A91-MT CLUTCH GONE💀☠️😵🏴‍☠️🪦

[Cornstar12]

Makes me a bit nervous as a A91-MT owner. No issues after about 1k miles. If issue is common would think Toyota eventually does recall or does blanket policy to have covered in warranty as this is a critical car/model for their brand

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[J29DB03]

The Z folks are probably having a field day with this. And deservedly so…

 

[lucky phil]

But it doesn't take a rocket surgeon to design a clutch that will hold up to normal abuse. They've been doing it for decades. There's no way that they did so little testing as to not be able to simulate 10,000 mi for the average driver.
Not to say that the clutches that are failing haven't been abused with tons of burnouts and donuts.
Even still, I've never seen even an abused clutch where this fast.

What you don't understand is that it's not necessarily about outright abuse. There are people out there that don't even know when a clutch is slipping. The Focus RS forum has seen at least a dozen of them over the last 6 years. "Sometimes when the engine hits boost it revs up but the car doesn't seem to accelerate" what is causing this?' No really. When you drive around for a thousand miles unaware of a slipping clutch it's not actually abuse that's causing the failure it's ignorance. Another non abusive way to wreck a clutch is sitting at the lights with the clutch disengaged. Not even holding the car on a hill at the friction point but just sitting there holding the pedal down for 2 or 3 minutes. Heats up the friction plate and glazes the flywheel and pressure plate faces and also massively reduces the life of the thrust bearing. Once again not abuse just an unawareness of the mechanical realities.
Anyway I'm not commenting anymore as the subject is getting far more traction than it deserves.

Phil

 

[kaj]

What you don't understand is that it's not necessarily about outright abuse. There are people out there that don't even know when a clutch is slipping. The Focus RS forum has seen at least a dozen of them over the last 6 years. "Sometimes when the engine hits boost it revs up but the car doesn't seem to accelerate" what is causing this?' No really. When you drive around for a thousand miles unaware of a slipping clutch it's not actually abuse that's causing the failure it's ignorance. Another non abusive way to wreck a clutch is sitting at the lights with the clutch disengaged. Not even holding the car on a hill at the friction point but just sitting there holding the pedal down for 2 or 3 minutes. Heats up the friction plate and glazes the flywheel and pressure plate faces and also massively reduces the life of the thrust bearing. Once again not abuse just an unawareness of the mechanical realities.
Anyway I'm not commenting anymore as the subject is getting far more traction than it deserves.

Phil

All of what you're saying is true but beside the point.
None of the situations you describing are new. A Honda Civic has a clutch that lasts longer than this.
It's not like people all of a sudden started driving different when the Supra came out with a manual transmission.

 

[iPan]

I'm at 5200 miles on my manual Supra and I've had zero issues with the clutch whatsoever....

 

[dreadforge]

The Z folks are probably having a field day with this. And deservedly so…

Competition living rent free in your head.

 

[RenRed2]

The Z folks are probably having a field day with this. And deservedly so…

They barely have a car to buy - much less drive to find or experience issues!

 

[Sharocks]

I plan on doing track days as well. Hopefully we don't see issues but who knows. Worst case, if problems start, guess I could buy a gt350r

Don't bring the Voodoo in here, that motor while it sounds glorious is a hunk of shit and Ford was overstepping hard on that thing. Close friend popped 4 motors all under warranty, all on the track.

I think the clutch issue should be resolved via BMW. I'm pretty sure the M3/4 clutches can't be that different.

Also all this talk about Toyota changed this and that, they didn't do shit. Lift your boot up and you will see a shift lever that BMW has been using for decades. Toyota literally just designed a shift knob and bent the shift lever back a tad for a lil more "feel".

In the BMW world, especially E46 world, this is known as the 330D lever and ZHP knob mod.

It will be interesting to see what aftermarket solutions exist if this clutch issue isn't something Toyota/BMW can't figure out.

 

[6SPDA91]

Don't bring the Voodoo in here, that motor while it sounds glorious is a hunk of shit and Ford was overstepping hard on that thing. Close friend popped 4 motors all under warranty, all on the track.

