Auto vs Manual - Which to Buy?

[GR_Matt]

"Which transmission is best transmission" is like "Which color is best color". Like others have said, it depends on the driver. I like hearing people's rationale for their choice, but I don't feel threatened because my choice was different.

The Supra is my first AT car because there was no MT for MY22. I am continually impressed by the ZF8 and how well it matches the B58. It is fun and engaging in its own way ripping through shifts on its own. It's a different kind of fun than driving my NA Miata 5MT. I am glad others are choosing the MT to #savethemanuals I might go down that path in a couple of years if the Supra is still being produced.

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[Spart]

Look to the horizon and you will see the rapidly approaching death of fun, engaging cars. Electrification, safety gizmos, autonomous driving, dealerships, and uneducated drivers are all responsible for doing the killing.

The crop of cars we have right now with manual transmissions are the very last of a dying breed.

If you're enough of a conscious, rational being to be even asking this question in 2023, the only answer is to get the manual because time's running out on even having an option to ask questions about.

 

[johnnyskids]

Very personal choice but with so few manuals left I think the manual is just a bit more special of experience. It’ll likely depreciate less over time also. But the auto is also excellent and in many ways better (easier to drive, more fuel efficient, can handle more power), but this is a sports car and for me it’s manual or nothing.

 

[JoshuaQ]

Wasn't a tough choice for me. I bought a 2021. I didn't even consider the transmission cause I was just trying to get the deal done and I be like that, haha. But, I got in and was like OHHH SHHHH, ROFL. I didn't even pay attention. So my ALWAYS MANUAL mentality got tossed out the window. BUT absolutely no regrets. I don't think I'd even opt in for a manual at this point. If you like speed, getting the manual throws human error/reaction time for slower times. Tracking and drivers, idk, but again. No regrets, and now I'm not a manual only guy and haven't driven a manual in 2 years. Prior to this I was mr Vroom Vroom look at me shift schoolboy. That's all a manual feels like now, some wannabe racer mentality...THAT's me, not saying for everyone, haha.

But Auto is likely going to be the faster easier one, and and and, you're only losing a pedal. You basically lose the clutch and gain a sequential shifter that will allow you to blow your engine if you prefer. It doesn't auto shift for you, unless it's to 1st gear as you stop. So I look at it as I lost an annoying pedal. I have shifters and the "sequential" shifter instead of a pedal and shifter.

Downsides - I can't easily push the clutch and rev or break grip. This is the only downside for me so far. Love the car otherwise.

And either way, it's a win if you get your butt into a Supra driver seat.

 

[NocturnalEmber]

I can't seem to find the source, but I remember reading an article in the past few months that the manual cars actually performed better than they were forecasted to in comparison to the 8 speed counterparts. Not saying they performed better, but better than they were expecting them to.

Either way, for me there's no other feeling like it in the world to have that car with a third pedal. I would like to have that less rubbery feeling to the transmission and more of a mechanical feel to it, though. I imagine that is probably fixable with some shifter bushings, though.

 

[nashcarr]

I really liked the ZF8 in my 2.0. That being said, I prefer manual cars, especially in a sports car. So I sold the 2.0 and bought a 3.0 Premium MT, cant wait until it arrives!

 

[Schang105]

Well, at the time that I got mine, auto was the only option. If I had to do it all over again, I guess I would go with the manual, but that's without having test drove the manual so take my opinion with a grain of salt.

I still did want a manual car so I went with a Lotus Emira as my MT car that I can throw around in the backroads, the Supra will be for shows and the track.

How are you liking the Emira?

 

[Dannyvandelft]

I've driven 2 million miles with a manual, a real manual. 10 speed, 13 speed, 18 speed, you name it.
If the car only came in a manual, no problem. But when I buy a performance car, I want performance parts. A manual just isn't anymore. So for me the only option is the ZF. But, I shift it manually with the paddles 100% of the time. Never in auto.
The "more connected" is a bunch of nonsense. A clutch pedal doesn't add anything to the feel of the car. If it did, Ferrari's, Lamborghini's, McLaren's would still come with one, since those are the ultimate driving machines.

The auto is the best option, if you shift it manually with the pedals.

My opinion of course.

 

[FnkDrSpok]

How are you liking the Emira?

Haven’t received it yet, got my build number, now I wait.

 

[romanLegion9574]

While a manual Supra is undoubtedly fun, I feel as if the Supra's boatload of readily available torque makes it not as great a choice for a manual. At least for street driving, it's basically "keep it above 1800rpm and the car will pull". Not to mention the ZF8 in manual + sport mode is brilliant on its own.

