Sponsored
tadda
Well-Known Member
Update:Anyone following this audio upgrade option by OEM Audio Plus? It's still under development...
I like that this system will also offer multi channel amp and dsp...My understanding is that with this kit our current "subs" would be used as woofers (using cutoff filter) and that an additional sub is added to the system...
OEM Audio Plus for Supra
FEATURES:
• Designed and tuned specifically for the Supra A90
• Supra-Specific Subwoofer System
• Multi-Channel Power Amplifier
• Pre-Calibrated Digital Signal Processor (64-Bit)
• Plug and Play Installation
I got a call yesterday from OEM Audio Plus letting me know there has been a delay in release date of their new system for the Supra which was originally planned for April and now looks more like late spring ...
Some other info they shared was that they have been refining the new system for the Supra over the past 4 months now and feel the OE speakers (minus the subs) are actually pretty decent and feel like they are now best utilized with the help of the new amp with dsp applied...With the new amp and dsp they also make better use of the front centers and speakers located directly behind the seats which are pretty much under utilized with the current OE system...
One thing I was slightly disappointed to hear is that they plan on deleting the OE subs all together and will use their own Subwoofer in a new location shown above...I shared with them that I thought our sub layout and controlling electronic could have been designed better and probably would be best utilized as lower mids and that perhaps they could investigate looking into providing a sharp cutoff filter to the OE woofers and use their sub as the primary sub...
I also directed them to this thread so they can get input from others....
Last edited:
30MilesOffshore
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jan 27, 2020
- Threads
- 50
- Messages
- 455
- Reaction score
- 399
- Location
- Charlotte, NC
- Car(s)
- 2020 Supra
tadda, I totally agree with your thoughts mentioned above. My reference perspective is a little different as I keep comparing it to the BMW M4. It had actually had a nice system in it for OE. My expectations was that the A90 would sound similar to the M4 but was sadly dissapointed when I first listened to it. The two audio systems are night/day difference. After tearing everything apart and running a few mock audio tests these are my conclusions:
Overall, (new amp + dsp + sub install in rear hatch + filter applied to current subs) would definitely be the way to go!
- The amp is under powered and not pushing enough to the speakers. In comparison to the M4, I rarely had to turn the volume half way to really have it cranking. With the A90 it seems like I have to run it at 3/4 volume to get the same results. It is very noticeable if you go from one vehicle to the other. One thought I had was if the amp in the M4 could possibly be switched out and installed in the A90. Another thought was a thread I found stating that the Z4 had a setting in the ECU that could be coded from a hardtop to a convertible. I feel that this setting might be coded in our system but I can't confirm this as of yet.
- It sounds like the subs are tuned to around 100Hz which is a very mushy range for subs. The M4 had more dynamic range and the bass was able to achieve lower Hz easily. Since the subs are setup on the rear deck, I was expecting better results vs the M4 as those were setup under the seats. I totally think relocated the sub to the rear hatch would definitely enhance the lower frequency range.
Overall, (new amp + dsp + sub install in rear hatch + filter applied to current subs) would definitely be the way to go!
BienLaunchEdition
Well-Known Member
- First Name
- Brandon
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2020
- Threads
- 3
- Messages
- 59
- Reaction score
- 37
- Location
- Pennsylvania
- Car(s)
- 2020 Supra, 2018 Porsche Cayenne
- Vehicle Showcase
- 1
How do I get to this screen?This what I set mine at for a natural clean sound
JasonO
Well-Known Member
- First Name
- Jason
- Joined
- Oct 30, 2019
- Threads
- 4
- Messages
- 453
- Reaction score
- 562
- Location
- Lake Charles, LA
- Car(s)
- Supra LE
IIRC, settings, System settings, tone, equalizer
tadda
Well-Known Member
How to Improve OE Subwoofer Quality and Eliminate Vibrations
I spent a fair amount of time over the past few weeks thinking about how to improve the Supra's subwoofers, which we all know by now, were not designed properly and as a result have issues when it comes to both vibrational noise and lower bass quality...
Some incremental improvements to bass response can be made by first removing the Active Sound Design (faux engine / exhaust noise) which is electrically imposed onto the bass signal when sport mode is selected ...I found that the ASD feature actually "muddies" the bass response and increases distortion and noise...
In addition, many of us have played with EQ settings in an attempt to optimize sound quality but the OE system still fell somewhat short...I also found that selecting the "surround" enhancement feature added to the phase distortion which resulted in reduced sound clarity...This is one of the first things I turned off and the system clarity was noticeably improved...
Here are my current audio settings:
Now with respect to the OE subwoofer enclosure itself this is where most of the major improvements to bass response were made... I identified a few notable areas for improvement after observing a few pics posted of the cargo area stripped down and began to get to work...It should be noted that the only panel that needs to be removed in order to make the following changes is the narrow rear subwoofer panel seen from the cargo area...