I think the clutch issue should be resolved via BMW. I'm pretty sure the M3/4 clutches can't be that different.

Also all this talk about Toyota changed this and that, they didn't do shit. Lift your boot up and you will see a shift lever that BMW has been using for decades. Toyota literally just designed a shift knob and bent the shift lever back a tad for a lil more "feel".

In the BMW world, especially E46 world, this is known as the 330D lever and ZHP knob mod.

It will be interesting to see what aftermarket solutions exist if this clutch issue isn't something Toyota/BMW can't figure out.

I've heard of the issues that people ran into on the voodoo platform. I guess I like to be a glutton for punishment

Saw your signature. You either currently have or have had a pretty extensive list of nicely optioned BMW vehicles. To be honest, I'm not really worried about it. This is a first model year and we all know that these things happen on those. There will be a solution... there always is

 

[J29DB03]

Competition living rent free in your head.

Oh no, couldn’t be further from the truth.

 

[Prowl647]

I am sitting at about 2k miles. Did a spirited shift from 2nd to 3rd gear and thought I had mis shifted as the revs started going down and I was not in the 3rd. The more I think about it the more I believe this may be a symptom of this issue. No issues since and I take my time with deliberately shifting into gear.

No power mods.

Driving stick for 25 years on sports cars and this is definitely the most "unique" clutch pedal and gear shift.

 

[Awales74]

You have my sympathies. Nothing like getting a $3k bill for a car under warranty that you're still making payments for.

In a previous life, I had a car that was famous for grenading it's second gear. Mazda went through like 5 iterations of the gear box. Previous model transmissions, upgraded transmissions, even purchasing spare transmissions for track days became common.

Of course I drove that same transmission for 6 years and about 60,000 miles with no problem. And many other daily drivers had bullet proof trannies.

After many many threads a common theme started to emerge. It was most prevalent with Auto X guys (parking lot racers) that tended to drive the entire race in 2nd gear with violent steering inputs. Then of course you have to sift through all the false positives -- every transmission problem on the face of the planet is attributed to this one issue. And my favorite -- victim blaming vs. trying to find root cause. And of course Mazda wasn't really happy about replacing all the trannies so they would put up a fight at the dealership.

Good times. Sorry you guys have to go through it. For those sitting on the MT, remember the vocal minority is understandably very vocal. It's likely not every tranny, or its specific to a driving style, etc..

 

[94boosted]

You have my sympathies. Nothing like getting a $3k bill for a car under warranty that you're still making payments for.

In a previous life, I had a car that was famous for grenading it's second gear. Mazda went through like 5 iterations of the gear box. Previous model transmissions, upgraded transmissions, even purchasing spare transmissions for track days became common.

Of course I drove that same transmission for 6 years and about 60,000 miles with no problem. And many other daily drivers had bullet proof trannies.

After many many threads a common theme started to emerge. It was most prevalent with Auto X guys (parking lot racers) that tended to drive the entire race in 2nd gear with violent steering inputs. Then of course you have to sift through all the false positives -- every transmission problem on the face of the planet is attributed to this one issue. And my favorite -- victim blaming vs. trying to find root cause. And of course Mazda wasn't really happy about replacing all the trannies so they would put up a fight at the dealership.

Good times. Sorry you guys have to go through it. For those sitting on the MT, remember the vocal minority is understandably very vocal. It's likely not every tranny, or its specific to a driving style, etc..

Sounds like you had an ND1, the first iteration on the 2016 MY was really made of glass. Of the two ND's that autocrossed at our club one blew up their trans. I think they finally sorted it out by the time the ND2 came out but yah that was a poorly designed gearbox.

 

[FuzzyRev]

Because when I expressed my ideas on this to the field service tech I was very quickly made aware that any clutch modification would be an instant power train warranty killer. So sure I’ll have spent 3k to have a working clutch but if my motor pops the next day I’m out a b58… you can’t win

Since when are B58s a motor that "pops?" That's the reason I used to be an SR20 guy, and now moved to the B58. Both are extremely durable engines known to almost never blow up on their own accord.

 

[dreadforge]

Oh no, couldn’t be further from the truth.

Good!

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