I feel that a lower-powered car, like my GRC, is better suited for a manual. The GRC specifically has way shorter gearing, much more noticeable turbo lag, and a much more linear powerband, so what gear you're in matters a bit more, and because the gearing is short, you do get to row a bit more.

Just my 2 cents

 

[kaj]

I can't seem to find the source, but I remember reading an article in the past few months that the manual cars actually performed better than they were forecasted to in comparison to the 8 speed counterparts. Not saying they performed better, but better than they were expecting them to.

Every magazine, internet website, and Toyota resource stated the AT would be faster.

It's weird that I read how so many people want to play race car, but then they call race car parts (paddle shift) boring.
I have never thought of this car as boring. Ripping off perfect shifts is awesome.
It also seems that the common mentality is that anyone with an automatic Supra doesn't care about driver engagement. This makes no sense to me.
Or, that those with automatic supras no longer drive anything with a manual transmission.
Lots of assumptions.
From what I can tell, every single person, pretty much, on every single automotive forum on the entire internet, cares about driver interaction. Also, it seems that most of us probably have a second car with a manual transmission.
Still, I'm sure how we'll continue to hear, "your car may be faster, but I prefer the feel of being in control", as if "faster" and "control" can't coexist in an AT car.
??

 

[BMWAF]

have never thought of this car as boring. Ripping off perfect shifts is awesome.

Umm.. So you mean flicking your paddle just perfect? Give me a break. ?

 

[kaj]

Umm.. So you mean flicking your paddle just perfect? Give me a break. ?

Yep. But your response is expected. ? and exactly what I was referring to.

 

[BMWAF]

Yep. But your response is expected. ? and exactly what I was referring to.

Hahaha.. Love it.

 

[NocturnalEmber]

Every magazine, internet website, and Toyota resource stated the AT would be faster.

It's weird that I read how so many people want to play race car, but then they call race car parts (paddle shift) boring.
I have never thought of this car as boring. Ripping off perfect shifts is awesome.
It also seems that the common mentality is that anyone with an automatic Supra doesn't care about driver engagement. This makes no sense to me.
Or, that those with automatic supras no longer drive anything with a manual transmission.
Lots of assumptions.
From what I can tell, every single person, pretty much, on every single automotive forum on the entire internet, cares about driver interaction. Also, it seems that most of us probably have a second car with a manual transmission.
Still, I'm sure how we'll continue to hear, "your car may be faster, but I prefer the feel of being in control", as if "faster" and "control" can't coexist in an AT car.
??

I wouldn't go so far to use the word "every" in your post, personally. I think that may be a bit overzealous. For the life of me though I can't remember where I read it, but it did perform better than people were expecting. In my previous post I didn't say that it was faster than the ZF 8 speed, but I did say that the 6 speed manual performed better than people expected. I really wish I could remember where I read this article, it might have been this Car & Driver video:

https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a42387087/2023-toyota-gr-supra-3-0-lightning-lap-2023/

Now, that shouldn't be treated as the end all be all by any means, but it goes to show that unless you are chasing straight 1/4 mile and 0-60 times, the automatics advantage might taper off outside of those settings.

Looking at your argument, it seems that you are claiming many people are making assumptions, but I think you are making quite a few as well. I don't think people are saying auto drivers don't care about driver engagement, or that automatic drivers don't own/drive anything with a manual transmission, those are very broad generalizations.

As far as people wanting to "play race car" then "call race car parts" "boring"..I think that's entirely subjective. A lot of people do find the automatic boring. That doesn't mean its an inferior car, but I think it is significantly less fun with an automatic box. Again, that's subject to each person, and that is just my opinion.

"Faster" and "Control" can most certainly exist in an automatic car, but control is significantly less in the hands of the driver in an automatic box from a gear changing standpoint. To deny this is to deny the very definition of an automatic/dsg/pdk box; they are meant to take that control out of the drivers hands for the sake of faster shifting. You can't make the argument that it offers as much or more control, because it fundamentally doesn't by design.

Again, I'm not knocking automatic cars, but by design it takes that out of the the hands of the driver. Sure, you can flick a paddle up and down, but you can't sit here and say that the level of control over the gears is the same as with a manual box, because it just isn't by design.

The feeling of changing your own gears and working the clutch provides that raw mechanical experience between driver and car, and some people intentionally seek that out because the automatic doesn't provide what they are looking for to that extent.

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