First, lining the walls of both metal sub enclosures (which are indeed separated) with 1" speaker wadding improved lower bass response and bass quality by reducing distortions created by destructive waves within the metal enclosure..The wadding also serves to increase it's "effective" volume...Speaker wadding turned out to be a very good solution for this...
Enclosure Lining / Wadding Template (below): I was actually able to roll up the speaker batting cut from a template (shown below) and slip it through one of the elongated exhaust ports and then use a long screw driver to manipulate the cut batting to line the walls of the metal enclosure shown below:
Secondly, and most importantly is that the majority of the lower bass vibrational noise and bass distortion is actually caused by the narrow rear cover panel blocking the subwoofer exhaust energy...The solution here was to 1) Insulate the area within the narrow rear panel with 2" foam leaving the exhaust port open and 2) Adding 2" exhaust ports to the narrow rear panel...
Foam Cutout Dimensions (below):
Note: I didn't need to remove the narrow rear panel mounting brackets...I actually used a 4"h length of 2" foam and cut slits into the foam such that the foam could be worked in from the top behind each of the brackets...
I also added a 2"h x3"d foam strip in the center and (2) 1"h x 1"w foam strips on either side above exhaust ports, under the top cover, to fill some voids as shown in pic below...
View attachment 25647
Installing Rear Panel Exhaust Ports...
I've also identified another area that needed to be addressed...I discovered this after implementing all these other improvements, thus allowing me to significantly increase volume along with raising bass EQ settings...What I found was that there was some exhaust port energy escaping from under the long narrow rear panel (which as I show in a few pics below) causing the rear floor panel to vibrate...Keep in mind that this is yet another design problem which causes the floor panel to vibrate where in-turn this vibrational energy is transferred to the cargo areas' side and back panels causing them to vibrate as well...
The solution here was to apply some adhesive back foam to the areas show below which eliminated any energy transfer under the rear cargo floor panel...
Shown below, I first applied 1.5"d x 4" L x 0.25" h adhesive backed foam strips above and below both exhaust ports to isolate them further from the top cover and floor....
Next, the image below shows where some exhaust energy from the 3 elongated ports was also being released under the large rear floor panel causing it to vibrate greatly...With the floor panel removed simply place your hand under the narrow panel and you'll see / feel the exposed gap ...
Shown below are the locations where 2 adhesive back foam strips were applied to underside of exposed narrow rear panel ...The left adhesive backed foam strip was 1.5"D x 11" L x 0.25" H and the right foam strip is 1.5"D x 6" L x 0.25" H...This essentially sealed off the gap where the exhaust energy was also being channeled...
As a result the large rear floor panel vibration has pretty much been eliminated and side and rear trunk panels no longer vibrate during low bass / high volume music passages....
As far as materials, I used Noico RED 315 mil Sound Insulation , which I already had available for beginning my next project of eliminating front door speaker vibrations ....
Here is yet another area that required attention for eliminating subwoofer grill rattle / vibrations...I did this awhile ago and thought it might be helpful to post while we're on this topic....
Apply small dollops of flexible silicone adhesive (red dots shown below) between grill insert plate and grill cover...
And finally, I applied some Dynamat to cargo area floor to eliminate any further vibrations and reduce road noise...
Shown below is a pic of the finished project:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is a list of materials:
2" Foam Pad
1" Speaker Wadding
2" Exhaust Port
Dynamat Extreme
Noico Adhesive Backed Foam Panels
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Summary and Final Thoughts:
Surprisingly, the Harmon Kardon 8" Subs in the Supra are actually very good speakers once you correct some very basic design issues that were overlooked by Toyota... Without ports added, the bass exhaust energy was literally trapped behind the rear panel which created quite of bit of vibrational noise and also muddied bass response...
Adding exhaust ports to the rear panel along with lining the enclosure walls with wadding and insulating the space behind the narrow rear panel, essentially lowered the Q (damping effects) and resulted in a flatter / clearer bass response...The Bass is now deeper, punchier, and far less distorted and eliminated much of the vibrational noise heard...
For anyone considering installing direct replacement subwoofers as a knee-jerk reaction to improving sound distortions, vibrations, and rattles, these basic improvements should be seriously considered before replacing them...
I spent a fair amount of time over the past few weeks thinking about how to improve the Supra's subwoofers, which we all know by now, were not designed properly and as a result have issues when it comes to both vibrational noise and lower bass quality...
Some incremental improvements to bass response can be made by first removing the Active Sound Design (faux engine / exhaust noise) which is electrically imposed onto the bass signal when sport mode is selected ...I found that the ASD feature actually "muddies" the bass response and increases distortion and noise...
In addition, many of us have played with EQ settings in an attempt to optimize sound quality but the OE system still fell somewhat short...I also found that selecting the "surround" enhancement feature added to the phase distortion which resulted in reduced sound clarity...This is one of the first things I turned off and the system clarity was noticeably improved...
