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TBK
Well-Known Member
- Thread starter
- #272
This would be fair if we were talking about a stock suspension Supra ....that front strut setup does go positive after ~30 mm of bump. But I’m not on stock geometry anymore.
Between LCAs, caster rods, bump steer tie rods, and full rear links, my car’s roll center and camber gain are corrected. I’m not fighting OEM camber loss or bushing flex. That’s why I can run a moderate spring rate and still have the platform control I want. The bars and 3-way damping do the rest.
So the ‘soft’ 60/140 N/mm setup makes sense. The geometry and links let me use that mechanical grip properly instead of masking geometry issues with brute stiffness.
Not talking quality, but aggression. Something like Verus would be considered top shelf. Both the verus splitter and rear wing are quite a bit more aggressive than the APR parts i have.
garudathree
Well-Known Member
you haven’t corrected camber gain. lowering the front put you at the same as stock after LCA spacers.
the gtc-300 wing has flow separation at the center with the outer span at 0 AOA.
the gtc-300 wing has flow separation at the center with the outer span at 0 AOA.
OP
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TBK
Well-Known Member
- Thread starter
- #275
ehhhhh i guess you're actually right that camber gain doesn't change meaningfully.... but then doesn't it make sense to lean on static camber + caster + bars + damping first, and only then nudging spring rate. Stiff springs are a blunt tool for a geometry problem.... use them only if the data says we need more roll resistance after the other levers are maxed
Coffee, google, and a sprinkle of neurodivergence. Certainly not 1st party data, or even any verified data. My professional self that also oversees an analytics department would frown upon that. If you're implying that i may be off....well yeah (and i've actually noticed a couple of inconsistencies actually thanks to you both), but i think the broader point i made earlier about philosophies still stands, and to that end, it's my turn to throw a question at both you....
If you were to pick up a set of Nitron R3s from Nitron themselves, the 2 standard spring rates they'll offer you are:
343/800
457/914
Both of these are significantly lower than what you guys would seem to expect. You can opt for custom rates, but Nitron themselves have these in place as fast road/track and track/race, which at the very least gives you an idea of the ranges they work with.
What are your thoughts on that?
garudathree
Well-Known Member
the fastest street legal supras run 900+ lb front rate and -4.5+ front camber. dampers are for load variation control.
garudathree
Well-Known Member
you asked one question, on what we thought of nitron’s defaults.
garudathree
Well-Known Member
It’s just marketing, same as why folks fall for verus’s pretty pictures thinking they’re good track parts. appropriately stiff suspension parts won’t sell when posers buy them and complain about stiffness.
garudathree
Well-Known Member
go ahead and listen to sales people if you want, that just means they’re good at their job. no one has won large TA events on their default package. I specced my spring rates and damping curve based on wind tunnel results, which is the other extreme.
OP
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TBK
Well-Known Member
- Thread starter
- #283
Give me some credit man, i'm not a naive enough to just listen to sales people. But the delta between what they're recommending for race cars and what you have in mind is massive. It's half.... Which brings me back to my original point of different philosophies and tuning levers.
I'll do a better job of posting data once the race capture is installed shortly.
