Supra Manual : "A future classic " ????

[Arkaybee]

No chance. People still learn how to play guitar and piano despite the fact you can make music on your laptop. Just like those that still choose to use Film instead of digital photography.

Learning manual in the future will be something people do to connect with the past. It'll be a skill people intentionally set out to learn, just like a musical instrument or even riding a horse.

It is true there will be a small number of people with this interest. It is also true that it will be an even smaller number of cars left. Less supply than demand, price goes up.

If anything, what we've learned about previous ubiquitous skills/hobbies like musical instruments, film cameras, and horseback riding, is that they only become more expensive and more exclusive in the future. Everybody used to have a film camera and you could get your photos in 1hr at the drug store. If you want to use film now, you better be ready to invest hundreds of dollars in just the developing process. Same thing with horses; riding lessons and/or ownership is kind of an expensive thing to do.

And, as we've seen, manual transmission cars are moving toward the expensive end of the spectrum. You can't generally find a brand new base model truck or sedan with a stick anymore. So for those that are driven to buy one, they have to look at purpose built cars.

And as you've mentioned, there's also supply and demand economics to consider. As demand goes down, supply goes down. But when supply is down to near non-existence, the price skyrockets for remaining availability.

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[johnnyskids]

I don't think any Telsa has a chance of being a classic in the traditional sense, although the 1st gen roadster will probably be a collectors car given its unique construction and very limited numbers. Honestly it might already be in that territory today - I see a grand total of 2 for sale nation wide on auto trader right now, and one is priced at 180K.

I guess the cybertruck could end up being a collectors car in the far future if they decide to discontinue production of it within a few years and don't replace it with anything similar style wise. Love it or hate it, that is certainly a unique looking vehicle and I wouldn't be surprised in 20 years if there is barely any of them still around.

The problem with Tesla and being a classic is they aren't exactly easy or cheap to keep on the road long term. While there certainly is likely some nutbar out there buying one and putting it in a barn or storage to one day resell at a profit, the rest will be used as intended as a car. So unless things like batteries, tech, and EV motors get considerably cheaper, these will be scrapped well before they ever reach a "classics" age.

 

[romanLegion9574]

I think the GRC will hold its value in the future, regardless of new generations.

The manuals, probably. I don't think the autos in 2025 will retain value the same way.

 

[Evolution]

I will start this off saying that I don’t care about the resale of Supras. But I will have to say that certain colors will be more desirable than others. We had a few one and two only year colors. Some will never come on a m/t trans car. Some people target a manual trans, some are going to target a specific color.

 

[BMWAF]

That's not an issue. 20 years from now, there will still be lots of people who know how to drive manual transmission cars.

Yes and no.

I agree that there will always be some people who can and will desire a manual transmission. If you look at the trends though, production of manual transmission cars is dropping because as of today, less people desire them: One guy on this forum rejected the manual and waited for an automatic! Eventually there won't be many people left to pass down the skills and cars will continue to be more utilitarian as automation grows. And it could well be argued that the adoption of the now quaint automatic transmission began this slow process towards completely driverless cars, many years ago.

Having said all of that, there will always be a niche for manual transmission cars, and like vinyl, there may even be a resurgence from time to time, but long term, able drivers with the skill required will continue to dwindle.

There is of course, a second and larger problem: Petrol. Even if we don't run out as they keep telling us we will, petrol will eventually be phased out, be it through supply, legislation or by being taxed to the moon.

This won't happen overnight, but in a few decades, only the super rich will drive ICE cars, and a few decades after that, most of these cars will likely be autospastic.

AND.. if this foreshadows a Toyota V8 in the MKVI, well our resale value will make the Z's look like blue chip stocks. ?

 

[White Shadow]

Yes and no.

