Race Tracking Your Supra - Information exchange

[Rocksandblues]

Thanks for the replies gents. In my mildly modded 718 GT4 on RT660's I run 2:03's at Watkins Glen in essentially TT3 trim, my hypothesis is the Supra should be able to be competitive for a lot less money (and stress). The fastest cars in TT3 at WGI are touching the 2:02's (an SS1LE and a very heavily modifed track only E92 M3) so that would be my goal. I would do MCS 2WR, cage/harness/brakes from the off so I would never be tracking the car stock.

Looking at the roll bar options, it seems only the studio RSR one looks good? I see the CMS bar (and I had one in my GT4 it was great) but that design looks suspect to me.

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[razorlab]

Yeah I'm getting the impression the Supra has a lot of potential, I followed a lot of Jackie Dings journey on his channel and was very impressed. That man can wheel. Just looking at the numbers 400hp and 3300lbs with a modern chassis should be a recipe for performance, a 718 GT4 is very similar although NA and mid engine (31000lbs and 400HP). My only concern is I really don't know the platform at all, so just trying to learn as much as I can to make a decision. Easy mode for me would just be an F8x as that is an exceptionally well developed platform at this point that I know very well, or a G87 M2 which is just starting to come alive but is more expensive and a bit of a pig.

I never had the 718 at LRP, but guys who have similar WGI times to me are in the low 0:58's.

Supra is faster than the F-chassis for sure. It's pretty easy to build a quick capable Supra at this point. Most of the modding kinks have been ironed out. Plus you have some locals to help.

 

[kyle9]

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Just to add to this, the Walker Pro Motorsport roll bar is the other one that will actually function as intended. The WPM one is a lighter "time attack style" but they're both great (and the shop owners are buddies).

 

[theQuaybee]

I have a hole in the hood (777 vent) but i went with pwr hx + rad, koyo aux + csf trans cooler on my 3.0. Wanna do wagner manifold to complete it. Baiscally this is the setup the fastest 600hp+ supras run so i just mimicked it. Have no temp problems so far but stock power. I also never solved cooling problems and 300+f oils on 2.0, so i sold it.

How do U like Nitron susp? R1 or r3? What spring rates did U go with? How are they on the road?
Im considering Nitron over Ohlins.

Well, adds to my suspicion of airflow being my main issue.

I like the Nitrons, but I'm a noob with suspension so I can't speak to them much. I went with R1's. All I know is the car feels fantastic on the track. You can adjust the dampening for the street. For spring rates, I just have the "default" setup for the Supra. Seems like if you add aero though, you'll want to step up the spring rates.

 

[FLtrackdays]

Hello track hounds, potential Supra buyer here. I have tracked BMW's and more recently GT4's for a few years. I run in NASA TT mostly and some open lapping days. I have retired my GT4 to street duty and am looking at building something else, either Supra, F8x (which I know well as I owned an M2C), or possibly a G87. I have spent a few days reading threads on here and have a few questions.

Engine - I have an M340i as my daily, love the powertrain. How does the cooling hold up? There is a lot of conflicting feedback on here. It appears the best route is to upgrade the top mount intercooler/manifold?

Suspension - Early feedback was the car had a lot of bump steer. My general philosophy for mods is change as little as possible. I would add MCS/monoballs, or is changing some of the control arms necessary?

Fueling - how bad is the fuel starve? I am mostly running NJMP/LRP/WGI

Wheels - Looks like 11 inch square 295/35/18 is the ticket?

Brakes - Again some posters seem adamant the stock brakes are fine. Pads/ Fluid/ Girodiscs enough? They seem on the smaller side.

I have a lot of other questions but i'll start with that

Yessir. The Porsche kids seem to love them down here when they migrate down from up North for 5-6 months. Here’s my take. I’ll be different, as usual

Buy one and just upgrade the pads, tire, fluid and ability to dial in some camber. Get comfortable with her 1st. Go by feel of what you’re missing. Seats probably next. She really doesn’t need a lot. At least on my semi-flat tracks down here. You might be surprised and only need to purchase a few components at a time. Unless you’re going straight to competition.

Edit: and add an exhaust and downpipe. Sounds so much better 🪩

 

[Montaver]

Yessir. The Porsche kids seem to love them down here when they migrate down from up North for 5-6 months. Here’s my take. I’ll be different, as usual

Buy one and just upgrade the pads, tire, fluid and ability to dial in some camber. Get comfortable with her 1st. Go by feel of what you’re missing. Seats probably next. She really doesn’t need a lot. At least on my semi-flat tracks down here. You might be surprised and only need to purchase a few components at a time. Unless you’re going straight to competition.

Edit: and add an exhaust and downpipe. Sounds so much better 🪩

You are exactly right, I am very much on the mod as little as possible generally. Most drivers aren't fully maximizing the stock hardware. I see a lot of drivers with big power, heavily modded cars that would benefit from some more focused coaching to get faster. Most HPDE programs, especially the big ones (PCA, BMWCCA) are focused purely on safety to the point of being overly restrictive. I think a lot of drivers are held back, and the ones that want to break free end up in TT or racing. As an example, 3-4 years ago, first time I had my 981 GT4 out at WGI I had the chief instructor of Chin jump in with me. I was still learning the mid engine balance after years in BMW's, so my confidence wasn't really there and I needed someone to properly push me. After a couple of laps he said keep it flat from T1 to bus stop. I was convinced there was no way I could go flat up the esses but did it anyway and he was right. Next session he says I will take you out, I see where you are parked I will pick you up. He rolls up in a hertz rental V8 mustang on all seasons. We proceed to go flat through the esses, in drizzle, with no problem.

