add some more plastic to the plastic and it will be better than something not plastic". It's so boring to be honest, and at this point, so utterly predictable.

Meanwhile 98% of Supra owners aren't even close to that or even interested in that. Let the 2%er's be the 2%er's.

 

[kern417]

I love the idea of staying around 600 HP but then you add the flex fuel kits and you start running e85 then your having fueling issues and your at over 700 HP.

E85 is no different than any other fuel. It doesn't automatically mean you're making more power. It's all about having a good tune that's within the limits, whether it's your fuel system, turbo, transmission, etc. Full E85 and 600whp without any aux fueling or controllers to worry about sounds nice to me.

I think you know the answer to this. It's either chasing 8 secs and what works for that or nothing else. Anything else is "a waste of time", "doesn't work" or "add some more plastic to the plastic and it will be better than something not plastic". It's so boring to be honest, and at this point, so utterly predictable.

Meanwhile 98% of Supra owners aren't even close to that or even interested in that. Let the 2%er's be the 2%er's.

I feel like a lot of people's heads would explode if they knew how many people didn't run port injection. Even more how many people don't run ethanol. We're getting jaded.

 

[EddieNel]

E85 is no different than any other fuel. It doesn't automatically mean you're making more power. It's all about having a good tune that's within the limits, whether it's your fuel system, turbo, transmission, etc. Full E85 and 600whp without any aux fueling or controllers to worry about sounds nice to me.



I feel like a lot of people's heads would explode if they knew how many people didn't run port injection. Even more how many people don't run ethanol. We're getting jaded.

We don’t have any e85 where I live so my goal is 600 whp on 93. That being said I would also like the ability to run e85 and get the full benefits from it. My goal is to do a couple of the Air strip attacks (1/2 mile drag races).

 

[Thraxbert]

We don’t have any e85 where I live so my goal is 600 whp on 93. That being said I would also like the ability to run e85 and get the full benefits from it. My goal is to do a couple of the Air strip attacks (1/2 mile drag races).

You can do that right now with a turbo upgrade. 600 on 93. The only thing holding you back is the stock turbo.

 

[DarkZupra]

You can do that right now with a turbo upgrade. 600 on 93. The only thing holding you back is the stock turbo.

600 wheel on 93? without PI?

 

[EddieNel]

600 wheel on 93? without PI?

Same??? There is enough fuel to support this?? I’m not completely convinced on PI but I would imagine bigger turbo you will need bigger fueling. @Jesse DaBears @zrk

 

[Thraxbert]

The problem is that the stock turbo just cannot support efficient operation at boost PSI necessary to deliver above 525 or so. It becomes a hot air blower. The fuel system has a little left to give, and a larger turbo at lower boost levels can take the OE fuel system to 600ish without running lean.

Worst case, you add a PI plate for a bit of fuel and you've saved $1000 by not buying an HPFP. The second order problem with the HPFP is that the GDI injectors are ALSO limited to around 625, so if you want to move beyond that you're not in the business of buying new GDI injectors AND a new HPFP. That is thousands of dollars when PI would've done the same for less money.

 

[zrk]

Never in my life have I understood the obsession with beefing up the DI system. Ever.

 

[Dr. Supra]

The oem turbo with port injection makes around 520-550hp/550-650tq. So with this hpfp, will it make the same or more? Or is it even worth it with oem turbo?

 

[Thraxbert]

The oem turbo with port injection makes around 520-550hp/550-650tq. So with this hpfp, will it make the same or more? Or is it even worth it with oem turbo?

There is no benefit with the OEM turbo.

 

[Thraxbert]

Never in my life have I understood the obsession with beefing up the DI system. Ever.

I think people are easily deceived by the illusion of "plug and play," and they don't realize:

A) The fundamental Supra limitations are in the stock turbo first, HPFP and DI injectors second, LPFP third.
B) Unleashing real power through DI is not just one PnP high pressure pump. It's thousands of dollars in injectors, cams, and pumps. And it still falls short of port injection.
B) PI is not "unsafe" or "stressful" (idk how people get this idea, but seen it a lot here)
C) How much more affordable PI is per HP gained.

I'll keep repeating myself for others:

1. Stock turbo runs out of power around 525-550 WHP. The HPFP can't help you.
2. The stock fuel system runs out of juice around 600 WHP. You need a turbo upgrade regardless. A new HPFP can't help you.
3. Okay, you upgrade the LPFP to bring more fuel to the front of the car. Now your $2000 HPFP can get you to 650 WHP.
4. But now you need new DI injectors. That's another $1500-2000.
5. Now you're capable of 700 WHP. But what if you want to run E85? Now you need new cams. Thousands more dollars.

Or you could just do it right from the start with port injection and save several thousand dollars for a system that can flow up to 900 WHP on full E85. Port simply costs less and produces more power.

 

[zrk]

I think people are easily deceived by the illusion of "plug and play," and they don't realize:

.....

I've heard these arguments too, but it's never really resonated with me. You still (obviously) need to tune, a port plate or a manifold is "plug and play," too. Maybe the apprehension is the additional controller that you need? Even still- you need a tune, so what's the problem?

FWIW- I completely agree with your post (which is objectively true, so there's not really a need to agree or disagree),

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