I agree that there will always be some people who can and will desire a manual transmission. If you look at the trends though, production of manual transmission cars is dropping because as of today, less people desire them: One guy on this forum rejected the manual and waited for an automatic! Eventually there won't be many people left to pass down the skills and cars will continue to be more utilitarian as automation grows. And it could well be argued that the adoption of the now quaint automatic transmission began this slow process towards completely driverless cars, many years ago.

Having said all of that, there will always be a niche for manual transmission cars, and like vinyl, there may even be a resurgence from time to time, but long term, able drivers with the skill required will continue to dwindle.

There is of course, a second and larger problem: Petrol. Even if we don't run out as they keep telling us we will, petrol will eventually be phased out, be it through supply, legislation or by being taxed to the moon.

This won't happen overnight, but in a few decades, only the super rich will drive ICE cars, and a few decades after that, most of these cars will likely be autospastic.

AND.. if this foreshadows a Toyota V8 in the MKVI, well our resale value will make the Z's look like blue chip stocks. ?

You may have missed the part about 20 years from now. 20 years isn't a long time. There's are many, many kids today who are in their 20s right now and drive manual transmission vehicles. 20 years from now, they will still be able to drive manual transmission cars. And even if manual transmission cars do eventually stop being produced (which will happen eventually), there will be lots of people who still want them, but no new production, which obviously makes the existing pool of manual transmission cars more desirable. And for what it's worth, nobody needs to pass down skills to drive a manual transmission vehicle. I learned completely on my own...I didn't need anyone to pass anything down to me.

Oh, and we aren't running out of oil in our lifetime. Probably not in our grandchildren's lifetimes. I remember back in grade school our teacher told us that the world had less then 100 years of oil remaining. We bow know that's completely false. Technology has found more ways to extract oil and there is really no issue with supply that anyone can even be concerned about.

 

[Loco38SUP]

not to argue but i can write a paragraph about this. from central to south florida, tons of kids are still in the car scene. for example, in my area, most M cars are driven by kids, not adults. 70% of a meet would be under 25, etc.


must be an area thing

--
was having this conversation the other day. unfortunately no one cares about the 99 Integra or rebuilt Rx7 that took 12 years to build anymore. a lot of cars come versatile for spirited or daily driving off the lot. "car shows" are filled with lowered car on polished wheels. that's just the sad reality of today's car culture.

car culture is alive but not as we know, or enjoyed, it

What you describe is what every state was like 15-20 years ago. Now its seems only a few areas are like that. I know here in WA State fewer younger generations are into the car community.

-RJM

 

[vlad]

If you look at the trends though, production of manual transmission cars is dropping because as of today, less people desire them: One guy on this forum rejected the manual and waited for an automatic!

You talking about me by any chance? I passed up a manual to wait for an auto. I like manuals just fine but am not religious about them. I still have a manual WRX that I’m not getting rid of, and have only owned manuals over 20+ years of driving until the Supra that I got a month ago.

I’m over shitty manuals, especially when the auto is faster. If I ever get another manual, it’ll probably be in a Honda.

 

[splv]

You talking about me by any chance? I passed up a manual to wait for an auto. I like manuals just fine but am not religious about them. I still have a manual WRX that I’m not getting rid of, and have only owned manuals over 20+ years of driving until the Supra that I got a month ago.

I’m over shitty manuals, especially when the auto is faster. If I ever get another manual, it’ll probably be in a Honda.

Sorry, bud, but the 6MT gang would like a word with you. Put down your Monster drink and e-cig, and follow @6mt and @Richard Truman. There will be no discussion of which lubricant is best or how the break-in should go, just bend over and keep quiet.

 

[Loco38SUP]

You talking about me by any chance? I passed up a manual to wait for an auto. I like manuals just fine but am not religious about them. I still have a manual WRX that I’m not getting rid of, and have only owned manuals over 20+ years of driving until the Supra that I got a month ago.

I’m over shitty manuals, especially when the auto is faster. If I ever get another manual, it’ll probably be in a Honda.