Here are my current audio settings:
- ASD / Active Sound Design (off - using Bimmercode)
- Surround (off)
- Speed Volume (+4)
- Balance: (0)
- Fade: (front +2)
- Broad Bass (+2)
- Broad Treble (-2)
- Equalizer (shown below)
Now with respect to the OE subwoofer enclosure itself this is where most of the major improvements to bass response were made... I identified a few notable areas for improvement after observing a few pics posted of the cargo area stripped down and began to get to work...It should be noted that the only panel that needs to be removed in order to make the following changes is the narrow rear subwoofer panel seen from the cargo area...
First, lining the walls of both metal sub enclosures (which are indeed separated) with 1" speaker wadding improved lower bass response and bass quality by reducing distortions created by destructive waves within the metal enclosure..The wadding also serves to increase it's "effective" volume...Speaker wadding turned out to be a very good solution for this...
Enclosure Lining / Wadding Template (below): I was actually able to roll up the speaker batting cut from a template (shown below) and slip it through one of the elongated exhaust ports and then use a long screw driver to manipulate the cut batting to line the walls of the metal enclosure shown below:
Secondly, and most importantly is that the majority of the lower bass vibrational noise and bass distortion is actually caused by the narrow rear cover panel blocking the subwoofer exhaust energy...The solution here was to 1) Insulate the area within the narrow rear panel with 2" foam leaving the exhaust port open and 2) Adding 2" exhaust ports to the narrow rear panel...
Foam Cutout Dimensions (below):
Note: I didn't need to remove the narrow rear panel mounting brackets...I actually used a 4"h length of 2" foam and cut slits into the foam such that the foam could be worked in from the top behind each of the brackets...
I also added a 2"h x3"d foam strip in the center and (2) 1"h x 1"w foam strips on either side above exhaust ports, under the top cover, to fill some voids as shown in pic below...
View attachment 25647
Installing Rear Panel Exhaust Ports...
- Cover the front carpeted area of narrow rear panel to be cut with blue tape and mark a 2" diameter circle
- Use either a 2" hole saw or a dremel tool with disk to cut out the marked circle
- Use a small dremel grinding drum to finish the edges of the port hole
- Cut the black OE panel insulation in the the center of hole and fold back on either side
- Insert 2" exhaust port
- Use tie wrap to hold thin black OE panel insulation along side walls of exhaust port
- Secure port to rear panel with drops of epoxy at edges touching rear panel and port walls
I've also identified another area that needed to be addressed...I discovered this after implementing all these other improvements, thus allowing me to significantly increase volume along with raising bass EQ settings...What I found was that there was some exhaust port energy escaping from under the long narrow rear panel (which as I show in a few pics below) causing the rear floor panel to vibrate...Keep in mind that this is yet another design problem which causes the floor panel to vibrate where in-turn this vibrational energy is transferred to the cargo areas' side and back panels causing them to vibrate as well...
The solution here was to apply some adhesive back foam to the areas show below which eliminated any energy transfer under the rear cargo floor panel...
Shown below, I first applied 1.5"d x 4" L x 0.25" h adhesive backed foam strips above and below both exhaust ports to isolate them further from the top cover and floor....
Next, the image below shows where some exhaust energy from the 3 elongated ports was also being released under the large rear floor panel causing it to vibrate greatly...With the floor panel removed simply place your hand under the narrow panel and you'll see / feel the exposed gap ...
Shown below are the locations where 2 adhesive back foam strips were applied to underside of exposed narrow rear panel ...The left adhesive backed foam strip was 1.5"D x 11" L x 0.25" H and the right foam strip is 1.5"D x 6" L x 0.25" H...This essentially sealed off the gap where the exhaust energy was also being channeled...
As a result the large rear floor panel vibration has pretty much been eliminated and side and rear trunk panels no longer vibrate during low bass / high volume music passages....
As far as materials, I used Noico RED 315 mil Sound Insulation , which I already had available for beginning my next project of eliminating front door speaker vibrations ....
Here is yet another area that required attention for eliminating subwoofer grill rattle / vibrations...I did this awhile ago and thought it might be helpful to post while we're on this topic....
Apply small dollops of flexible silicone adhesive (red dots shown below) between grill insert plate and grill cover...
And finally, I applied some Dynamat to cargo area floor to eliminate any further vibrations and reduce road noise...
Shown below is a pic of the finished project:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is a list of materials:
2" Foam Pad
1" Speaker Wadding
2" Exhaust Port
Dynamat Extreme
Noico Adhesive Backed Foam Panels
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Summary and Final Thoughts:
Surprisingly, the Harmon Kardon 8" Subs in the Supra are actually very good speakers once you correct some very basic design issues that were overlooked by Toyota... Without ports added, the bass exhaust energy was literally trapped behind the rear panel which created quite of bit of vibrational noise and also muddied bass response...