 

[nibble]

You are exactly right, I am very much on the mod as little as possible generally. Most drivers aren't fully maximizing the stock hardware. I see a lot of drivers with big power, heavily modded cars that would benefit from some more focused coaching to get faster. Most HPDE programs, especially the big ones (PCA, BMWCCA) are focused purely on safety to the point of being overly restrictive. I think a lot of drivers are held back, and the ones that want to break free end up in TT or racing. As an example, 3-4 years ago, first time I had my 981 GT4 out at WGI I had the chief instructor of Chin jump in with me. I was still learning the mid engine balance after years in BMW's, so my confidence wasn't really there and I needed someone to properly push me. After a couple of laps he said keep it flat from T1 to bus stop. I was convinced there was no way I could go flat up the esses but did it anyway and he was right. Next session he says I will take you out, I see where you are parked I will pick you up. He rolls up in a hertz rental V8 mustang on all seasons. We proceed to go flat through the esses, in drizzle, with no problem.

you learn so much from right seat.

 

[razorlab]

you learn so much from right seat.

Can you learn dishonest tracks from the right seat?

 

[Islindur]

Well, adds to my suspicion of airflow being my main issue.

I like the Nitrons, but I'm a noob with suspension so I can't speak to them much. I went with R1's. All I know is the car feels fantastic on the track. You can adjust the dampening for the street. For spring rates, I just have the "default" setup for the Supra. Seems like if you add aero though, you'll want to step up the spring rates.

I dont think thicker CSF cooler is the problem. And that one is actually beneficial, coz it does lower transmission oil temps.
My 2.0 has the cleanest air possible on stock, run with no cover, still 300+ f oils after 2minutes....

Do u happen to know what stock spring rates U have? Or could check

 

[i3igpete]

All the clamping “tabs” all broke off the arm.

Seen this happen before, can’t beat the tried and true jam nut style locking.

Regarding jam-nut style rear toe arms. How are you actually adjusting the arms while installed on the supra?

The location is incredibly tight and the shop was unable to get in there while the car was on the alignment rack. we tried the usual adjustable wrench, 45-offset spanner, and even a crowfoot wrench on an extension and nothing would fit in that space.

I specifically avoided the SPL's because of the issues mentioned in this thread, but now i'm finding this dead end...

some stock reference photos (different brand, same idea).

 

[razorlab]

Regarding jam-nut style rear toe arms. How are you actually adjusting the arms while installed on the supra?

The location is incredibly tight and the shop was unable to get in there while the car was on the alignment rack. we tried the usual adjustable wrench, 45-offset spanner, and even a crowfoot wrench on an extension and nothing would fit in that space.

I specifically avoided the SPL's because of the issues mentioned in this thread, but now i'm finding this dead end...

some stock reference photos (different brand, same idea).

For the wheel side, take the two plastic aero bits off on each side and you can probably get to them. For the top side, perhaps one of those floppy wrenches? This was my concern with these types as well. Which arms are those black ones?

 

[i3igpete]

For the top side, perhaps one of those floppy wrenches? This was my concern with these types as well. Which arms are those black ones?

Those were a brand called racer x fabrication. I forgot to take photos at the alignment shop and they were the only stock photos I could find online that showed how shitty the placement of the jamnut was.

Regarding the top side, I was also thinking about trying to find a 1/4" drive crowfoot, but at that point, i'm just throwing money at a stupid design (if that size combo of 1/4"+21mm even exists).

BTW, did SPL ever mention if they updated their design after your failure?

 

[razorlab]

Those were a brand called racer x fabrication. I forgot to take photos at the alignment shop and they were the only stock photos I could find online that showed how shitty the placement of the jamnut was.

Regarding the top side, I was also thinking about trying to find a 1/4" drive crowfoot, but at that point, i'm just throwing money at a stupid design (if that size combo of 1/4"+21mm even exists).

BTW, did SPL ever mention if they updated their design after your failure?

Here is a good photo from that link that shows the plastic aero bits off. Gets you way more access to the wheel side nut.

BTW, did SPL ever mention if they updated their design after your failure?

Nope, they just sent me two new arms (I only needed one) without question.

 

[i3igpete]

Yeah the outers i'm not concerned about, it's the inner that we couldn't get from any angle. With the cover off you can KIND OF get the inner jamnut with some angled long-nose needlenose pliers, but you certainly can't get any kind of real torque on it. Unless you freeball it and leave the inner loose and only jam the outer nut.

 

[razorlab]

Yeah the outers i'm not concerned about, it's the inner that we couldn't get from any angle. With the cover off you can KIND OF get the inner jamnut with some angled long-nose needlenose pliers, but you certainly can't get any kind of real torque on it. Unless you freeball it and leave the inner loose and only jam the outer nut.

Just disconnect it every time you do an alignment. Alignments shouldn't take more than.... six hours then.

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