Same I’ve driven manuals for years so the hype is not there anymore. I like gapping all things manual these days with my ZF8 auto.

Even the GR Corolla was meh rowing through the gears.

-RJM

 

[BMWAF]

You talking about me by any chance?

No idea.

I’m over shitty manuals, especially when the auto is faster. If I ever get another manual, it’ll probably be in a Honda.

Of course, you're not actually faster in the automatic.. the transmission is. ?‍

 

[6mt]

Interesting ! There is a big thread on the Corvette forum about the C7 now holding better value than the C8. The front engine 7 speed manual is a car to have. The dual clutch is fun but not rewarding per that conversation. This controversy between drive trains is now more generational than car based. If I were sitting in daily traffic with any car I would have an auto. Both the C8 and Supra I would guess for the masses are not their daily drivers, so that opens the door for the manual,

The other issue is, it SUCKS to be a passenger in a manual car. Just a fact my wife hates riding in the Supra.

I started this thread with the fact the Supra will be a rare car in the future. No one is challenging that!

And yes I have a 6MT badge on my car and I had a Z51 badge and Z06 badge on cars before.

 

[vlad]

Of course, you're not actually faster in the automatic.. the transmission is. ?‍

By that logic, it’s not you steering the car, it’s the electric motor in the steering rack. Real car enthusiasts only drive cars with manual steering racks.

 

[RenRed2]

By that logic, it’s not you steering the car, it’s the electric motor in the steering rack. Real car enthusiasts only drive cars with manual steering racks.

The manual purists taliban continue to define enthusiasts in one specific way only. The rest of us exercising our free will to drive auto / PDK are not 'connected' to our cars. Its a car on auto pilot to them lol. If they want to be 'connected' to their cars they can super glue their asses to the hood and maybe feel less insecure as 'enthusiasts' lol. The idiocy of some of the manual purist taliban cannot be over-stated.
Wow you bought a Supra. It has manual. World turns. Shut up enjoy it and worry less about others who made the same choice but opted for a different gearbox. Those few manual purist taliban do a great job of polluting forums when the rest of us are just happy to share the experience of the car and maybe learn a bit more about it.

 

[BMWAF]

By that logic, it’s not you steering the car, it’s the electric motor in the steering rack. Real car enthusiasts only drive cars with manual steering racks.

I was just taking the piss but when I think about it, it's actually 100% true. The only reason why automatic drivers beat manual ones is because they have microchips doing the work for them. ?

And we can digress to absurdium if you like.. but why not go the other way: A car driven completely by AI will undoubtedly smoke all the those poor automatic drivers. Lucky they can still beat those driving manual transmissions though. ?

Both the C8 and Supra I would guess for the masses are not their daily drivers, so that opens the door for the manual,

Wut? Manual's always were and still are for daily driving. At no other epoch has "driving in traffic with a manual" been considered difficult or a chore. This is that generational softness that is rife in the world today. What a joke!

The other issue is, it SUCKS to be a passenger in a manual car. Just a fact my wife hates riding in the Supra.

Umm. This is a new one! My girlfriend likes the manual just fine. Skill issue?

The manual purists taliban continue to define enthusiasts in one specific way only. The rest of us exercising our free will to drive auto / PDK are not 'connected' to our cars. Its a car on auto pilot to them lol. If they want to be 'connected' to their cars they can super glue their asses to the hood and maybe feel less insecure as 'enthusiasts' lol. The idiocy of some of the manual purist taliban cannot be over-stated. Wow you bought a Supra. It has manual. World turns. Shut up enjoy it and worry less about others who made the same choice but opted for a different gearbox. Those few manual purist taliban do a great job of polluting forums when the rest of us are just happy to share the experience of the car and maybe learn a bit more about it.

I love how calling people names works so much better than arguing a point. And since you opened the door, if the collective noun for manual drivers is Taliban, can I put forward the term Autospastics for our much much much much super heaps mega faster automatic bretheren?

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