Adding exhaust ports to the rear panel along with lining the enclosure walls with wadding and insulating the space behind the narrow rear panel, essentially lowered the Q (damping effects) and resulted in a flatter / clearer bass response...The Bass is now deeper, punchier, and far less distorted and eliminated much of the vibrational noise heard...
For anyone considering installing direct replacement subwoofers as a knee-jerk reaction to improving sound distortions, vibrations, and rattles, these basic improvements should be seriously considered before replacing them...
Last edited:
BienLaunchEdition
Well-Known Member
- First Name
- Brandon
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2020
- Threads
- 3
- Messages
- 59
- Reaction score
- 37
- Location
- Pennsylvania
- Car(s)
- 2020 Supra, 2018 Porsche Cayenne
- Vehicle Showcase
- 1
Great work.I spent a fair amount of time over the past few weeks thinking about how to improve the Supra's subwoofers, which we all know by now, were not designed properly and as a result have issues when it comes to both vibrational noise and lower bass quality...
Some improvement to the bass response can be made by removing the Active Sound Design (faux engine / exhaust noise) which is electrically imposed onto the bass signal when sport mode is selected ...I found that the ASD feature actually "muddies" the bass response and increases distortion and noise...
Also many of us have played with EQ settings in an attempt to optimize sound quality but the OE system still fell somewhat short...
View attachment 24428
With respect to the OE subs I saw a few areas for improvement after seeing a few pics posted of stripped down rear cargo areas and began to get to work...
View attachment 24423
1) I lined both metal sub enclosures (which are indeed separated) with 1" speaker wadding to improve lower bass response and bass quality by reducing distortions created by destructive waves within the metal enclosure..The wadding also serves to increase it's "effective" volume...Speaker wadding turned out to be a very good solution for this...
2) Most of the lower bass vibrational noise and distortion are actually due to the narrow rear cover panel which blocks most of the woofer exhaust energy and introduces most of the nasty low freq vibrations heard...The solution here was to insulate the area within the narrow rear panel with 2" foam leaving the exhaust port open and then add exhaust ports to the narrow rear panel...
View attachment 24426
View attachment 24427
I'm extremely pleased with the results...Bass response is noticeably lower and punchier and vibrational noise is gone...I can now listen to the sound system at 3/4 volume and the bass kicks ass!
Ale81
Well-Known Member
- First Name
- Will
- Joined
- Mar 12, 2017
- Threads
- 14
- Messages
- 121
- Reaction score
- 89
- Location
- Central KY
- Car(s)
- 2021 Supra 3.0 Premium, 2023 Lexus RX350
Nice annotated photos, and a workable solution. Great work and much appreciation to Tadda!
MaherSupra
Active Member
- First Name
- Maher
- Joined
- Mar 30, 2020
- Threads
- 2
- Messages
- 38
- Reaction score
- 20
- Location
- Arlington, VA
- Car(s)
- Toyota Supra
- Vehicle Showcase
- 1
Hey guys I have posted on another post but I dropped my car off at the sound car shop! It would be custom-made 10 inch sub with custom enclosure in the back and all JL audio plus an amplifier by JL audio as well. And the main part I emphasize on sound deadening almost the entire car.
The rattling And noise really annoyed me in this car to the point where I was disappointed. So I hope this will work.
MaherSupra
Active Member
- First Name
- Maher
- Joined
- Mar 30, 2020
- Threads
- 2
- Messages
- 38
- Reaction score
- 20
- Location
- Arlington, VA
- Car(s)
- Toyota Supra
- Vehicle Showcase
- 1
This it I just picked up my car and I have to say it’s the beat $4000 I have spent. Musical at it’s finest and ride like a rolls Royce good God that sound deadening really works! Highly recommended.
tadda
Well-Known Member
looks good..more details about build...did they actually build another cabinet over the existing one?This it I just picked up my car and I have to say it’s the beat $4000 I have spent. Musical at it’s finest and ride like a rolls Royce good God that sound deadening really works! Highly recommended.
MaherSupra
Active Member
- First Name
- Maher
- Joined
- Mar 30, 2020
- Threads
- 2
- Messages
- 38
- Reaction score
- 20
- Location
- Arlington, VA
- Car(s)
- Toyota Supra
- Vehicle Showcase
- 1
Yes! This is a complete subwoofer build to house the two JL10TW3 which are awesome! They removed the stock subwoofer enclosure “it’s crap anyway” The new enclosure work so well with the JL speakers they installed oh and a JL 1000vx i5 amplifier. I asked them to sound deadening the whole interior as well it’s a very setup for a nice ride now. No rattle and noise like it was before. Btw I do notice a slight weight difference when I’m driving the car.
Sponsored
